Pathetique

[sarah the pianist]

Hi I love the Pathetique sonata, Beethoven and I would like to see if you do

[dora96]

I love the Pathetique. I am going to be examen soon. I find that it is hard to play in a upright piano. I play all three movement in Yamaha grand piano. It sounds so great, the effect like 3D surround sound, but the upright piano, every time, my right hand cross over always hit the piano lid, it is driven me mad. Another thing the speed, when my hand get tired, and I will speed up faster and faster. The second movement is glory . The third movement is delicate and passionate but the triplets always give me grief. It is so hard not to speed up again. It seems like Beethoven knows how to drive people mad don't you agree. I just don't understand that I listen many versions of recording this piece. It seems that most pianists play it madly fast. Can someone recommend like recording please?

[slobone]

Dora, Jim Svejta did a show recently comparing recordings, and he convinced me that Gilels is the best. But I don't know if it's still available...

[dora96]

quote author=slobone link=topic=29260.msg337756#msg337756 date=1207203308]
Dora, Jim Svejta did a show recently comparing recordings, and he convinced me that Gilels is the best. But I don't know if it's still available...

I have Gilels recording borrowing from the library. It is great thanks. Some recordings in the 3rd movement, some pianists add the extra ornaments in the beginning. However, in all my books, there is no such things.  Is there anyone that has the book with extra ornaments. Can someone show me the extra ornaments addition please?. I am very curious. This recording from Wilhelm Kempff
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=wld-y8Pdsmg&feature=related

[pianochick93]

Someone on here, I forget who, showed me a very good recording of this on Youtube...

It is broken up into 3 sections

First part of the First movement:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Syw080gfY0

First movement starting from the part with the laft-hand tremolos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvyLyUBMpbs

Second and Third movements
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVKOGqdLNjA

[dora96]

Thank you pianochick,

The recording is truly owesome. I have seen only the 1 st movement. Thank you that you remind me for this recording. Do you know who is she? Is she concert pianist, or piano teacher performing ?

[pianochick93]

It is awesome.

From what the person said (I'm sorry, for the life of me I can't remember their name) the performer was their teacher and also a concert pianist.

[jehangircama]

tell me, how do you play the opening chord fp? does anyone attempt it? or do you just play forte?

[thierry13]

tell me, how do you play the opening chord fp? does anyone attempt it? or do you just play forte?

What kind of joke is that.

[pianochick93]

tell me, how do you play the opening chord fp? does anyone attempt it? or do you just play forte?

. . .

[shortyshort]

tell me, how do you play the opening chord fp? does anyone attempt it? or do you just play forte?

http://www.dolmetsch.com/defsf3.htm

[slobone]

tell me, how do you play the opening chord fp? does anyone attempt it? or do you just play forte?

Obviously you can't control the dyamics after you've already played the chord. The explanation I read is that Beethoven wants you to wait until the sound fades to piano before playing the next chord. This would take too long on a modern piano, but was more reasonable on the pianos of his day. Malcolm Bilson uses this as an example of why the early Beethoven sonatas should be played on a fortepiano.

[jehangircama]

thanks. I believe Fischer once managed to get the effect in a recording by doing something funny with the pedal, but I haven't heard it.

[ramseytheii]

Although it's little in use these days, there is a technique for playing forte-piano on the modern piano.  It's this: play the chord with a forte accent, then immediately allow the keys to rise half-way (to the point of double-escapement but not above); then push them back down. 

If executed correctly, the chord won't be articulated twice, but the sound will diminish by about 50%.

Walter Ramsey

[jehangircama]

ramseytheii, i tried that technique but couldn't get it to work. does it work on uprights , or do you need the action of a grand?

[guidofellini]

Hi everyone.

I have a couple of problems at the crossing hands sections. Which fingering would you advise for the modents ?

Also, everytime I play this passage, I feel a pain in my left hand. I don't know why. Maybe I do some wrong movements or wrong fingering.

Thanks in advance.

[classical88]

The technique that Mr. Ramsey writes of does work.  I have both used it myself and in teaching in this sonata and also for the fp notes in opus 28.  It does take practice and the ability to quickly adjust to new instruments.  Its use seems consistent with Beethoven's probable intentions, since he uses forte and fortissimo elsewhere very clearly for individual notes.

I do not believe that it is possible to do this with any consistency on an upright piano, although i don't practice on one so I cannot say for sure.

[thierry13]

ramseytheii, i tried that technique but couldn't get it to work. does it work on uprights , or do you need the action of a grand?

Uprights won't work with this technique, because they do not have double escapement.

[pianorin]

when i play the drumroll my left arm will become tensed up. i just cant relax.. because of this problem i gave up playing pathetique but i really love this sonata. anyone knows how to solve this problem?