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Author Topic: Opus Clavicembalisticum  (Read 13361 times)
jpowell
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« Reply #150 on: November 02, 2004, 07:07:37 PM »

To anyone still interested in the subject of Opus Clavicembalisticum by Sorabji, I can offer the following: I have performed the work on three occasions, after having made a revision of the error-ridden published score by a careful comparison of a copy of the ms with the composer's 'working copy', a copy of the published score onto which KSS made various emendations in the early 1930s.

I must stress that I would advise no-one to judge the merits (whatever they may be ...) of the piece on the strength of the two available recordings, simply because they are both hugely inaccurate. I strove to learn all the notes, and in my humble opinion, the piece doesn't sound random and ridiculous (which it does on those recordings) when played pretty accurately and with decent phrasing, pedalling, sense of proportion etc.

By the way, it took about 4 months to learn the piece (although I was doing some other things at the time for some of that period) initially; before a NY performance this year I did another 4 weeks' work, approximately. I have been asked to play the piece next year in Finland and will probably have to some more repair work before then as well.

The piece of which one page appeared during the course of the discussion is a sonata KSS wrote in 1917, and it is not all that comparable with OC. A far better piece is the 4th Sonata, written in 1929, and of which you can buy a CD from Amazon (I think) and a decent typeset score from Alistair Hinton at the Sorabji Archive.
Best wishes
Jonathan Powell
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Op. 1 No. 2
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« Reply #151 on: November 02, 2004, 07:20:12 PM »

To anyone still interested in the subject of Opus Clavicembalisticum by Sorabji, I can offer the following: I have performed the work on three occasions, after having made a revision of the error-ridden published score by a careful comparison of a copy of the ms with the composer's 'working copy', a copy of the published score onto which KSS made various emendations in the early 1930s.

I must stress that I would advise no-one to judge the merits (whatever they may be ...) of the piece on the strength of the two available recordings, simply because they are both hugely inaccurate. I strove to learn all the notes, and in my humble opinion, the piece doesn't sound random and ridiculous (which it does on those recordings) when played pretty accurately and with decent phrasing, pedalling, sense of proportion etc.


So, the recordings by Ogdon and Madge aren't what Opus Clavicembalisticum is really supposed to be? Assuming you play a version that's more accurate than theirs, are there maybe recordings available of your preformances? If this is the case, I'd be very interested in hearing them.
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luda888
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« Reply #152 on: November 02, 2004, 10:04:01 PM »

You don't give up, do you?

I put up a download for the recording. The sheet music? Why don't you buy it? Well THERE'S a concept! Maybe if you would stop masturbating and actually WORK a bit, maybe, just maybe, you'll be able to pay for the OC.

Give it a try! 
where?
To anyone still interested in the subject of Opus Clavicembalisticum by Sorabji, I can offer the following: I have performed the work on three occasions, after having made a revision of the error-ridden published score by a careful comparison of a copy of the ms with the composer's 'working copy', a copy of the published score onto which KSS made various emendations in the early 1930s.

I must stress that I would advise no-one to judge the merits (whatever they may be ...) of the piece on the strength of the two available recordings, simply because they are both hugely inaccurate. I strove to learn all the notes, and in my humble opinion, the piece doesn't sound random and ridiculous (which it does on those recordings) when played pretty accurately and with decent phrasing, pedalling, sense of proportion etc.

By the way, it took about 4 months to learn the piece (although I was doing some other things at the time for some of that period) initially; before a NY performance this year I did another 4 weeks' work, approximately. I have been asked to play the piece next year in Finland and will probably have to some more repair work before then as well.

The piece of which one page appeared during the course of the discussion is a sonata KSS wrote in 1917, and it is not all that comparable with OC. A far better piece is the 4th Sonata, written in 1929, and of which you can buy a CD from Amazon (I think) and a decent typeset score from Alistair Hinton at the Sorabji Archive.
Best wishes
Jonathan Powell
could u send me?
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DarkWind
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« Reply #153 on: November 02, 2004, 11:09:14 PM »

To anyone still interested in the subject of Opus Clavicembalisticum by Sorabji, I can offer the following: I have performed the work on three occasions, after having made a revision of the error-ridden published score by a careful comparison of a copy of the ms with the composer's 'working copy', a copy of the published score onto which KSS made various emendations in the early 1930s.

I must stress that I would advise no-one to judge the merits (whatever they may be ...) of the piece on the strength of the two available recordings, simply because they are both hugely inaccurate. I strove to learn all the notes, and in my humble opinion, the piece doesn't sound random and ridiculous (which it does on those recordings) when played pretty accurately and with decent phrasing, pedalling, sense of proportion etc.

By the way, it took about 4 months to learn the piece (although I was doing some other things at the time for some of that period) initially; before a NY performance this year I did another 4 weeks' work, approximately. I have been asked to play the piece next year in Finland and will probably have to some more repair work before then as well.

The piece of which one page appeared during the course of the discussion is a sonata KSS wrote in 1917, and it is not all that comparable with OC. A far better piece is the 4th Sonata, written in 1929, and of which you can buy a CD from Amazon (I think) and a decent typeset score from Alistair Hinton at the Sorabji Archive.
Best wishes
Jonathan Powell


Wow, Jonathan Powell himself! Smiley Have you made a recording of the piece yet? If not, it would be great if you did. Double incredible if you also made a video recording of this tremendous work. It would be amazing to see those tremendous jumps, insane passages, gigantic chords just be pounded out mercilessly, the soft pianissimos being lightly played... Oooh, it would be great seeing a video of this! How hard did you have to work to memorize 200+ pages in only 4 months? That's a pretty remarkable achievement.
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« Reply #154 on: November 03, 2004, 01:03:33 AM »

I've never heard about Mr. Powell, but by what I'm reading you being able to perform the OC in about a little over 4 months means you're probably at, or very close to a professional and experienced pianist. 
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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #155 on: November 03, 2004, 01:57:10 AM »

You don't give up, do you?

I put up a download for the recording. The sheet music? Why don't you buy it? Well THERE'S a concept! Maybe if you would stop masturbating and actually WORK a bit, maybe, just maybe, you'll be able to pay for the OC.

Give it a try! 

Maybe if you stop posting ideas against other´s intentions you could be a great guy.

Why don´t you try it?

Lol, his illegal intentions, you mean?
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DarkWind
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« Reply #156 on: November 03, 2004, 02:14:11 AM »

I've never heard about Mr. Powell, but by what I'm reading you being able to perform the OC in about a little over 4 months means you're probably at, or very close to a professional and experienced pianist. 

He is a well known, professional pianist of the highest caliber. Smiley
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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #157 on: November 03, 2004, 02:26:04 AM »

I've never heard about Mr. Powell, but by what I'm reading you being able to perform the OC in about a little over 4 months means you're probably at, or very close to a professional and experienced pianist. 

He is a well known, professional pianist of the highest caliber. Smiley

I hope that he truly is Jonathan Powell. It would be terrific to have a pianist of his skill on this forum. Imagine the possiblities!  Smiley
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« Reply #158 on: November 03, 2004, 05:59:05 AM »

Is Powell from the United States?  Just curious. 
It would be an honour for a concert pianist to join and share his or her ideas on this forum.  I think it'd really boost up our spirits and humble ourselves to learn piano from a different and perhaps better perspective.
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jpowell
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« Reply #159 on: November 03, 2004, 04:29:58 PM »

Hello again
I live in London, but played the piece in question in NY this last summer. Someone called Joe Patrych made a video of the concert, I think. I'll see if he can make some copies. I didn't play the piece from memory, by the way. Far more things to do! I don't think it's really necessary either. I haven't recorded the piece, and don't intend to for a few years, because there are a couple of others around at the moment, and also because it would be good to have performed the piece at least about 10 times before recording it. There are plenty of other things to do in the meantime.
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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #160 on: November 03, 2004, 09:16:39 PM »

Hello again
I live in London, but played the piece in question in NY this last summer. Someone called Joe Patrych made a video of the concert, I think. I'll see if he can make some copies. I didn't play the piece from memory, by the way. Far more things to do! I don't think it's really necessary either. I haven't recorded the piece, and don't intend to for a few years, because there are a couple of others around at the moment, and also because it would be good to have performed the piece at least about 10 times before recording it. There are plenty of other things to do in the meantime.


Wow, it's great to have you here!
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JimDunlop
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« Reply #161 on: November 04, 2004, 02:02:51 PM »

Since some people  here aren't familiar with Jonathan Powell, I've attached a brief biography (from http://www.bmic.co.uk/)  Apologies to Dr. Powell if this info is incorrect.... Smiley  Seeing that he specializes in the works of Sorabji (among others), I guess it may be a good source for someone looking to get info on how to perform his works...

Jonathan Powell is a composer, pianist and writer on music. Self-taught as a composer, he first performed his works at the Brighton Festival and Dartington in 1989. Since then, he has received performances and commissions from leading exponents of new music including the London Sinfonietta, the Arditti Quartet, the Composers Ensemble, Jane Manning, Valdine Anderson as well as the pianists Stephen Gutman, Nicolas Hodges and Thomas Adès (at the first State of the Nation event in 1997). His works have been heard at the Aldeburgh, Almeida, Bath, Cheltenham and Huddersfield festivals, the South Bank Centre and the BBC Radio Theatre as well as in continental Europe, Japan, Australia and the US. Nearly all work completed since 1994 has been commissioned and most works have been broadcast or recorded. An hour-long programme devoted to his work (including several pieces he especially recorded for the event) was broadcast by BBC Radio during the summer of 2001. Three works – the Barcarolla for piano, Saturnine for ensemble and Sirenland for ensemble – will be recorded for commercial CDs during the year. His String Quartet No 2 was commissioned by the BBC and given its world premiere by the Arditti Quartet in June 2003.

As a pianist, he studied with Denis Matthews and Sulamita Aronovsky, making his début at the age of 20 at the Purcell Room. In 2000 he performed in Russia where he was acclaimed as a ’great virtuoso’ by the press. He is currently fulfilling a busy schedule of recordings and international concert appearances, specialising in the works of Scriabin, Szymanowski, Sorabji and others. He was awarded a doctorate from the University of Cambridge for a dissertation concerning Scriabin and his influence on Russian music; he has published major articles on Scriabin, Ciurlionis, Futurism and Soviet music.

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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #162 on: November 04, 2004, 11:53:22 PM »

Since some people  here aren't familiar with Jonathan Powell, I've attached a brief biography (from http://www.bmic.co.uk/)  Apologies to Dr. Powell if this info is incorrect.... Smiley  Seeing that he specializes in the works of Sorabji (among others), I guess it may be a good source for someone looking to get info on how to perform his works...

Jonathan Powell is a composer, pianist and writer on music. Self-taught as a composer, he first performed his works at the Brighton Festival and Dartington in 1989. Since then, he has received performances and commissions from leading exponents of new music including the London Sinfonietta, the Arditti Quartet, the Composers Ensemble, Jane Manning, Valdine Anderson as well as the pianists Stephen Gutman, Nicolas Hodges and Thomas Adès (at the first State of the Nation event in 1997). His works have been heard at the Aldeburgh, Almeida, Bath, Cheltenham and Huddersfield festivals, the South Bank Centre and the BBC Radio Theatre as well as in continental Europe, Japan, Australia and the US. Nearly all work completed since 1994 has been commissioned and most works have been broadcast or recorded. An hour-long programme devoted to his work (including several pieces he especially recorded for the event) was broadcast by BBC Radio during the summer of 2001. Three works – the Barcarolla for piano, Saturnine for ensemble and Sirenland for ensemble – will be recorded for commercial CDs during the year. His String Quartet No 2 was commissioned by the BBC and given its world premiere by the Arditti Quartet in June 2003.

As a pianist, he studied with Denis Matthews and Sulamita Aronovsky, making his début at the age of 20 at the Purcell Room. In 2000 he performed in Russia where he was acclaimed as a ’great virtuoso’ by the press. He is currently fulfilling a busy schedule of recordings and international concert appearances, specialising in the works of Scriabin, Szymanowski, Sorabji and others. He was awarded a doctorate from the University of Cambridge for a dissertation concerning Scriabin and his influence on Russian music; he has published major articles on Scriabin, Ciurlionis, Futurism and Soviet music.



Interesting....
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« Reply #163 on: November 05, 2004, 06:22:25 AM »

Hey John, have you played Cage's 4'33"? 
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Op. 1 No. 2
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« Reply #164 on: November 05, 2004, 01:28:12 PM »

Hey John, have you played Cage's 4'33"? 

I'd say you can only preform that piece, not play it.
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Spatula
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« Reply #165 on: November 05, 2004, 03:34:23 PM »

uh huh.  So have you performed it before? Any of you? 
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luda888
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« Reply #166 on: November 07, 2004, 05:09:29 PM »

i need the OC!!!!
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Spatula
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« Reply #167 on: November 07, 2004, 06:25:59 PM »

Um, no.

You've asked over 10 times, and no one has really made a significant effort.

Take the hint.   Angry
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Antnee
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« Reply #168 on: November 07, 2004, 11:57:49 PM »

I'm really getting sick of seeing this thread stay at the top of the repertoire board...

oops...
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« Reply #169 on: November 08, 2004, 12:05:25 AM »

I'm really getting sick of seeing this thread stay at the top of the repertoire board...

oops...

haha how ironic, some of the dumb stuff stays on top

oopss....
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Spatula
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« Reply #170 on: November 08, 2004, 03:18:25 AM »

Hey I found an article with Mr. Powell in it, super cool.  Wow...can I have your autograph?

http://web.mid-day.com/news/world/2004/june/86100.htm
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luda888
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« Reply #171 on: November 09, 2004, 12:32:14 AM »

Um, no.

You've asked over 10 times, and no one has really made a significant effort.

Take the hint.   Angry
nah, im just gonna keep bumping this topic until i get it
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Spatula
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« Reply #172 on: November 09, 2004, 12:45:27 AM »

Um, no.

You've asked over 10 times, and no one has really made a significant effort.

Take the hint.   Angry
nah, im just gonna keep bumping this topic until i get it

God Luda, Has nils talked to you yet, cause he's talked to me, and I'm not the total toxic spammer, even though sometimes the posts I do are off track, but for god sakes don't bump for bumping sake, I don't have any power, but the dude above does (Nils).

And for god sakes this post I'm writing,,,,whopptie do if I get one more post in.

Gawd, I woe for the future.   Angry Angry Angry Angry Angry
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luda888
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« Reply #173 on: November 09, 2004, 10:56:34 PM »

whos nils?
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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #174 on: November 10, 2004, 08:35:13 PM »

whos nils?

*Sigh*  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #175 on: November 11, 2004, 12:16:32 AM »

Interesting that Ludwig only has half the amount of posts yet is more aware of the Piano Forum resources.  How interesting.

The number of posts is not proportionately represented by the knowledge of the member, as I am a case study example.
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bernhard
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« Reply #176 on: November 11, 2004, 12:44:49 AM »

Interesting that Ludwig only has half the amount of posts yet is more aware of the Piano Forum resources.  How interesting.

The number of posts is not proportionately represented by the knowledge of the member, as I am a case study example.

Then again...
 Cool
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Spatula
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« Reply #177 on: November 11, 2004, 12:49:54 AM »

I admit it! I have 1500 some posts yet am dumb as a rock! I know I know!

I never said I was smart! A vast majority of kitchen utensils are dumb! 

Remember, Bernhard is here. 
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Brian Healey
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« Reply #178 on: November 11, 2004, 06:43:51 AM »

On a totally unrelated note......

What the hell is that "Da SDC" board thingy? That thing was a riot! Is it some sort of "Da Ali G Show" tribute page or something? It sounds like a bunch of Ali G fans on there. I couldn't understand a thing of what anybody was saying (or typing rather)!

Anyway......proceed with the Sorabji ridiculousness.............
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kempff
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« Reply #179 on: November 11, 2004, 11:31:45 AM »

On a totally unrelated note......

What the hell is that "Da SDC" board thingy? That thing was a riot! Is it some sort of "Da Ali G Show" tribute page or something? It sounds like a bunch of Ali G fans on there. I couldn't understand a thing of what anybody was saying (or typing rather)!

Anyway......proceed with the Sorabji ridiculousness.............

You seem confused my friend. In SDC everyone talks, walks and types like that. Come and join. Cool
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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #180 on: November 11, 2004, 01:07:28 PM »

Interesting that Ludwig only has half the amount of posts yet is more aware of the Piano Forum resources.  How interesting.

The number of posts is not proportionately represented by the knowledge of the member, as I am a case study example.

Thank you!  Wink

Actually, I have been to this forum for a very long time. I just didn't register until recently. Therefore, I probably know a lot more about it than Luda. Hey, I'm the one who told the guy about this place!

Da SDC is.... um.... Yeah... But I actually really like that place, because I got a free recording of Madge playing the O.C.!

However... They are a bit... profane, to say the least...

Ludwig Van Rachabji

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« Reply #181 on: November 11, 2004, 01:14:28 PM »

i have been there, great site

they have a section where you can request any recording or sheet music you want, how kind of them!!

the language they use represents a deeply rooted spirituality they wield.

this spirit drives them, and motivates them to be truly demonic.

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« Reply #182 on: November 11, 2004, 04:57:46 PM »

Quote
You seem confused my friend. In SDC everyone talks, walks and types like that. Come and join.

I guess I am confused. What kind of forum is it? Is it another piano forum?

Oh, and by the way, I don't know what Luna was talking about when he said something about getting an empty zip file. I downloaded the Madge recording of OC from the link provided and I'm listening to it right now. This is the first time I've heard it and I happen to think it's pretty awesome. I don't think I will be listening to it for 4 1/2 hours, though. At least not consecutively.

Luna, you obviously did something wrong because the zip file from that link is perfectly fine. Didn't you find it odd that an "empty" zip file took so long to download? If the file was truly empty it would have downloaded in about 1/2 a second.
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super_ardua
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« Reply #183 on: November 11, 2004, 05:35:07 PM »

erm....Da SDC is ......um.........moving right along....
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« Reply #184 on: November 11, 2004, 05:37:59 PM »

yeah, its another piano forum

but it isnt as exclusively about the educational/learning side of it

and its all about fun - plus you can say WHATEVER YOU WANT

which is fun, and not in the slightest bit tedious
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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #185 on: November 11, 2004, 06:09:55 PM »

Quote
Luna, you obviously did something wrong because the zip file from that link is perfectly fine.

I'm glad it worked.  Smiley
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luda888
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« Reply #186 on: November 11, 2004, 11:24:54 PM »

well, its not working for me Tongue
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Ludwig Van Rachabji
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« Reply #187 on: November 12, 2004, 12:00:00 AM »

well, its not working for me Tongue

Christ, ain't it Murphy's law??? This guy won't give up 'til he gets a recording, and the only one available doesn't work!

Ludwig Van Rachabji
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Op. 1 No. 2
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« Reply #188 on: November 12, 2004, 08:52:03 AM »

well, its not working for me Tongue

Use some program you can continue your download with. My computer could not handle such a file either, when just clicking it like that.
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krittyot
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« Reply #189 on: November 12, 2004, 02:57:25 PM »

erm....Da SDC is ......um.........moving right along....

http://www.chopinmusic.net/sdc

Well, check it out. You can expect to see many harsh words, but after all I would say it's a great site. It revolutionizes the piano discussion, and you can always have a good laugh. It is just fun and fun. This is a place which is best for relaxing your brain and have a great humor.

 Cheesy
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Yabba-Dabba-Doo! (F. Flinstone)
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« Reply #190 on: November 12, 2004, 04:58:26 PM »

Quote
well, its not working for me


How dare you respond to a high class musician like Jonathan Powell the way you did.  He graces us all with his presence and all you can do is selfishly, and unpoiltely, might i add, ask him for a free recording?

That is so unbelievable...
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What it all comes down to is that one does not play the piano with one’s fingers; one plays the piano with one’s mind.-  Glenn Gould
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