There's "teaching" and then there's Teaching.

[m1469]

One is doing whatever you have to do in order to keep a job going that is called "teaching music" and the other is being able to share the things that are truly exciting about music for the teacher, with the student.  The latter is different for every teacher, but the latter is largely what I had believed teaching was about and am finding that in fact it is not.  While there are aspects of teaching that do indeed make my job ... emotionally possible ... I am fundamentally a craftsperson at the instrument, who loves to work at it and build something, who has loved the sound of it from the beginning, who loves to study it and find out new things, who has been willing to think on my own regarding it and music, and who has spent much of my conscious piano life thinking about how to explain and otherwise share concepts with others.  

This constant trying to figure things out for individuals who do not share these qualities ... it wears on a person.  Why do I spend so much energy here?  Why do I, somebody who loves music, who loves the craft, work so hard to try to help others to see the beauty in both the art and the craftsmanship of it?  It has taken over my "musical life."  If a teacher ever put this kind of energy into me, I can guarantee one thing:  it was no mystery that I loved it and would work on it.

My point is that, after a certain amount of trying to meet students where they are at and it not developing into something more, the substance is lost.  I can only handle so many individuals who are happy to learn how to play Jingle Bells but who never develop into a craftsperson at the instrument.  Yes, grab a person's interest with music and concepts that interest them; help them to learn and grow based on their own interests, but there will always be a difference between learning something like "Let it Go" vs. the ins and outs of Bach's inventions.  There is something to be said for the content itself because there is a limit to what is possible to learn about within a given musical focus.

PS-  I am exhausted, and this post is potentially not addressing real topics the way I would intend.

[ted]

I think you have expressed the conundrum well, m1469. I certainly could not teach for that very reason. What you say has also reminded me of how ridiculously lucky I was with the two teachers of my childhood and youth. Both were creative eccentrics, and both had actions brought against them to stop them teaching and "lowering the standards of music". But they were true teachers in every sense of your second definition. I am sure you are too.

[hardy_practice]

Pearls before swine?  but then who dares predict which is going to turn into the handsome prince?

[amytsuda]

I am not a piano teacher, but just observing my nieces and nephews, or remembering my brothers, I think there's something inborn about ones who understand the crafts of classic music. I think it's okay. Just let them grow up with warm memories of fun piano lessons. Otherwise, they'd get traumatized by their innate lack of talent.

When I was 8, I was sent to a teacher who actually didn't play piano. He was a retired music prof and Baritone. So his lesson was simply he'd put an LP on, make me listen to the piece, and ask me to play the piece. And he'd be humming loud while I'm playing. This was the only option for me. But he had tons of LPs and scores, and I learned a lot of pieces. So I never knew the piano lesson can be traumatic.

Now time forward, I finally got my first real serious piano teacher. And I notice he is irritated by my lack of progress and poor playing. I am 44, so I won't get traumatized, but I can see this can be traumatic to young kids particularly if the kids aren't talented naturally. For teachers, it's frustrating to teach students without talent (incl. ear, motor coordination, hand shape and size, etc).

But I am a bit like "dude, just teach me and take money or send me to someone else if you don't like, because I am not quitting from my side". I want to be better and I want to learn. First time in my life, I can afford to try it. Of course, I am beyond Jingle Bell and I do want to learn the craft no matter how slow I am.

But I think the fundamental is the same. When they don't have it, they don't have it, but it doesn't mean they don't love music. They love music and want to play it. Even if it's Jingle Bell. In fact, one of my niece plays Jingle Bell with one hand proudly for me every time I see her with no progress, and I cherish it.

I am not sure if I helped or if I exhausted you more.  

[j_menz]

Pearls before swine?  but then who dares predict which is going to turn into the handsome prince?

Those who can spot a mixed metaphor a mile off? 

[amytsuda]

I hope my teacher is not on this forum... 

[nyiregyhazi]

One is doing whatever you have to do in order to keep a job going that is called "teaching music" and the other is being able to share the things that are truly exciting about music for the teacher, with the student.  The latter is different for every teacher, but the latter is largely what I had believed teaching was about and am finding that in fact it is not.  While there are aspects of teaching that do indeed make my job ... emotionally possible ... I am fundamentally a craftsperson at the instrument, who loves to work at it and build something, who has loved the sound of it from the beginning, who loves to study it and find out new things, who has been willing to think on my own regarding it and music, and who has spent much of my conscious piano life thinking about how to explain and otherwise share concepts with others.  

This constant trying to figure things out for individuals who do not share these qualities ... it wears on a person.  Why do I spend so much energy here?  Why do I, somebody who loves music, who loves the craft, work so hard to try to help others to see the beauty in both the art and the craftsmanship of it?  It has taken over my "musical life."  If a teacher ever put this kind of energy into me, I can guarantee one thing:  it was no mystery that I loved it and would work on it.

My point is that, after a certain amount of trying to meet students where they are at and it not developing into something more, the substance is lost.  I can only handle so many individuals who are happy to learn how to play Jingle Bells but who never develop into a craftsperson at the instrument.  Yes, grab a person's interest with music and concepts that interest them; help them to learn and grow based on their own interests, but there will always be a difference between learning something like "Let it Go" vs. the ins and outs of Bach's inventions.  There is something to be said for the content itself because there is a limit to what is possible to learn about within a given musical focus.

PS-  I am exhausted, and this post is potentially not addressing real topics the way I would intend.

What a truly disgustingly self-aggrandising post. Next time you're up in your ivory tower feeling aggrieved that someone wants to learn jingle bells, perhaps you might remember that they are PAYING you at an extremely good rate. Rather than feel exhausted, try remembering what most of the world's population have to do to make ends meet- rather than turning your nose up at those who provide your living for daring not to be on the pedestal you have placed yourself. There are plenty of pianists who are a thousand times the craftsman you are who manage to bear "civilians". Think yourself lucky you don't work in a factory and stop being such a vile ego. You're not on the artistic level where people will tolerate it.

[Bob]

Sounds like 'job vs. profession.' 

Can't separate them either.

[m1469]

I am separating elements out in my own teaching and philosophy of teaching, as well as my own musical interests, and thinking pretty realistically about how I am spending my time in my life.  For the first time in my life, I am actively considering other business possibilities.  

I still believe that anybody has a right to learn any type of music they want (of course), and there is going to be a teacher who is either willing or actually personally very interested in working along those lines with a student.  I am working to figure out exactly where I fall in this spectrum, separate from needing to pay the mortgage.

I have a right to distinguish the differences between what I consider to be dabbling vs. craftspersonship; to understand my own inclinations, strengths, and desires in relation, and to make decisions based upon it.

It is important for me and teachers in general to distinguish the pedagogical differences between content options - since I have not had the luxury of somebody actively helping me with that for the sake of my own teaching, and do not have the luxury of ever going back to school to study that, I will go ahead and make these distinctions as I can, in the ways that I can.  I am learning from experience.

I have a right to come to a better understanding about whether something is holding me back in life or not, and to make changes if possible and where necessary.  I have been teaching a giant variety of students for about 14 years, and my teaching in general did not start there.  This is a fact, and has nothing to do with other individuals who are teaching and whatever their circumstances may be.

Whether we are talking about me as a teacher or somebody else, it is a fact that there are only certain teaching qualifications needed to help certain types of students.

I also come to realize that, no matter what I am having students work on, my goal has constantly been to try to milk any ounce of musical value out of the experience, and since I don't have the luxury of a vested individual helping me in my career, and reflecting back to me important information about my teaching, I am learning as I go.

I am not talking about "talent" or hand size, or things that can not be controlled.  I am talking about commitment, interest, and dedication within the individual to learning about craftspersonship -through any vein of learning- at the instrument.

[dima_76557]

@ m1469

Have you considered doing something in the re-training business? Nothing but very motivated and very grateful students there.

[m1469]

Well, there is no path anywhere on my radar that would suggest I have that option.  It is very highly interesting to me, but I am ready for practical steps in my life and almost nothing else.  At the moment I do not see any practical steps in front of me which would seem to lead toward any changes in my teaching or musical experiences.

[nyiregyhazi]

Well, there is no path anywhere on my radar that would suggest I have that option.  It is very highly interesting to me, but I am ready for practical steps in my life and almost nothing else.  At the moment I do not see any practical steps in front of me which would seem to lead toward any changes in my teaching or musical experiences.

Maybe you should try looking for some then- rather than ranting in depth about how far short your students fall short of the pedestal you see yourself as being stood on?

[m1469]

Maybe you should try looking for some then- rather than ranting in depth about how far short your students fall short of the pedestal you see yourself as being stood on?

That is what my whole last several years have been about (and even longer when I consider singing and steps I took with that before I stopped that and started piano again), essentially.  Not just about looking for some opportunity to start teaching retraining, but about finding another path than what I was on and what I am on now, or at least another step.  I wouldn't take back the last several years, but as far as I can tell that was the one real chance I had to maneuver any kind of true musical and professional progress, and it came and then went.  It took everything I had.  Judging by your general demeanor, I assume that is difficult for you to understand.  I am not in the position in my life (anymore) to pick some idea out of thin air and then go running all around the world trying to find a way to make it come to life.

The rest of your thoughts I already addressed in the post just before this, so feel free to read it again if you find that necessary.

[nyiregyhazi]

Judging by your general demeanor, I assume that is difficult for you to understand.  I am not in the position in my life (anymore) to pick some idea out of thin air and then go running all around the world trying to find a way to make it come to life.

Indeed, the idea that the opportunity to continue evolving goes away is a ridiculous thing that I have no interest in understanding. Nobody loses the opportunity to continue evolving and developing and you don't have to run around the world to do so. If you're not interested in trying to move on from the attitude that you outlined in your first post, I can only advise giving up teaching. You don't have to look down on anyone. You need to evolve so that you can find pleasure in achievements, big or small.

[m1469]

Indeed, the idea that the opportunity to continue evolving goes away is a ridiculous thing that I have no interest in understanding. Nobody loses the opportunity to continue evolving and you don't have to run around the world to do so. If you're not interested in trying to move on from the attitude that you outlined in your first post, I can only advise giving up teaching.

That would be very touching if it came from somebody who I felt inclined to listen to and open myself up to for advice.  I am not somebody who is having a temper tantrum after a few difficult years of having students who I would prefer live up to a different standard.  I have done rounds and rounds and rounds with myself about this profession that I built from the ground up, with my own two hands.  Feel free to suggest something that is practical and not just meant as an insult, regarding an actual next step in my life.

[nyiregyhazi]

That would be very touching if it came from somebody who I felt inclined to listen to and open myself up to for advice.  I am not somebody who is deciding to quit after a few difficult years of having students who I would prefer live up to a different standard.  

Then stop wallowing in problems and self-pity and instead learn to evolve from the revolting attitude expressed in your first post of this thread. As I already said, you can start by remembering what most workers have to do to earn money and reminding yourself who pays your wages. Next time you're about to wallow in disappointment at your students, remind yourself how lucky you are and either make do with what you have in a positive fashion or get out of the profession.

[m1469]

either make do with what you have in a positive fashion or get out of the profession.

Pretty sure I already said that's exactly what I'm talking about  

[nyiregyhazi]

Pretty sure I already said that's exactly what I'm talking about  

The language of your first post suggested far from that. It was a rant about problems, not a post that implied interest in solutions or any accurate perspective on reality. If you want to move on, the first step is to stop self-aggrandising and putting yourself on a pedestal. You're a paid worker who has a right to take pleasure where you can find it. Not a superior being who is owed it by god-given right. Step one is realise that.

People who appreciate that pleasures during professional work are a bonus to cherish and not a right that they are being cheated out of whenever absent, are far happier people. The human mind registers loss far more greatly than gain- which is why people who think something is supposed to be granted to them create their own misery, when it inevitably fails to be served up to the extent that they deluded themself into presuming to be their rightful due.

[m1469]

Oh, and actually I am not truly planning to ever quit teaching and being a musician, I actually do really love some deep things about it.  I am just coming to a sense of realization of what that really is, and trying to find a way that perhaps all of my professional fulfillment is not hinging on "Let it Go" and "I didn't practice this week."

I am, on the whole, simply not convinced that it is possible for somebody in my position to have an entire musical profession based in the things that are fulfilling for me.  I think the gig for somebody in my shoes is basically what I am doing now, and to just continue doing it for the rest of my life, just like so.  Or, you know, make some changes here or there, but generally just keeping at it exactly the way it is.  I had thought at one time that I might be able to make some changes that could give me more options, but it seems I can't.  And, I am not too convinced that anybody in this profession is actually all that fulfilled, so even if I could make some changes, is it *really* toward something that is all that different?  

Last Monday evening I met with a former student, she is about 30, who is considering her next musically professional steps in life.  It was very interesting for me to come to realize what I would and would not give as advice.

There are a lot of good reasons for my posting this topic, but as it turns out, I am again completely exhausted and totally starving and need to not try to figure out how to put it into words at the moment.

[nyiregyhazi]

I am, on the whole, simply not convinced that it is possible for somebody in my position to have an entire musical profession based in the things that are fulfilling (for me) about teaching.  I think the gig for somebody in my shoes is basically what I am doing now, and to just continue doing it for the rest of my life, just like so.  Or, you know, make some changes here or there, but generally just keeping at it exactly the way it is.  I had thought at one time that I might be able to make some changes that could give me more options, but it seems I can't.  And, I am not too convinced that anybody in this profession is actually all that fulfilled, so even if I could make some changes, is it *really* all that different?  

So, what you're saying is that you think all teachers should not only be paid extremely well for their time, but all students are supposed to be musically fulfilling to them and that they have a right to be disappointed by anyone with a different mindset to someone who studied music as their primary passion in life? You are expecting to be granted both money and artistic satisfaction without fail? You have your head in the clouds still. Teaching is a JOB and pleasures are a bonus, not something that you are being cheated of wherever you receive less than 100 percent.

As I said, happiness comes from taking pleasures as bonuses. Your every word reinforces that you think that students are not only supposed to be there to pay your wages but to give you musical fulfillment, without fail. Small wonder you're unhappy, if you think you are owed both money and profound musical pleasure from each and every student. How much artistic pleasure would you get if you were earning your living behind the counter of McDonald's? You've not listened to a word I've said so far.

[awesom_o]

AND the race to 10,000 posts continues full speed ahead! Who cares about post quality? It's quantity that really matters!

 

[m1469]

Teaching is a JOB

Sure.  But, either a job is a job is a job, or there is actually something about a specific profession that is more fulfilling than another.  If it's only a job, if it's only about paying the bills, maybe there are better ways to do that that are not actually musically taxing on a person's own love for it.  

You've not listened to a word I've said so far.

And what is it about you that you think means I should, exactly?

[nyiregyhazi]

Sure.  But, either a job is a job is a job, or there is actually something about a specific profession that is more fulfilling than another.  If it's only a job, if it's only about paying the bills, maybe there are better ways to do that that are not actually musically taxing.  

Nobody said "only" a job. I don't make such silly polarisations. In fact I specifically emphasised how much more it can offer, if you care to appreciate positives as positives. I said that if you think it's only there for your personal satisfaction (which is the only perspective yet hinted at within your posts) you are not living in reality- which is why you are the architect of your unhappiness. You're only being cheated out of things if you frame the situation as if they were your right. They are not your right to expect.

Stop going on and on about what you wrongfully feel is your due from such an egocentric place and start looking at reality with intent to see the world with some modicum of objectivity. Teaching is not only a job but it IS a job. If you truly appreciate that reality then you may come to appreciate what wonderful pleasure can genuinely be found from teaching, compared to other work. But expect that as the norm and you'll be yet another bitter and jaded person who struggles through without truly appreciating the positives and who can only dwell on places to frown and complain.

PS. There's nothing remotely revelatory in anything I've said, to anyone familiar with the concepts of mindfulness and buddhism. For someone who is so into pseudo-profundity, you really ought to read up on such things. Appreciation of positives goes a long way.

[m1469]

Feel free to read my second post in this thread and respond directly to any idea in that.  There is nothing wrong with a professional musician and teacher wanting to find a path that is deeper and more expanded.  It is like telling a student that they can never play anything but Michael Jackson - and the rest of the improvement one makes musically has to be *only* mental.  That's simply not all there is to how it works for musicians as students, and that isn't all there is to how it works for teachers.

[nyiregyhazi]

Feel free to read my second post in this thread and respond directly to any idea in that.  There is nothing wrong with a professional musician and teacher wanting to find a path that is deeper and more expanded.

What did you suggest will achieve that? I didn't notice a single suggestion- only a vapid foundationless desire for this to be so. I saw a lot of complaints about problems, but I didn't notice any speculations about how to find solutions to them, amongst all the complaining. If I missed any, by all means quote them. It's very popular to vent about problems these days, but it typically increases the inner unhappiness when people merely make complaints. There are only two meaningful courses of action- either stop complaining for its own sake and start taking some form of action in a way that might actually solve those complaints. Or learn to accept a situation as it is and appreciate both that we can't sculpt every single thing about reality to our whim and that acceptance makes for more happiness than empty complaints.

What solutions have you proposed from the first category?

[m1469]

The solutions are not new.  Go to Grad School (that would be a possible next step professionally), get another degree that would theoretically give me different options, or at least theoretically be another step closer.  Or, get training and opportunity in other ways; training could come by way of private study with teacher, or a specialized kind of school.

Those things mean to me the possibility of working somewhere that is meant for a different type of student.  But, perhaps there is a way to skip more degrees and schooling, and go straight to working somewhere that is meant for a different type of student.

One of the reasons I posted this is because I think it really is the reality of a situation like mine,  or maybe all teaching situations in some way but -of course- nobody bothers to truly be that honest with me, that I must basically accept all students who walk through my door and who have a pulse.  And, I say that with a certain happiness that they do walk through the door.  I have no desire to convince you of my reasons for and sincerity in teaching.  And, having no professional support from colleagues is one of the things that is rather tiresome about this profession in general.  Sorry, but that's the truth and I am learning that not *all* business models are like that.

It also happens to be a moment in my life where I am coming to a realization that there is truly something different about teaching various types of music, and that the content of the lessons matter in ways that are truly deeper than whether or not a student "has fun" with the music they are playing.  I'm sure you can think of some kind of snide remark about that.  But, an improvement would theoretically be to teach more of what I find to be more substantial content, but I'm so far not convinced that could be a business that would pay the bills.

I actually do care about the quality of music education, and why it is or is not important to continue with traditional content.

What did you suggest will achieve that? I didn't notice a single suggestion- only a vapid foundationless desire for this to be so. I saw a lot of complaints about problems, but I didn't notice any speculations about how to find solutions to them, amongst all the complaining. If I missed any, by all means quote them. It's very popular to vent about problems these days, but it typically increases the inner unhappiness when people merely make complaints. There are only two meaningful courses of action- either stop complaining for its own sake and start taking some form of action in a way that might actually solve those complaints. Or learn to accept a situation as it is and appreciate both that we can't sculpt every single thing about reality to our whim and that acceptance makes for more happiness than empty complaints.

What solutions have you proposed from the first category?

Not a solution though of course you are treating it as one, and you are right, nothing new.

[awesom_o]

Have you thought about taking Suzuki teacher training?

I think it's the best option, from a business perspective, for the freelance teacher.

[amytsuda]

m1469, How are you marketing your piano teacher business? How do you get your students? There are many things teachers do. Website / yelp - some teachers plainly state that they only want to teach teenagers who are truly committed to become a musician to ones who say I love just sharing the joy of music with toddlers. Some flyer in library, grocery store, local schools, many teachers promote themselves, and you need to communicate what students you want.

Referrals with other teachers - some like to teach Jingle Bell to kids who don't practice and some like to teach Bach. Definitely, going back to school helps you find those networks, but also taking a piano lesson from a very established teacher will help you create such networks because s/he knows tons of teachers.

Also you need to grow your business, so you can actually start sending out ones you don't want to teach to others. If you need 20 students to pay bills, try to aim 30 students constantly, and send ones you don't like to other teachers. I know some teachers do local concerts, perform in churches, or even take church music director jobs, to broaden their reach. Also that builds your resumes and richer resumes attract students who are interested in them.

And I agree with nylregy, you should just happily take the money from students who don't meet your standard. You may not be fulfilled, but students are fulfilled with their music interest, that's why they come back. Even they didn't practice, they still come to you, because they want to maintain their ties with music. In their perspectives, they are fulfilled. Let them be. Repeat the same thing you said last time with smile, and if they remember, say "good job", and take the money. And by that, you are actually giving more to the kids. Otherwise, kids would eventually hate music feeling inferior.  If they really make you unhappy, really don't take them. Tell them you know a better teacher to teach such repertoires and send them to ones who like them.

[m1469]

Been there, done that.  Bought the hat, have the T-Shirts.  There is nothing you have mentioned that I have not done or do not currently do, or have not heavily entertained (like going back to school, which included auditions).  Been doing this for long enough to not call me new at it anymore.  Only once have I actually truly put out the mentality to trim my studio.  I don't see myself being in that position again.  Almost all advice I am reading is very obviously coming from individuals who see the musical world as this big pool around them, it is simply not like that here.  There are some great musicians here.  I know them.  They know me.  We have worked together, we do work together.  I aimed at broadening my horizons by traveling out and working with new teachers, meeting new musicians, having new experiences, auditioning for Graduate Schools ... all to the extent that I could.  The End.  

Anyway, I can barely remember the start of this thread.  It wasn't directly about me, but about teaching in general, and a position I am finding myself in within the profession of teaching.

[nyiregyhazi]

Not a solution though of course you are treating it as one, and you are right, nothing new.

Actually, it is a solution. There are people who do jobs outside of music altogether who lead rewarding musical lives. So, it's plain wrong to feel cheated out of musical satisfaction by having to work with any student who doesn't have lofty ideals. It's a gross disrespect to that student.  Anything you gain as a musician through teaching is a gift. A true artist doesn't depend on teaching others to be able grow as a musician anyway. They do it chiefly in their playing and practising. If you don't feel growth as a musician, stop blaming students for that and look to what you're doing to satisfy yourself as a musician, outside of teaching. It's down to me to satisfy myself musically, not down to my students to be expected to have to inspire me. Work with the most talented students is a great bonus to me- not something I am either owed or dependent on to feel any musical satisfaction. It's great when students inspire me but it's primarily up to me to satisfy myself musically outside of giving lessons. If I couldn't do that, no student can be blamed, only myself.

Anyway, framing reality sensibly and accepting it (rather than seeing less ambitious students as robbing something from you) is the answer to unhappiness that is founded upon a completely unreasonable sense of entitlement. Regardless, if you refuse a solution based on acceptance, then stop complaining about problems and devote all your attention to finding other meaningful solutions. 

[nyiregyhazi]

Been there, done that.   Bought the hat, have the T-Shirts.   There is nothing you have mentioned that I have not done or do not currently do, or have not heavily entertained (like going back to school, which included auditions).  Been doing this for long enough to not call me new at it anymore.  

Then either come up with a solution of your own, or try accepting reality from a place of humility (rather than from the belief that life owes you everything you wish). It looks like it's about time you tried the latter. Your every post is all about protecting complaints, not moving to solutions. It's extremely tiresome. If you have not found solutions, it's time to either quit the profession and see how musically satisfying life is in the McDonald's Kitchen or learn to find joy in pleasures that are already available (and to take responsiblity for your musical satisfaction OUTSIDE of your teaching, rather than expect your students to do it all for you). This incessant complaining about the absence of something on a plate is a tiresome dead end.

You can either tell people that you know it all already, to protect your status quo of discontent, or you can try considering the possibility that you haven't actually understood the essence of their advice in the least.

[m1469]

Have you thought about taking Suzuki teacher training?

No, not seriously, but one of my students did in fact complete some of it.  And this would not be the source of a new inspiration for me, especially considering I have known all along that it exists, that I could do something about it, and that I've never felt inclined.

[m1469]

You can either tell people that you know it all already, to protect your status quo of discontent, or you can try considering the possibility that you haven't actually understood the essence of their advice in the least.

Or, maybe I have perfectly understood it and I actually just don't have it in me to keep doing all this the same ways that I have been doing it for this long already.  Maybe, despite the fact that I can still muster some hurt and sadness over it, it is honestly just time for me to move on from something I truly love(d) and built my entire life around.

[nyiregyhazi]

Or, maybe I have perfectly understood it and I actually just don't have it in me to keep doing all this the same ways that I have been doing it for this long already.  Maybe, despite the fact that I can still muster some hurt and sadness over it, it is honestly time for me to move on.

Yes, maybe you should give serious consideration. Seeing as you've already understood everybody's suggestions so well, there's nothing else left for you but the discontent that you come back to at every available chance. You're not showing the slightest interest in solutions so either get out, try possible solutions with an open mind (rather than dismiss them on such a bizarre casual basis as lack of inclination to try them) or learn to see positives before negatives and appreciate quite how lucky you are. Above all, stop making empty complaints for their own sake. It's repulsive.

[m1469]

Yes, maybe you should give serious consideration. Seeing as you've already understood everybody's suggestions so well, there's nothing else left for you. You're not showing the slightest interest in solutions so either get out, try possible solutions with an open mind (rather than dismiss them on such a bizarre casual basis as lack of inclination to try them) or learn to see positives before negatives and appreciate quite how lucky you are. Above all, stop making empty complaints for their own sake. It's repulsive.

You know nothing about me.

[nyiregyhazi]

You know nothing about me.

I know what I've read in this thread, not to mention the appalling behaviour that you refused to apologise for, towards keypeg. Your whole existence is about you and what you think the world owes you, not about others. This thread alone shows that loud and clear. The world owes you nothing. Either earn the things you want through positive action or learn to accept that you aren't getting it and adjust your expectations. You're talking like a spoiled child who has everything they need but can only see the world in terms of what they still want. Learn some appreciation first for what you already have- notably the fact that you can earn in a very small amount of time what some struggling musicians have to work hours in dead-end jobs for- thus buying you time in which to practise. Your first post here truly disgusted me.

If you want musical satisfaction then go and get it for yourself and stop blaming the fact that ordinary people want to learn piano too for the fact that you are failing to satisfy yourself musically. Classic transference.

[awesom_o]

No, not seriously, but one of my students did in fact complete some of it.  And this would not be the source of a new inspiration for me

I wasn't suggesting it as a source of inspiration. Suzuki could be very wise from a business perspective, and you might enjoy it more than working at McDonald's.

You seem to view teaching as a source of personal musical inspiration. It isn't that. It's a way to serve the community and support yourself financially in turn.

If you want musical inspiration, I suggest you compose music. Teaching music is a profession that requires expertise, but at the end of the day, it IS a job.

I want a hair dresser, a car mechanic, and a dentist who have real expertise in their fields. I want them to be dedicated to their work. I don't pay them to be personally inspired, or to get satisfaction from their job. I pay them to be professional, and to do a good job. Teaching music isn't all that different from other service professions.

There is no perfect method for learning music, including Suzuki. However, being a Suzuki teacher is better for both the teacher and the students than simply 'winging it' on your own musical experience, no matter how extensive it may be.

[m1469]

Well, per usual, I know that my points are being misconstrued on purpose, so I'm not going to go about explaining things that are actually already explained.  

What I would like from the profession of teaching is to be able to have the opportunity to go ahead and employ more of my expertise and to gain more expertise in ways that are of deep interest to me.  Who feels differently than that?  I like to work.  I like to use my entire self.  I like to put everything I've got into something, and I simply feel it's not going to be possible along the track that I am going.  That is one of the points with regard to the content of lessons in general, in that I see it can have a direct relationship.  And sorry, there is no requirement that all teachers become Suzuki trained teachers, and of course I have a right to decide if I'm going to take the time and effort to study a specific type of school.  There are things about it that are of some kind of interest to me, but not enough to make it the big focus of my life and basis of my teaching.  

It would be nice to have the time and energy to put into actually developing some of the pedagogical ideas I do have.  Maybe working as something other than a music teacher would provide me that opportunity  

[awesom_o]

there is no requirement that all teachers become Suzuki trained teachers, and of course I have a right to decide if I'm going to take the time and effort to study a specific type of school.

  Maybe working as something other than a music teacher would provide me that opportunity  

Of course there are no requirements that everyone become a Suzuki teacher. Nobody wants to infringe on your right to NOT teach Suzuki. Nobody cares what or how you teach, except perhaps the people who pay you.  I was merely saying that Suzuki is good on many levels, one of which is the 'running your own business' level.

I think it would be GREAT for you to work in a field other than music-teaching. You might learn a lot, and it might help you to figure out how to eventually go from 'teaching' to 'Teaching'!

[m1469]

.

[amytsuda]

Well, per usual, I know that my points are being misconstrued on purpose

We just wanted you to be happy. Your way of writing sounded you are not happy, so we just tried to offer ideas and solutions. I don't think anyone tries to misconstrue anything on purpose. So I guess it was just lost in translation.

[awesom_o]

 I am no stranger to the non-musical world, either (what do you suppose is part of what gave me the big idea to work so hard, against the grains and tides, at becoming a musician and making a living out of doing so?), but my guess is that you actually are.  

If I were smart and cunning, I'd be a financial analyst or a stock trader, instead of a composer

If I were cool, I'd be a DJ or a pop star  

I don't suppose you work so hard at becoming a musician. That's something you suppose!

[m1469]

Of course there are no requirements that everyone become a Suzuki teacher. Nobody wants to infringe on your right to NOT teach Suzuki. Nobody cares what or how you teach, except perhaps the people who pay you.  I was merely saying that Suzuki is good on many levels, one of which is the 'running your own business' level.

From a business perspective, it would also be great if I had a chance to study all of the Beethoven Sonatas, the Chopin Etudes, more about Bach, more about Theory, more about History, more about Taubman, and more about several schools of thought, including Suzuki, including Russian, including French, including German, and in a way that I could discuss it with individuals who are actually vested in the discussion.

[awesom_o]

From a business perspective, it would also be great if I had a chance to study all of the Beethoven Sonatas, the Chopin Etudes, more about Bach, more about Theory.....

Nothing but your ever-ascending count of lengthy, meandering, pointless posts is stopping you from actually doing so! 

[m1469]

...we just tried to offer ideas and solutions.

Well, I think it's a pivotal point in my life and even though that's not what I had planned to bring up I guess it came out.  What I am personally looking for in my life is a way to professionally move forward, and if it's going to be in music, to take an already established music career, and one with certain experiences already within it, to a new level.  

[m1469]

Nothing but your ever-ascending count of lengthy, meandering, pointless posts is stopping you from actually doing so!

Right, because for you and for everybody else in the music profession, all of your own musical and professional growth didn't have anything to do with change or new opportunities, it was about everything staying the same, you staying in one single place, and just making the most out of it.

I have thousands of times silently decided to go it on my own from the ground up and I keep hitting the same wall.  I'm sure that's the case for everybody else here, too.

[Bob]

You're going to get BS, but a different kind of BS with other types of students. 

[m1469]

The world owes you nothing.

Yes, I do agree with you.  My guess is that we may have different ideas of what that means, but I agree and this is not what I am talking about.  I am talking about the desire to move forward.  Not difficult to understand, and I'm sure you've had plenty of that opportunity in your own life.

I am actually very grateful for what my music profession has been for me thus far.  I simply have more to give and would like to give it.

[m1469]

You're going to get BS, but a different kind of BS with other types of students. 

Well, I figure this is highly likely.

[Bob]

How about becoming a priestess?     I could see something along those lines.