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Topic: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18  (Read 14240 times)

Offline rachfan

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Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
on: June 18, 2006, 07:51:55 PM
One of Schumann's best-loved character pieces.

Update: I deleted the CD cut (43 downloads) and replaced it with the original tape recording for better fidelity.
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Offline rachfan

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #1 on: November 13, 2007, 01:58:07 AM
Schumann's "Arabesque'' is a poetic piece in rondo form with two contrasting episodes.  The reflective and beautiful coda is altogether different material though.  In thinking about great performances, I believe that when Horszowski played this piece (although better remembered for his Bach, Mozart and Beethoven interpretations), this Arabesque was magic under his hands.

Comments welcome! 
Interpreting music means exploring the promise of the potential of possibilities.

Offline daniloperusina

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #2 on: November 13, 2007, 12:34:18 PM
You play it well, but your interpretation doesn't convince me. I think it comes off best if it's played in a much more 'light-hearted' way. First episode I find way too slow and indulgent and would have liked it to flow much more. Second episode is better, but I feel it becomes too fragmented with an overuse of ritardandi. The coda is the most beautifully played, slightly too slow perhaps. The pauses between the sections are also slightly overdone, imo. All in all, you play with emotion, but more important than that is to apply the right emotion to the right music, and not always to play 'molto espressivo' when the music doesn't call for it. Hope I don't come off as over-critical, and thanks for sharing!


Are you going to have your piano tuned any time soon? :)

Offline rachfan

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #3 on: November 13, 2007, 06:09:14 PM
Hi danil,

Thanks for the comments.  I disagree and stand by my interpretation, but it's always interesting to hear contrary perspectives and always consider them, even the highly critical ones.  I would have been disappointed had you not commented again on the tuning though, as you always do.  :D

On the 1984 Baldwin L, you probably missed the status of the piano that I posted on the forum (see the Bortkiewicz Impromptu posting on page 2).  Last April it was rebuilt--Ronsen Wurzen hammers with new shanks and flanges, Arledge Bass Strings, Mapes International Gold wire on the treble bridge.  As part of all that, the new tuning pins were upped by one size, as is customary, so they're very snug now and I already notice the piano holds its tune now as well as when it was new.  Tuning stability has pretty much returned over the past few months, as the new strings have fully stretched out.  This summer we also installed centralized A/C which neutralizes the wide humidity fluctuations in the central Maine summers, and which helped the piano a lot.  I do need to get another tuning though, probably in December, and in the meantime I have a few regulation issues I'll have addressed at the tuning.  The Arabesque was recorded PRIOR to the piano rebuilding and A/C installation.  I may record another piece before the next tuning--so brace yourself.   :)

Thanks for your observations!
Interpreting music means exploring the promise of the potential of possibilities.

Offline daniloperusina

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #4 on: November 13, 2007, 06:58:34 PM
That's great! And when your first in-tune recording comes, I'll be here to salute it! :)

Offline rachfan

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #5 on: November 13, 2007, 07:53:00 PM
I'll mention in the posting when a recording is done after the tuning, so yes, If you don't notice the difference, I'll be pretty disappointed!   :D
Interpreting music means exploring the promise of the potential of possibilities.

Offline schubertiad

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #6 on: November 14, 2007, 05:49:02 PM
You are able to get an awful lot of repertoire up to performable standard!
That said, I have to agree with daniloperusina about this particular recording. It goes without saying that all the notes are there, but to me it sounds wrong. The main episode should have a light, etherial, rippling feel, which you destroyed by playing the acciacaturas so jerkily. Instead of playing every single note following these grace notes with an accent, i would suggest blending them into the melody, making the line as long and smooth as possible.
The second section seems to drag its feet a bit too much, although it might be that i'm just used to hearing it faster. I liked the third section - like the coda, you give it a very good 'timeless' feel.
Anyway, just a few thoughts on one of my favourite pieces.
“To achieve great things, two things are needed; a plan, and not quite enough time.” Leonard Bernstein

Offline rachfan

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #7 on: November 14, 2007, 09:06:35 PM
Hi schubertiad,

Thanks for listening to my rendition!  And I appreciate your comment on my repertoire.  To be honest, my repertoire is expansive and advanced in some areas, but lacking in one or both respects in others.  There are composers important to me whose works I haven't even played yet!  (But I guess many pianists would say that.)  I think a big reason in my case is that during 1972-1983 I did almost nothing with piano due to being preoccupied with work, finishing an MBA, and and parenting young children with my wife.  Then there was another hiatus in the mid-90s when I was completing the doctor of business administration degree (DBA).  So now I always feel way "behind the curve" on my repertoire, despite compliments I've received on it here at PianoStreet.  I am catching up as time goes on though.  But the older I get, I realize there is so much repertoire I want to do and so little time to do it all.

Well, the verdict on my Arabesque by both you and Danilo are the same and confirming, and I really do want to be receptive and open-minded to criticism.  So I'll make some notes in the score today on both the execution and tempo issues.  Then if I go back to revive the piece, I'll see if I can improve those aspects.

Thanks again!     

Interpreting music means exploring the promise of the potential of possibilities.

Offline gerry

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #8 on: November 14, 2007, 11:27:59 PM
Sensitive playing in parts but consider the following:

The overall phrasing is marred by your accent and emphasis on the appogiaturas - those should be softer while aiming at the short phrase that begins in meas 1 and pushes toward the F in meas 5 - try just playing it without the grace note and then add it back in as a gentle turn, i.e. gbA rather than g-Ba (I wish I could vocalize what I mean). As it is, you tend to chop the line into measure by measure segments rather than looking for the longer phrase - try just playing the melodies alone and see where they're going (meas 1-5, 5-9, 9-13, 13-17, overall 1-17, and so on.

Also, you are completely ignoring the wonderful bass countermelody that Schumann wrote into this piece. Starting at meas 1 the D C, D C, G F E D and so on is a wonderful counterpart going down as the right-hand melody climbs.  Try playing both alone, legato together and you'll see. This may require you to work on the ability to do the crab-like legato in with fingers 3-4-5 in both hands but it's necessary to the legato linear aspect worth the effort. This will help you see that all the rest of the interior notes are just harmonic structure and not as important.
Your ritardandos are too overdone and have the effect of stopping the momentum of the piece (also I think you slipped a few in without Schumann's permission). The tempo of the closing section is just a few beats too slow - sort of puts one to sleep rather than providing a reflective closing - Schumann indicated 58/half note, but in any case piu lento not molto lento.

One of the challenges of this piece is that since the opening theme is repeated 3 times, it helps to put a slightly subtle twist on it each time rather than offering literal repeats  - maybe presenting it a little less boldly each time so that the final offering is a lighter, whispier remeniscence of the original.  It is left up to the performer to achieve this.


Schumann is so devilishly difficult in that much of what he wrote looks easier on the surface than it really is - with inner voices, rising and descending melodies that trade off between the hands, etc. His works often present much more of a challenge than they appear to. I think you've got guts to put yourself "out there" for criticism and I trust you have the ability to synthesize it all for what it's worth. Good luck.
Durch alle Töne tönet
Im bunten Erdentraum
Ein leiser Ton gezogen
Für den, der heimlich lauschet.

Offline rachfan

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #9 on: November 15, 2007, 02:50:09 AM
Hi gerry,

Yes, everyone has remarked on the appogiaturas, so I've notated the score on that account.  I especially appreciate the practical solution that you outlined. 

On the LH counterpoint: I just listened to the first couple of minutes of the recording and can hear it quite well.  But I never considered it to be a counter "melody", but rather a moving line of harmonic tones.  In that context I wanted them to be heard certainly to add richness, but not to be so prominent as to actually compete with the RH melodic line, thereby emerging from the background fully into into the foreground.  So while I allowed the harmonic line to be heard (at least I can hear it, hence it's not exactly buried), I opted to maintain proper balance between the hands.  Where I do agree with you is that I could have done a better job, not giving the harmonic tones additional ommmph, but instead suppressing the superfluous filler material.  There are three levels of sound there--melody, counterpoint harmonic lines, and filler material.

I guess the effectiveness of my playing of the coda is in the eye of the beholder, or in this case the ear of the listener.  I tried to make my playing there quietly poetic and a nice contrast to the prior more energetic episodes.  It is marked lento (langsam) with the mood being espressivo molto.  I think that to play that in cut time of a half note equaling mm 58 will surely kill the spell.  I used a Schirmer edition rather than an urtext, so am unsure whether or not the metronome marking is even Schumann's.  Do you know for sure it's his?  Plus in that era when composers experimented with metronome markings, they were sometimes notoriously off base, and when later playing some of their own works, studiously ignored their own markings. For that reason, I like to exercise my own judgment.  schubertiad seemed to like it and daniloperusina thought it might be slightly too slow.  I might be willing uptick it very slightly, but not by much.

I very much agree with you on the need to treat each reprise of Episode I somehow differently from before.  matterintospirit had mentioned that point to me as well.  Your suggestion of letting it fade away a bit more each time is a good one.  If I revive this piece in the future, I'll experiment with it.

Finally, I agree on the interruptiveness of the ritardandos.  Sorry about that.

Thanks again for listening and offering your inputs.

Interpreting music means exploring the promise of the potential of possibilities.

Offline thalberg

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #10 on: November 15, 2007, 04:25:52 AM


Are you going to have your piano tuned any time soon? :)

I second that. ;D

Nevertheless, you're a good pianist rachfan! 

Offline rachfan

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Re: Schumann, Arabesque, Op. 18
Reply #11 on: November 15, 2007, 04:50:47 AM
Hi Thalberg,

Yes, ha-ha, I will get the piano tuned in the foreseeable future.  But not until I have tortured poor daniloperusina's ears at least once more.  ;D  Man, after the new strings went on, it had to be tuned three times over as many months until the strings stretched around the tuning pins, hitch pins, and bridge posts.  Plus I was touching up the tuning myself between tuner visits.  Now, seven months later, and with the larger size tuning pins, it's tight as a drum in that pinblock (in fact, I shattered the head of a tuning lever trying to turn one of the pins), and the piano really holds its tune well now.  I might record Poulenc's "Melancolie" and post it here fairly soon.  The tuning will be at least acceptable if not perfect for the event.

Thanks for the compliment on my playing--you don't know how much I really appreciate that!  Sometimes when I post a piece, many read and download it... and say nothing.  I can't tell if they loved or hated it.  This Arabesque is getting plenty of traffic and opinions though.  It's just a good thing that I have a hide as thick as a rhinoceros.  :)  I'm having so much fun with this one that I can't resist putting up the companion piece,  Blumenstuke, soon too, which will probably draw fire as well.  But that's OK.  Quite honestly the Germanic literature has never been my forte.  I spend much more time with Russian and French music.  But as part of trying to be a "well rounded pianist" I post this Germanic repertoire to be a good sport--despite the controversy.  ;D  I must say in all seriousness though that I have gotten some good suggestions from it.   
Interpreting music means exploring the promise of the potential of possibilities.
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