Piano Forum
Piano Board => Repertoire => Topic started by: mediumwell on April 12, 2011, 07:59:08 AM
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So I was watching some piano vids on youtube and I stumbled upon Lyapunov after watching one of sorabji's... i became really fascinated with his 12 etudes and i was just wondering why he is so ....seemingly unheard of? I've learned one of his pieces already (Chant Epique - etude no 8 ) and i've been told that it is from a ballet before but each time i ask the person if they know the song or composer, they are stumped. it kind of startles me because his works are so profound and fantastic that i would expect almost any pianist to know and recognize him.
So why is he so unheard of? AND ALSO... in my opinion, his transcendental etudes totally whoop liszt's etudes' asses.
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I love his etudes, as my screenname perhaps indicates .. ;)
I don't understand the lack of attention his music gets either. With the etudes, I can only assume that it's because they are quite Lisztian in nature and Liszt was there first, and Liapunov is "only" a follower. I think the 2nd concerto is quite superb, incidentally.
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Well, if we all start playing his music, maybe more ppl will notice his work ;)
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I don't think "unheard of" is fully descriptive. There's the general public, and then there are those with increasingly specialized interest in, and knowledge of, a given subject. I would expect that Lyapunov's name, at least (if not necessarily his music), would be recognized by most pianists of a certain level of advancement and musical education.
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I don't think "unheard of" is fully descriptive. There's the general public, and then there are those with increasingly specialized interest in, and knowledge of, a given subject. I would expect that Lyapunov's name, at least (if not necessarily his music), would be recognized by most pianists of a certain level of advancement and musical education.
i guess you are right... until a few months ago i belonged to that "general public"... after all i only found lyapunov on youtube, if not for that i'd probably have no idea who he was and if i heard his stuff would probably just say "oh that sounds nice" but not really give much more thought to it.
it just seems like a lot of people tend to obsess over the "heard of" composers, chopin, liszt, tchaikovsky, rachmaninoff, etc. etc. Only recently i've been searching up some of the more unheard of ones and its really fascinating. Other than just playing the stuff for people, i guess how can we as pianists get these composers more recognized? or is that just an impossible task considering (im making an assumption) most people don't really listen to piano much anymore...
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I don’t think that the general public (i.e., those who have a superficial familiarity, if any, with classical music) is susceptible to embracing any more than they’re already aware of, but musicians can certainly be encouraged to explore. And thanks especially to the internet, one doesn't have to be in an academic setting or have a conventionally “music-educated” background to do that. For example, a number of YouTube channels are dedicated to music of lesser known and less acclaimed composers.
I know it can seem as though the big names are obsessed over, but I think it’s because their output is, after all, of such high quality; their reputations (and, yes, “fame”) are well-deserved. But a significant number of aficionados really do like to get off the beaten track, too; maybe we think we’ll find an underrated masterpiece, perhaps we’re just curious about what the also-ran contemporaries of The Great Ones were doing, and sometimes it’s just nice to hear something fresh.
Promoting interest in the relatively obscure can result in renewed awareness of historically significant composers, and sometimes old masters are rescued from oblivion—among the small subgroup of people who care about such things, anyway. It’s a niche, but then so is classical music generally—like so many other areas of the arts in an increasingly coarse culture.
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it just seems like a lot of people tend to obsess over the "heard of" composers, chopin, liszt, tchaikovsky, rachmaninoff, etc. etc. Only recently i've been searching up some of the more unheard of ones and its really fascinating. Other than just playing the stuff for people, i guess how can we as pianists get these composers more recognized? or is that just an impossible task considering (im making an assumption) most people don't really listen to piano much anymore...
There's so much inbuilt inertia in musical education, concert programmes etc, that it's very difficult do stimulate interest in the so-called "lesser" composers. Performing the music is a start. Sometimes people do like it and take notice. Having mentioned Liapunov to at least a dozen pianists, it was quite interesting to me that almost without exception the pianists from a UK background hadn't even heard of him, but the pianists from an Eastern/mid-European background were enthusiastic about and familiar with his work.
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There's so much inbuilt inertia in musical education, concert programmes etc, that it's very difficult do stimulate interest in the so-called "lesser" composers. Performing the music is a start. Sometimes people do like it and take notice. Having mentioned Liapunov to at least a dozen pianists, it was quite interesting to me that almost without exception the pianists from a UK background hadn't even heard of him, but the pianists from an Eastern/mid-European background were enthusiastic about and familiar with his work.
well that's no doubt the eastern/mid-european backgrounds had heard of him, he hailed from... russia? or at least thats where he was taught and made his fame. i just read up a bit about him, apparently he toured around a lot of eastern europe, i wonder if he had chosen both east AND west if he'd be more heard of now.
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He actually ended up settling in Paris post-Russian revolution. I suspect that in the English-speaking world, many people don't look past Rachmaninov, Tchaikovsky, Scriabin and to a lesser extent Medtner when thinking of Russian romanticism. It's a shame really; so many fine composers don't seem to see the light of day.
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I've been working on Lyapunov's Etudes for years. It's good to hear that other people are aware of his music as well! It is rather strange that Liszt's 12 are so popular (at least among pianists) and Lyapunov's have largely been overlooked, especially as they appear to be so heavily influenced by Liszt's.
What amazing pieces these are! They're bloody difficult, yet you can tell they were written by someone who knew the piano so well that he could create almost any effect on it. Truly the work of a lifetime to master.
As stevebob said, "It’s a niche, but then so is classical music generally—like so many other areas of the arts in an increasingly coarse culture." That really spoke to me; I feel it on a daily basis. Somehow, for me, the latest hit from Lady Gaga just doesn't have the emotional and artistic impact of the music discussed in this post. Maybe it's just me.... : )
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He actually ended up settling in Paris post-Russian revolution. I suspect that in the English-speaking world, many people don't look past Rachmaninov, Tchaikovsky, Scriabin and to a lesser extent Medtner when thinking of Russian romanticism.
I reckon that's statistically true, certainly among a mainstream demographic whose interest in Western art music is relatively superficial. But there are many strata of people, from the generally uninformed general public to those with high intellectual curiosity, sophisticated tastes and rarefied knowledge.
It's a shame really; so many fine composers don't seem to see the light of day.
I mentioned previously that such composers do see the light of day in a venue like YouTube. Even if the number of views of those videos and followers of those channels isn't vast, it does demonstrate that there is an enthusiastic audience for the recondite. Even if they'll never amount to more than a niche within a niche, that group obviously knows that there's plenty to explore beneath the proverbial tip of the iceberg,
My point is that there's a whole world of "unheard of" stuff out there for those who are interested enough to seek it out. Not everyone is.
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I've been working on Lyapunov's Etudes for years. It's good to hear that other people are aware of his music as well! It is rather strange that Liszt's 12 are so popular (at least among pianists) and Lyapunov's have largely been overlooked, especially as they appear to be so heavily influenced by Liszt's.
What amazing pieces these are! They're bloody difficult, yet you can tell they were written by someone who knew the piano so well that he could create almost any effect on it. Truly the work of a lifetime to master.
As stevebob said, "It’s a niche, but then so is classical music generally—like so many other areas of the arts in an increasingly coarse culture." That really spoke to me; I feel it on a daily basis. Somehow, for me, the latest hit from Lady Gaga just doesn't have the emotional and artistic impact of the music discussed in this post. Maybe it's just me.... : )
which ones have you learned so far?
i've learned 8, half way through 3, and am currently focusing all my time practicing on 12 - because its such a freakin awesome piece. definitely my favorite.
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It's a shame really; so many fine composers don't seem to see the light of day.
I mentioned previously that such composers do see the light of day in a venue like YouTube. Even if the number of views of those videos and followers of those channels isn't vast, it does demonstrate that there is an enthusiastic audience for the recondite. Even if they'll never amount to more than a niche within a niche, that group obviously knows that there's plenty to explore beneath the proverbial tip of the iceberg.
Yes, I'm aware of this.. having put his fifth etude on YouTube ;) (and the composer playing the twelfth). YouTube is a valuable resource for those seeking out the obscure; though I personally would be happier to see more of such composers on concert programmes. However, they do undoubtedly comprise only a niche within a niche and it will likely remain that way unless given determined advocacy by a big-name pianist. (I'm not a big fan of Marc-Andre Hamelin, but he has done an enormous amount of good for several composers.)
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which ones have you learned so far?
i've learned 8, half way through 3, and am currently focusing all my time practicing on 12 - because its such a freakin awesome piece. definitely my favorite.
My favourites are 4, 6 and 10, but I'm currently working hard on 10. It just has such great Slavic harmonies, all those open fifths and dark chords, plus a really beautiful melody in the middle section. The Peters edition lists the tempo at 176, and if that's even physically possible I'd love to hear it! At the beginning I can see it, but at that tempo the consecutive octaves later on in the piece are a real challenge.