Chopin Preludes 4&6 + friends composition

[henrah]

Here are three videos that I recorded yesterday in response to the topic 'Practise Videos' in the misc forum:

Serenade by Barnaby Southgate (school friend)

Chopin Prelude No.4

Chopin Prelude No.6 (is bigger resolution because I was testing out the quality...turned out not so good )

Comments and crits highly appreciated, and also your own interpretations (i.e. crescendos/diminuendos, more expression etc etc), I'd love to hear them!
Henrah

[el nino]

Well,in prelude no. 4 your LF is too loud I think and your RH should be softer and sing more. Be more relaxed.

[henrah]

Ok, thanks el nino! I shall definately keep that in mind the next time I play it

However, I find it hard to relax. Could you tell me what, in the video, told you that I wasn't relaxed? And methods to help me relax?
Cheers,
Henrah

[zheer]

Ok, thanks el nino! I shall definately keep that in mind the next time I play it

However, I find it hard to relax. Could you tell me what, in the video, told you that I wasn't relaxed? And methods to help me relax?
Cheers,
Henrah

   No not true, your arm, your fingers and your wrist were as they should be, and if anyone trys to change that as you play this prelude, pay no attention to them ( am sure of that ).
However i can think of other things that you can consider, but am not a piano teacher so i wont mention them to you.

   I like your bench hight. You sit low.

[henrah]

However i can think of other things that you can consider, but am not a piano teacher so i wont mention them to you.

 I like your bench hight.

No please do mention them! You've got me curious now!

Btw, why did 'I like your bench hight' come up in the quote but not in your post? Confusing....but anyway, after watching the videos I raised the height as I thought it was too low (considering the widely taught 'elbows must be at same height as hands'), and I don't think I played as well....think I'll lower it back....

[zheer]

No please do mention them! You've got me curious now!

(considering the widely taught 'elbows must be at same height as hands'), and I don't think I played as well....think I'll lower it back....

  Well you sit as low as Glen Gould, and apparently that makes playing fast octaves and chord difficult ( as you know), hence the reason why Chopin adviced his studente to sit with elbows at the same hight as hands.


     Well if you are curious,
                 
          ( 1 )   i think it is a good idea to pull the piano bench back and bring your body to the front edge of the bench, ie not sitting on the center of the bench in a lazy way, as though you are doing homework.

        ( 2 )  Its a good i dea to lengthen your upper body, not like a soldier, just more upright.


       ( 3 ) IF you want to play like Horowitz slightly, bring yout left foot back from the Knee joints and slightly bring your upper body forward into the piano keys, this way you are playing into the piano keys( keep your right foot  on the pedal). Hence some body weight, and you will look DAM COOL, ( trust me )

[henrah]

          ( 1 )   i think it is a good idea to pull the piano bench back and bring your body to the front edge of the bench, ie not sitting on the center of the bench in a lazy way, as though you are doing homework.

OK, taken into account...

        ( 2 )  Its a good i dea to lengthen your upper body, not like a soldier, just more upright.

Yeah I've been trying to do that, but I keep reverting back to hunching. I find it hard to sit in a good posture for a long time, but anytime I feel my back starting to ache I sit up properly. I never notice that I'm hunching until it's too late...

       ( 3 ) IF you want to play like Horowitz slightly, bring yout left foot back from the Knee joints and slightly bring your upper body forward into the piano keys, this way you are playing into the piano keys (keep your right foot on the pedal). Hence some body weight, and you will look DAM COOL, ( trust me )

Heh OK, I'll try that!

Cheers zheer!
Henrah

[martha argerrrrrich]

Frankly, U friend's composition is much better than Chopin Preludes or may be u play them better and bring the piece more life.  Anyway from a composers' point of view I would say most of Chopin preludes are over-rated and shouldnt even be performed. and I dont agree with anything Zheer said.....I would like to see Zheer's video(if its available in the forum point me there....)....never take a word from anybody especially pianists rather see what they do and compare it with what they say...U will be suprised!

[allthumbs]

Comments and crits highly appreciated, and also your own interpretations (i.e. crescendos/diminuendos, more expression etc etc), I'd love to hear them!
Henrah

I thought you did an admirable job on the preludes. Here is Sergio Tiempo performing Prelude No.4 in E minor.

Enjoy


Cheers

allthumbs

[zheer]

.  Anyway from a composers' point of view I would say most of Chopin preludes are over-rated and shouldnt even be performed.

   I like the fact that you think so little of Chopin's compositional abilitys, and that you diagree with eyerything i say. It is intresting haw your contribusion to this thread is very mininmal, and its even more intresting that you want to see a video of me playing the piano. If you read carefully you will notice that henrah was curious and wanted to know my thoughts on piano playing, and not i imposing my thoughts on him.
    If you could explain why it is that you dis-like the chopin prelude's and why you doubt my comments, i might take your comments seriously and not just as random words put-together with little substance and thought.
       YOUR FAILURE TO REPLY IMPLIES............

[henrah]

Anyway from a composers' point of view I would say most of Chopin preludes are over-rated and shouldnt even be performed.

What do you mean 'from a composers point of view'? Are you a composer yourself? And could you care to explain why you think Chopin's preludes are over-rated? I'd like to hear why you think that. Also why you think they should never be performed.

never take a word from anybody especially pianists rather see what they do and compare it with what they say...U will be suprised!

This I do not go by in my rules to living my life, as I have found that when I give advice to people, it certainly isn't what I do myself, but it makes me realise that I'm not doing it and helps me as well as helping them. I also go by the saying 'Do as I say, not as I do' as what people say is certainly more beneficial than watching and copying what they do.
I would also like to see a video of zheer playing, but I shall not be looking for reasons to doubt what he advises to me. I take all the advice I am given on my playing, and use any and/or as much of it as I need.

I thought you did an admirable job on the preludes. Here is Sergio Tiempo performing Prelude No.4 in E minor.

Enjoy


Cheers

allthumbs

Thankyou allthumbs, what a wonderful compliment!
Thankyou also for the Sergio Tiempo video! I hope not to offend you, or anyone else by saying this, but I don't like Tiempo's use of rubato so much. I find that he slows down then speeds up after every change in the RH, and I think he overuses it. Although I love it from the forte section to the end, that is simply marvelous playing. He is wonderful at dynamics, but I find his rubato in this piece a bit too exaggerated.

Zheer, I'm confused by your last sentence 'YOUR FAILURE TO REPLY IMPLIES.....' What does it imply?

Cheers for the comments guys, much appreciated!
Henrah

[zheer]

I would also like to see a video of zheer playing, but I shall not be looking for reasons to doubt what he advises to me. I take all the advice I am given on my playing, and use any and/or as much of it as I need.

Zheer, I'm confused by your last sentence 'YOUR FAILURE TO REPLY IMPLIES.....' What does it imply?

   Ok Henrah i will post a video of me playing the piano, and am flaterd that your are intrested in watching a vid of me. However even though i can get the vid of me playing on my computer haw can i then post this.?

   the imply, means she does not have a valid reason, do you want me to delet it.

[henrah]

No no, there's no need to delete it. I was just wondering what you meant by it.

To post a video, you can upload it to SaveFile and, once it's done uploading, it will give you a link to a page to download it from so you can simply copy and paste the link here. You can also use Rapidshare but they only allow you to download one or two every hour, and so aren't very reliable when it comes to multiple downloading. However, when you are uploading they give you progress information, and an amount of time left until it's finished, which SaveFile do not. With SaveFile you will never know when it will finish, and just have to keep checking back to the page to see if it has.

Btw, what will you be playing in this video? In fact, what pieces by what composers can you play? I'd love to also learn a piece you know/are learning so we can converse about such matters as how to play it, what the composer might have wanted etc etc. I think it would be beneficial to both of us!
Henrah

[zheer]

Btw, what will you be playing in this video? In fact, what pieces by what composers can you play? I'd love to also learn a piece you know/are learning so we can converse about such matters as how to play it, what the composer might have wanted etc etc. I think it would be beneficial to both of us!
Henrah

  Hi henrah, well if it works it will be something i have all-ready posted in a mp3 format in the audition room by beethoven + the 1st MVT of moonlight sonata.  However Savefile only do 60 MB max so i dont know if it will work, since this vid is 540 MB. Anyway its uploading so i will have to wait and see.

   Sure we can discuss composers and pieces later.

[zheer]

Sorry file is too big.

[henrah]

Wow...540mb? That's huge!! Maybe reduce the resolution to 320x240, or compress it to make it smaller...

Rapidshare allow a 100mb limit, so if you can get it under that you can upload it.

[infectedmushroom]

Hi henrah, I watched the videos of both Chopin Preludes and I think you play them good. 



I do want to give some own opinions about the way you play the No.4 Prelude. This is really a matter of taste and you play the No.4 real nice, but it didn't "touch" me if you know what I mean. Of course, your playing it in a video and the sound quality could be better, I know, but I really listen to the way you play this Prelude. I'm not gonna compare you with a proffesional pianist, but I really do like the way how Sergio Tiempo plays this Prelude (of course, he's playing on a Steinway and has a nice video recording, but I only talk about the way he plays it... Let this be clear  ). I watched Sergio's video of the No.4 Prelude many times and I heard a lot of recordings by many pianists of the No.4 Prelude, but in my eyes, nothing can beat Sergio's performance of it.


Anyway, you did a nice job and I like your piano!!

[martha argerrrrrich]

Ok, Zheer first things first...I have heard ur performance beethoven Tempest before and I enjoyed it...So i dont think bad of u or anything but I would still like to see how a pianist executes a composition than to listen him/her talk about how they performed it or how better to perform it....the real recording can speak for itself.....well this is true for any artist I chose the word pianist ofcourse its a piano forum....

Second Chopin Preludes are over-rated, musically, compositionally. I will venture in to the composition aspects in a bit...but think about this for a moment...THere is this guy I dont even know his name , henrah's friend, he wrote a great composition, technically, musically but may not surpass Chopin's other compositions (Nocturnes, mazurkas, polonaises....etc) but defnitely better than preludes in terms of its musicality but pianists wont perform it. Even all the comment here are all directed toward how he played the Chopin's mediocre Prelude as opposed to a original beautiful composition from his friend. The fundamental problem here is : Just becaus composers like Mozart, beethoven, chopin, Rach and Liszt wrote great compositions doesnt mean all their comps are great...they are churned out mediocre compositions as well, just like every artist....and its up to a great performance artist to boldly decide which ones are truly the best....

Alkan wrote far more superb songs than Liszt, schumann put together....but look what happened , pianists would rather perform Chopin's prelude than Alkans Grand Sonata or
Chpoins Etude for 1000th Millionth time than venture in to something new and beautiful.....Now compositionally I would say how Chopin is mediocre in most of his preludes shortly.....

[infectedmushroom]

I just listened to your friends composition and I think it's great, very nice composition! 

[zheer]

Am sorry Martha, but when you think about the fact that chopins prelude in E minor was written almost 200 years ago and that henrahs friends composition was written recently ( though its promising ) it hardly reaches the hights that chopin reached. Chopins music is so distinct and so important as far as it shaped haw composers after him wrote music, that you can not look down on them, but can only say that you personally dont like them.

[martha argerrrrrich]

No...You dont have to be Sorry Zheer...its ok to be wrong!
Well,  Chopin did influence the composers that came after him in a big way, he changed the the perspective of Piano Playing too...but thats not my point, I am not comparing Chopin and Henrah's friend ...look at my earlier posts, but Chopin prelude in Eminor and Henrah friend composition is my comparison here. and I dont think Chopin prelude did anything to influence anybody....much less Liszt or Rach or any future composer for that matter....
His prelude no matter which beautiful or delusional prism u use to look at is still mediocre at  its best....
Also some of what u said is exactly whats my point...Ok , So he did influence a buncha composers after his time ...so what, get over it, its almost 200 years and no new innovations have happened because of this kinda blind-sidedness....Chopin used Cheap melancholy and setimentalism in substitute for real art....Some how Artistry is mistaken to be sad, melancholic and sentimental music....

[steve jones]

I liked both preludes, well done mate!

If I could suggest anything, maybe a little more rubato and dynamic on No4? Its my belief that this prelude is all about expression.

Prelude 6 may be a tiny bit quick?

Nice job!

Steve Jones

[zheer]

which beautiful or delusional prism u use to look at is still mediocre at  its best....

 I would like to continue this discussion with you, but i have to go and cut my finger nail's. 

[allthumbs]

Thank you allthumbs, what a wonderful compliment!

You are welcome!

Thankyou also for the Sergio Tiempo video! I hope not to offend you, or anyone else by saying this, but I don't like Tiempo's use of rubato so much. I find that he slows down then speeds up after every change in the RH, and I think he overuses it. Although I love it from the forte section to the end, that is simply marvelous playing. He is wonderful at dynamics, but I find his rubato in this piece a bit too exaggerated.

No offence taken, I agree with you that he over uses the rubato to the point of playing the piece rather unevenly. I included this video, as I too enjoyed his dynamics and the way he played the last three chords especially.


Cheers

allthumbs

[instromp]

Hey Henrah.

I really liked your friends composition,very nice.Can you possibly get the sheetmusic or PDF for it i liked so much i want to learn it .How long have you been playing? You have good "piano fingers" i believe,since mine are short and stubby,ugh, which i dred 

On Prelude4 the the LH seems like it is drowning out the RH,maybe you could be me softer when playing the LH,just a suggestion,well since it was told to me . I liked the way you did the crescendo/forte on Prelude 6.You have a nice "touch" on piano.Great Job by the way.

[steve jones]

You are welcome!

No offence taken, I agree with you that he over uses the rubato to the point of playing the piece rather unevenly. I included this video, as I too enjoyed his dynamics and the way he played the last three chords especially.


Cheers

allthumbs

I agree totally on his use of rubato. There comes a point where it ceases to be a mechanism of expression and simply becomes untidy!

Then again, this piece is horrible when played mechanical, so some kind of happy medium is require, imo at least.

[allthumbs]

Then again, this piece is horrible when played mechanical, so some kind of happy medium is require, imo at least.

I think you hit the nail right on the head!

[steve jones]

One does ones best 

Shame I cant play for toffee...

[henrah]

Hi henrah, I watched the videos of both Chopin Preludes and I think you play them good.



I do want to give some own opinions about the way you play the No.4 Prelude. This is really a matter of taste and you play the No.4 real nice, but it didn't "touch" me if you know what I mean. Of course, your playing it in a video and the sound quality could be better, I know, but I really listen to the way you play this Prelude. I'm not gonna compare you with a proffesional pianist, but I really do like the way how Sergio Tiempo plays this Prelude (of course, he's playing on a Steinway and has a nice video recording, but I only talk about the way he plays it... Let this be clear ). I watched Sergio's video of the No.4 Prelude many times and I heard a lot of recordings by many pianists of the No.4 Prelude, but in my eyes, nothing can beat Sergio's performance of it.


Anyway, you did a nice job and I like your piano!!

Cheers infected mushroom!

I know what you mean about it not 'touching' you, I realise that you can't touch everyone with a single interpretation. There will always be some that it doesn't, but thankyou even so for commenting!