Beethoven Symphonies - Which one would you play?

[dnephi]

As many of you know, the Beethoven-Liszt Symphonies stand as arguably the greatest work of transcription ever completed.

Horowitz said that they were "the greatest piano pieces ever written." 

Now, if you were to play one, and only one- which one would it be?

Things to consider:

1. Length - How long will it take to perform/learn?
2. Difficulty - How much work & for how long would you need to work?
3. Suitability- How effectively is the music conveyed through the keyboard?

I look forward to hearing your responses.

[soliloquy]

Pastoral.

[mcgillcomposer]

As many of you know, the Beethoven-Liszt Symphonies stand as arguably the greatest work of transcription ever completed.

Horowitz said that they were "the greatest piano pieces ever written." 

Now, if you were to play one, and only one- which one would it be?

Things to consider:

1. Length - How long will it take to perform/learn?
2. Difficulty - How much work & for how long would you need to work?
3. Suitability- How effectively is the music conveyed through the keyboard?

I look forward to hearing your responses.

No. 2 - It is of moderate difficulty and length, probably performable in 1.5 months or so. There is some really nice counterpoint that is conveyed clearly and effectively through the keyboard. Also, the sound isn't as 'big' as some of the other symphonies (1, 3, 5, 9)  and, as such, is more easily conveyed on the keyboard. The 5th symphony often comes across as banging on the piano - even by a good pianist - the chords are so richly voiced...really more orchestrally than pianistically. It also has a rather bright key which complements its energetic character.

[thalbergmad]

Definately the 6th.

Thal

[richard black]

arguably the greatest work of transcription ever completed.

I would suggest that that title belongs to Karl Klindworth's transcription of Wagner's 'Ring'.

[dnephi]

I would suggest that that title belongs to Karl Klindworth's transcription of Wagner's 'Ring'.

I would contest that the quality of Klindworth's transcriptions does not approach that of Liszt's transcriptions.

[richard black]

I would contest that the quality of Klindworth's transcriptions does not approach that of Liszt's transcriptions.

They were of course intended as working scores rather than concert transcriptions, but if you have the originals of the Ring (not the simplified versions issued in about 1899) they are damn fine bits of piano writing.

[furtwaengler]

It's just my opinion that the Liszt-Beethoven Symphonies are very unpianistic...easily the most unpianistic thing he realized. I've often times played around with the 7th and it has reaped musical awards, but the scherzo and finale are quite imposing for these pianistic short comings.

I'd love to do the 3rd, but...here I may make my own transcription, for in Liszt's writing, as in many of the others, the Symphony simply does not translate well to the piano.

In a local second hand shop, I had seen for a number of months, a sealed copy of Katsaris's recordings of all the Symphonies for a very reasonable price. Every time I went in I thought of buying it, but instead walked out with other material. It has finally been purchased by someone else, but I do not find my procrastination troubling, even as I'm sure Katsaris would easily eclipse any other set...Why would I listen to Beethoven's Symphonies on the piano when I have recordings of Furtwänlger, Scherchen, Szell, Klemperer, Weingartner, Mengalberg, Asahina, Abravanel, Krips, Munch, Monteux, Kleiber, Koussevitzky, and others conducting fine orchestras in perfomances of far more expressive power? I use the Liszt transcriptions as a means for my own private access into this world without currently being a conductor and having access to an orchestra, and there is their merit.

I will be seeing Frederic Chiu perform the Beethoven-Liszt 5th Symphony in concert in a few days.

[dnephi]

I have heard a phenomenal recording of the fifth symphony performed by Joseph Villa, so I am at least sure it can sound the way it should.  I haven't even tried my hand on any of them, so I don't know how pianistic it is.  I had, rather, assumed that it was very pianistic, given the fact that it was Liszt transcribing it.


Katsaris' recordings are not very effective, in my opinion.  I do not recommend them.

[thalbergmad]

It's just my opinion that the Liszt-Beethoven Symphonies are very unpianistic...easily the most unpianistic thing he realized.

You heard the Bach/Liszt  Fantasy and Fugue?

Thal

[cygnusdei]

I find the Berlioz-Liszt transcription of Symphonie Fantastique surprisingly very pianistic. But I digress ....

For Beethoven-Liszt, I'd do the Ninth. Length is not an issue - who the hell would perform the entire work in public unless he/she is a pro? In which case you can get away with anything in your program anyway. I'd love to dabble in the first movement when I get a chance.

I have the Katsaris set, and he puts Gould and Badura-Skoda to shame in the Fifth.

[opus57]

I'm definitely not a pro, but I looked once at the symphonies (not with the intent to play them bt I looked at them) and I had the impression, that the fifth is the most suitable for piano... but: I'm a beginner.

[liszt1022]

I'm a nut for Beethoven symphonies on piano. I have all the Liszt arrangements in the Dover books and all the Singer arrangements in the Schirmer books. CD-wise I have Gould's 5 and 6, all of Howard's, all of Katsaris, and all of Scherbakov. I have different favorites for different ones, but Scherbakov's 6th is the best of all of them.
Personally I'd want to play the 6th since I think it translates best, but I think I'd have to trim Liszt's writing a little, sometimes it's too dense for its own good.

[mcgillcomposer]

I know that the Beethoven-Liszt symphonies are difficult, but I think it's going too far to call them 'unpianistic'. In fact, I think his solutions are incredibly idiomatic for the piano. Of course, due to the sheer range of an orchestra, some of the leaps and stretches are very wide - but either a large hand or proper use of the pedal can remedy this small problem.

[soliloquy]

I know that the Beethoven-Liszt symphonies are difficult, but I think it's going too far to call them 'unpianistic'. In fact, I think his solutions are incredibly idiomatic for the piano. Of course, due to the sheer range of an orchestra, some of the leaps and stretches are very wide - but either a large hand or proper use of the pedal can remedy this small problem.

They are unpianistic in the same way that Schumann's music is unpianistic.  They are technically clumsy, dense and chord patterns do not lie easily beneath the hands.


Either way No. 6 is my favorite.

[mcgillcomposer]

They are unpianistic in the same way that Schumann's music is unpianistic.  They are technically clumsy, dense and chord patterns do not lie easily beneath the hands.


Either way No. 6 is my favorite.

I bet Liszt didn't find them technically clumsy - he probably ripped them off like lightning - but I guess we aren't all Franz Liszt's lol...alas...

[pianistimo]

i have the 'andante' of beethoven's symphony #5 in my new (old) symphonic organ works book.  i found it at an antique bookstore.  the beethoven sketchbooks (edited by m.g. nottebohm) seem to have everything there that one needs for this andante at least.  *am wondering about the rest.  i guess if liszt did all the work that he did - there's not a lot of need to set out to do this from scratch again. 

symphonic works in duet form could prove more 'flowing.'  a lot of these seem sorta 'chunk chunk.'  btw, they sound really great on the organ if played by one person.  more effects available. 

[justinjalandoni]

Symphony No.7. It's my favorite

[piano_ant]

I love no. 6, but I bet the seventh would be the best one to play. I love the seventh so much, it would be so rewarding to play it. Even the third is cool, but the ninth seems like it would be too difficult to even enjoy playing....

[general disarray]

I've done the four-hand version (one piano) but my ancient score doesn't even indicate the transcriber.  Could it be Liszt?

Well, I've done Five, Six, Seven and last movt of the Ninth.

You gotta be high to play these babies, though.

Fun!