Piano Forum
Piano Board => Performance => Topic started by: coolpianoman on June 08, 2015, 11:36:35 AM
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I appreciate this might appear to be a silly post and I am not sure where to put it but I guess it is part of performance but it comes before a note has even been played.
I run a piano club which involves around 15 amateur pianists playing for the pleasure of everyone who attends on a Sunday afternoon. I am also a member of a number of other piano clubs too.
With so many people of different statures playing one after the other, much time is taken with the adjustment of the piano bench and some players invariably turn the knobs the wrong way. Often we are asked 'is it going up or down'.
Now I guess there must be a standard way of positioning a piano bench in front of a piano so that up and down are always the same direction - turning towards you or away from you - I hope this makes sense
With me thus far?
OK so what's the answer? ;)
Chris
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Turn knob forward = down
Turn knob backward = up
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Turn knob forward = down
Turn knob backward = up
Unless you turn the bench around, uh oh!
The more important point is that:
1) bench height is a very crucial and often neglected part of piano playing, and
2) for the OP's specific purpose, just make sure that no one turns it around, unless the player is used to having their bench in the opposite direction, and
3) a third alternative is to just have everyone do a 30 second dry run, or use one model pinanist, before hand.
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Unless you turn the bench around, uh oh!
The problem may also be that people have their own benches turned around and so think the default is the other way round.
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or use an old-fashioned round stool, like the one I use! Spin it counterclockwise, and up you go. Spin the other way, and down. Pretty obvious when you're sitting on it! Since my place is sort of a museum anyway, it's appropriate -- and it's the one which has always been, for almost 120 years now, with the piano.
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Sit on the bench. Do a test by turning the knob a little bit in both directions. The direction with more resistance is up, the direction with less resistance is down. Now that you know which is which, adjust to your preference.
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Sit on the bench. Do a test by turning the knob a little bit in both directions. The direction with more resistance is up, the direction with less resistance is down. Now that you know which is which, adjust to your preference.
Hi Quantum,
Are you sure it is a good thing to move the mechanism while having a load on it?
Mvh,
Michael
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or use an old-fashioned round stool, like the one I use! Spin it counterclockwise, and up you go. Spin the other way, and down. Pretty obvious when you're sitting on it! Since my place is sort of a museum anyway, it's appropriate -- and it's the one which has always been, for almost 120 years now, with the piano.
Forget the outdated stuff, just get a hydraulic piano bench, the best invention ever!
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Forget the outdated stuff, just get a hydraulic piano bench, the best invention ever!
-No no no. Look here what happens:
:o
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-No no no. Look here what happens:
:o
It's just a matter of learning the right technique ;D
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For some reason now difficult to recall, I once thought an adjustable concert stool (artist's bench) would be nice, so when my company wanted to give me a present for twenty-five years' service I suggested one. At first I thought the occasional noises in my recordings were peculiar artifacts. Being dense, I spent a late night editing them out only to discover in the morning that they had emanated from the seat. In a fit of annoyance I rushed out and bought a cheap-as-chips Chinese stool, which has proved excellent. I had broken the legs off my original duet stool when I hit the floor on it during a frenzied improvisation. I just use the artist's bench as a seat for fat visitors now.
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Still trying to find a knob to turn. All I see is turn the seat right and goes up turn it left and moved down
What knob?
(https://www.mprpiano.com/accessories/15/15-1.jpg)
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Do you know what has now become (not the original intent of the OP) so hilarious about this post? And, I set my original performance practice video as a predicate.
That means: picture in your mind how a pianist (including the most famous) of the 19th century looked and sounded at the piano during an average performance.
Accordingly, have you not ever seen a photograph or a daguerreotype of Franz Liszt, Clara Schumann, and Chopin sitting at the piano?
They are not positioned on a modern piano bench, not one single one of them. Hey, then how did they play this very technically challenging and exquisitely beautiful music sitting on a glorified "CHAIR?"
The fact of the matter is that THEY DID!
Additionally, today there is wonderful beautifully gifted man/pianist by the name of Frederic Chiu (www.fredericchiu.com), a stellar student of Abbey Simon, who sits in a chair. Further, he has had many special versions crafted for him over the years.
Please visit his website and learn what you can about the sitting body mechanics about playing the piano.
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Unless memory fails me, Glenn Gould had his very own -- and very ricketty -- chair which he always took wherever he played...
Whatever works!
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Are you sure it is a good thing to move the mechanism while having a load on it?
I've never experienced any problems with this. After one has discovered which direction is up and down one can get one's weight off the bench and adjust the mechanism accordingly.
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Unless memory fails me, Glenn Gould had his very own -- and very ricketty -- chair which he always took wherever he played...
Whatever works!
...that maybe why Glenn Gould only became 50 years old
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There seems to be some advantage with sitting on a surface the rear of which slopes downward by a small number of degrees. A chair can be cheaply purchased that does this [or one can slightly shorten the length of the rear legs of any chair to do it] - all of the piano benches, as far as I am aware, won't do this, unless you are keen to take a saw to the rear legs of a piano bench.
Mvh,
Michael
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There seems to be some advantage with sitting on a surface the rear of which slopes downward
Neither sliding backwards onto your arse nor having the circulation cut off from you legs seem to meet any definition of "advantage" I have ever sought in seating.
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Hi coolpianoman,
"With so many people of different statures playing one after the other, much time is taken with the adjustment of the piano bench and some players invariably turn the knobs the wrong way. Often we are asked 'is it going up or down'."
The biggest time saver would be to have 3 cushions that are 1 inch thick, 2 inches thick and 4 inches thick. This would allow for an almost instant increase in height from 1 to 7 inches in 1 inch increments. No knob turning needed.
Possibly, a small platform that the bench could be placed on might work.
I have played on nonadjustable benches by folding a beach towel, sitting on books and even pillows.
Lastly, 3 benches/chairs of different heights could be "quickly" swapped out.
I hope I have been helpful. Joe.
P.S. Where are all these piano clubs? How did you start your own?
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There seems to be some advantage with sitting on a surface the rear of which slopes downward by a small number of degrees.
This may be because, as I have read, the optimal position for sitting is not at 90 degrees at which all chairs and furniture are designed, but at a certain angle forward. Concentration is facilitated at such a sitting position.
I'll also add that it's more comfortable to sit on a padded surface for a more pleasant playing experience. Helps absorb the sudden shocks of movement while playing. And I'm all about preparation for averting the unforeseeable. ;)
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I've never experienced any problems with this. After one has discovered which direction is up and down one can get one's weight off the bench and adjust the mechanism accordingly.
Er yes but it is the time 17 people can take finding this out which was the subject of my post. If there is a standard way of having the bench then this would be easy. Also as someone has rightly pointed out it probably depends on which way round they have their bench at home. Certainly dont fancy a round stool - sorry.
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Hi coolpianoman,
Label the knob! Use an arrow going around the knob with the word "UP".
But...
Shouldn't this really only happen once? I'm sorry but I just don't understand this. If for example counterclockwise is up then regardless of which way the bench is facing or who is about to perform, counterclockwise will still be up.
Also, isn't it the same exact bench week after week after week? Why are some people still asking is it going Up? And not one person of the seventeen in the club knows which way is up?
I'm very curious as to what exactly it is that I'm missing?
Please help, Joe.
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!
Mvh,
Michael
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Hi coolpianoman,
Label the knob! Use an arrow going around the knob with the word "UP".
But...
Shouldn't this really only happen once? I'm sorry but I just don't understand this. If for example counterclockwise is up then regardless of which way the bench is facing or who is about to perform, counterclockwise will still be up.
Also, isn't it the same exact bench week after week after week? Why are some people still asking is it going Up? And not one person of the seventeen in the club knows which way is up?
I'm very curious as to what exactly it is that I'm missing?
Please help, Joe.
If you are used to a bench one way or the other then your up will be different - clockwise one way counter clockwise if you turn it round. I was hoping to find a standard way benches are positioned so that for example clockwise is always up. I have seen this struggle repeatedly in piano clubs where lots of people are playing but looks like we are stuck with it. Thanks for the replies.
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Since a piano bench has two knobs that move together, clockwise or counter would depend on whether you were looking at the left or the right one so is an added level of potential confusion.
I think the small stickers are your best bet - though I also suspect most people won't look at them so any advantage will be small.
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Since a piano bench has two knobs that move together, clockwise or counter would depend on whether you were looking at the left or the right one so is an added level of potential confusion.
I think the small stickers are your best bet - though I also suspect most people won't look at them so any advantage will be small.
They would be turned away from you or towards you for up or down. Turn it round and it will be reversed. Anyway we have 17 playing at our piano club today - phew so I will see how much stool turning we have ;)