Computer technology in piano class

[lenkaolenka]

Obviously, all the people in this forum are already familiar with computers at some point. 
What do you think about using computers in teaching piano?  What computer programs of teaching music and piano do you know and what do you think of them?

[jpianoflorida]

Thanks for opening up this post!   I've already started this discussion twice but there wasn't much response.    First of all, I want you to know I have nothing against your ideas and I would be more than happy to explore them. My only problem with you was that you were putting down others ways of teaching. It came accross that you were only trying to promote your product. I am always eager to try new approaches to teaching.   I apologize to you if I took your posts the wrong way. Sometimes I think we also have a language barrier(translation) on this forum with so many people from all over the world. Can we start over and agree to be more respectful of each other and share ideas?   I'm willing to do that.           

I use piano suite software and have also used a few others as supplements.      Where is soft mozart available and please share more about it.     

[tiasjoy]

I had a computer set up in my studio a couple of years ago.  The kids were very excited and keen to use it.  They use computers for everything these days.  I had a few websites set up for them to play ear training games, history games, orchestra games etc.  I used Finale to help develop note naming (this was VERY popular but also VERY time consuming) and of course composition.

I decided though, in a half hour lesson, there just wasn't the time to put aside for work on the computer, so I brought it upstairs and that's what I'm typing on now!!

I even had my own website where kids could interact with one another (and me).  After the initial excitement wore down, nobody used it.  

Now and then I wonder if I should put the computer back.   But I haven't yet.

[jpianoflorida]

what all can you do with FINALE?    i have 2 computers set up in my waiting room for students to use ..i have piano suite on them, but always looking for new interesting software. 

[lenkaolenka]

Can we start over and agree to be more respectful of each other and share ideas?   I'm willing to do that.           

I use piano suite software and have also used a few others as supplements.      Where is soft mozart available and please share more about it.     

My problem #1 is English.
My problem #2 is passion. I dedicated 30 years of my life doing this research. God only knows how much I had suffered to make it to the point I am right now. When people accuse me of 'promoting product', I lose my temper.
Thank you very much for your kind words! I would love to start over!

[jpianoflorida]

very good!    So tell us specifics of "soft mozart" please.      Where do you get it? Do you start begginners with it?   Give us some details.

[lenkaolenka]

very good!    So tell us specifics of "soft mozart" please.      Where do you get it? Do you start begginners with it?   Give us some details.

First, I have to say, that Soft Mozart is not just a computer program. It is rather a system of teaching music as a language. At first, we made a nice box and made a contract with Micro centers. They put software on display with no luck. The same happened to us in different music conventions. By passing by or seeing a box, people unable to grasp the whole idea of this system. I would love to share the whole concept with all of you, but it would take me awhile and it involves a lot of video observations, articles reading, demo testing and such. If you would agree to this, I would explain

Soft Mozart has 2 websites:
1.   Interactive – -https://www.softmozart.com
2.   Informative – -https://www.doremifasoft.com

I teach students from 2+ to university students, also I teach and certify teachers after they learn the system.

[lenkaolenka]

I had a computer set up in my studio a couple of years ago.  The kids were very excited and keen to use it.  They use computers for everything these days.  I had a few websites set up for them to play ear training games, history games, orchestra games etc.  I used Finale to help develop note naming (this was VERY popular but also VERY time consuming) and of course composition.

I decided though, in a half hour lesson, there just wasn't the time to put aside for work on the computer, so I brought it upstairs and that's what I'm typing on now!!

I even had my own website where kids could interact with one another (and me).  After the initial excitement wore down, nobody used it.  

Now and then I wonder if I should put the computer back.   But I haven't yet.

The idea to put computer in classroom is recently old. When computers came out it was obvious, that their interactivity could help in music study, many inventors developed music learning software and many of them… got bankruptcy. 
There are several reasons for the fact, that computers are not used in class rooms much:
1.   Many computer programs just trying to copy a teacher: they put the same information as any book or teacher could give. But people prefer live contact, personality of teacher, and human warmness.
2.   Many computer programs use the same traditional format for training, which any good teacher could do better also.

No wander, that you didn't fully use computer in classroom. In my opinion, computer program of music training have to be a valuable tool, which help teachers to avoid routine work and make learning effective. In my classroom computer develops students' coordination, ability to read, play and memorize music. My job as a teacher – to polish and to give more professional advices.

[lenkaolenka]

First, I want to introduce you to our Note Duration computer game.

It is quite simple to play and understand and does not require a connection between piano and computer.

This game I use with the youngest students (2-3 years old kids can play it).

It develops eye-hand coordination, ear, rhythm, teaches note duration and later I use the game to teach how to count notes.

*Please, do not buy anything! Just explore. For educators all this system could be for free and all the games are part of the system.*

Go to this page -https://-https://www.doremifasoft.com/noducoga.html  and download free demo version. You have to play the game using only space bar of you computer.
 

[penguinlover]

I  just found out about  Soft Mozart this week, and am interested in how it works.  I think  I would need to actually see it work, are there any demonstrations on it here in America?  I only have one computer, and it's in the next room.  I use it sometimes for ear training for my advanced student, but he has an hour long lesson.  I would love to have a studio like Jay, and have a waiting room, and activities on the computer ready for the early birds.  That is my dream someday.

[lenkaolenka]

I  just found out about  Soft Mozart this week, and am interested in how it works.  I think  I would need to actually see it work, are there any demonstrations on it here in America?  I only have one computer, and it's in the next room.  I use it sometimes for ear training for my advanced student, but he has an hour long lesson.  I would love to have a studio like Jay, and have a waiting room, and activities on the computer ready for the early birds.  That is my dream someday.

We have many different demonstrations about Soft Mozart, indeed!
SM several times was on TV: (look for 11 news, channel 2, News on KHAN TV-36, WB-39 news.) here -https://-https://www.doremifasoft.com/events.html
 There are different stories about children and young adults.
You also could see SM in action with different students: (we mostly displayed beginners, but we use the program with advanced students, too):
Look for Learning to play "Musette in D" by J.S.Bach's in one lesson here  -https://-https://www.softmozart.com/Site/home.php

Some instructions how to work with young students here: -https://-https://www.softmozart.com/Site/section.php?section=13

You may buy a computer for as much as $150 – 200 on ebay (shipping included) to run the program. I and SM teachers use the program not as an extra, but as a main tool to teach students to play music pieces, memorize them, to learn how to sight read and to learn Solfeggio and chords. Students have more intensive and effective practice this way, they enjoy it and they see exactly what is wrong and how to fix it in precise numbers. They have program at home and practice with it with no force. So, it is win-win situation. 
.

[penguinlover]

I only watched the demonstration of the young man learning the Mussette, so I am sure this question might be answered if I studied more.  Do they learn fingering?  To read traditional music?  It seemed like he was "reading" moving dots.  What about arpeggios, scales, and all the other stuff we teach our students? 

[lenkaolenka]

Do they learn fingering?   
Yes! But the concept is a little different to what we all got use to. The system let them see each key and each music note from the very beginning. They play music fluently with help of vision and in 1st presentation they read 'Elementary' music score and it helps them mostly to concentrate on coordination development. So, they figure out the most optimal fingering by themselves most of the time, when they get more familiar with music. But teacher have to control the process and help them, when he/she sees, that they need guidance.

I am working with SM for more then 5 years already and NEVER had problem with students, which 'learned wrong fingering and stuck with it', due to the fact, that visual and audio perception wouldn't make muscle memory so crucial in learning process.
For example, take a look at the video: Learning a piano song with a young child
Here: -https://-https://www.softmozart.com/Site/article.php?article=53
At the end of the process of learning 'Hot Cross Buns' a 3-year old student all of or sudden place all the correct fingers, when she plays Right Hand. It happens naturally most of the time. 

[lenkaolenka]

How they learn to read traditional music score,

We use traditional Grand Staff from the very beginning, but we 'translated' it for eyes of learners.
1.   If spaces and lines are the same tracks, they are presented in the same width at the elementary level. Beginners won't think that the white track is just a break between lines.
2.   If music notes are all either on spaces or on lines, they are displayed in two contrasting colors for the beginners' eyes to instantly catch the difference.
3.   If the treble and base clefs are two different systems, they are presented in two different colors, for example, colors of a tree. It would help to explain the gradual changes in pitch - from dark to light, from trunk to crown.
4.   If the music notes go up and down, and the corresponding keys go from right to left, they are lined up by turning the Grand Staff sideways in the elementary presentation to help beginners to see a straight link between them right away.
5.   If the music notes have only seven names for all the keys and sounds, they are labeled with the names to help beginners see the relationship easily, without having to struggle to look for information.

After that we gradually take all the help away


With 'Elementary' visual presentations teacher and student can concentrate more on coordination development. On the more advanced Grand Staff presentation we sight-read a lot of simple music pieces.

[lenkaolenka]

Presentations 5 and 6

[lenkaolenka]

Piano keys are color-coded in the same way with the help of removable stickers: they have green and brown stripes as well as red and blue circles with the names of notes.

Key guides behind the keys now replace the stickers on the piano keys. The stickers are then removed completely when the students do not need visual support to see the keys.
https://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/doremifasoft_1926_286397

[lenkaolenka]

' It seemed like he was "reading" moving dots.'

Shifting eye-focus along 25 black and white tracks of music notation is not something people learned to do in their lives. We usually deal with one line at a time, when we read books. In order to develop ability of any beginners fluently read music notation, we developed ways of supporting eye focus with help of computer technology.

So, in Elementary Grand Staff presentations we use 'Sun beam' and beginners do not have to deal with shifting the focus, because music notes come to one spot. After coordination and reading skills developed, we 'release' support of eye focus in presentation 6, which is practically 'music sheet'

[lenkaolenka]

What about arpeggios, scales, and all the other stuff we teach our students? 

The same here! In fact, we start teaching students to play Hannon, Chromatic scale, triads, C – major from very first lessons and from the age of 2+:
-https://-https://www.doremifasoft.com/frvipiex.html

The system does not conflict with anything, that traditional teacher do. It just adds some visual support to learning process and interactivity element, that's all!

Well, hope my explenations were helpful! 
I tried my best!

[Bob]

The teaching I've done using computers has made me a little jaded.  For groups of students, public school, it's a pain in the butt. 

Getting all the software set up, making sure it works right on all the computers, all that effort doesn't pay off, except that you can say you taught with technology.

And then there are concepts you can teach with paper and a pencil anyway.  Not really a need for using software.

And with computers you have to have a backup plan because they will stall out on you at some point.  With the tightness of time in a 30 minute lesson, having to restart a computer or troubleshoot it isn't practical.

At two schools, college level, I have seen a teacher do a group piano class using a special projector that allowed him to show fingerings to the whole class at once.  That was effective I thought.  And then of course the ear training software students can use on their own.  I think that's useful.

[lenkaolenka]

The teaching I've done using computers has made me a little jaded.  For groups of students, public school, it's a pain in the butt. 

I am sorry, that you had such unpleasant experience. I did too and could agree with you before I started teaching with Soft Mozart. All of the software, which ever was developed before SM could be easily replaced with a teacher. SM – a very valuable tool, which makes any teacher's work more effective and professional. 

Getting all the software set up, making sure it works right on all the computers, all that effort doesn't pay off, except that you can say you taught with technology.

Disagree. I use computers and Soft Mozart for 5+ years in my class as well as many other piano and music teachers in private, public and music schools in USA, UK, Canada, Mexico, Spain, Costa Rica and Russia (-https://-https://www.doremifasoft.com/pianoclasses.html ). This system is WORTH making all the efforts, because it works like nothing else. Here what one public school music teacher said about it: -https://-https://www.doremifasoft.com/pipupiupskus.html

And then there are concepts you can teach with paper and a pencil anyway.  Not really a need for using software.

Disagree. To play piano is not the same as to learn reading. Music notation is rather a  spatial map, then literature. I think, teaching to play piano and sight-reading should be trained the way we are training pilots – with 'computer simulators'. Words and explanations are unable to train muscles, eyes and ears of learners to do what they suppose to as effectively, as computer system SM.

And with computers you have to have a backup plan because they will stall out on you at some point.  With the tightness of time in a 30 minute lesson, having to restart a computer or troubleshoot it isn't practical.

I taught traditionally before and I state, that when I started teaching with SM, the lessons became many times more intense and productive. Even if I would have top restart computer ( I do not remember it happening often, though), students could learn with SM more, then with teacher in an hour.

At two schools, college level, I have seen a teacher do a group piano class using a special projector that allowed him to show fingerings to the whole class at once.  That was effective I thought.  And then of course the ear training software students can use on their own.  I think that's useful.

I think, teaching whole group the same thing is pretty dull idea. People are all different and have different pace in learning. SM teaches everyone individually even in group setting.

[penguinlover]

This is really new to me, so pardon the silly questions.  How long does it take for a student  to be able to read a normal piece of music, not on the computer?  I know this will vary with each student, but on an average, for let's say a ten year old.  Are you limited to just what SM has in the computer, or can you vary the music, and put your own in?   Do you have to keep buying more software to add music?  See, I told you  they were the basic dumb questions, but I am intrigued with the  product.

[lenkaolenka]

How long does it take for a student  to be able to read a normal piece of music, not on the computer? I know this will vary with each student, but on an average, for let's say a ten year old.

Many piano teachers do not realize simple fact about music reading: it is not enough to UNDERSTAND how music notation is organized. To read music involves eye-sight of students and to develop vision to SEE notation, to grasp it as a whole is also physiological and psychological process, that can't be developed with words. Also this is very individual process.

I had 3 – 4 years old students, who had learned to read  fluently from the sheet music ( we read simple pieces, such James Bastien Christmas songs Level 1, Boogie Rock & Country and Nursery 1 in bulk, book by book). I had 7-10 years old students, who struggled to go from presentation 5 to 6 in Favorite classics primer of the same series. . Majority of my student sight-read  without struggles, though, because they had intensive practice to do so from the very first year.

The program just give any teacher something that no teacher ever had before – control over student's progress and power and knowledge to offer  individual and 'custom made' way of development of 'music vision' to each individual.

Another point to ponder. When we teach piano, we have to realize, that our students have many problems to deal with at once: coordination, reading, hearing, eye-focus. By throwing all this problems on the beginners at the same time we are not only losing control over the situation – we may cause all the cramps, problems with technique and fears in future. SM just helps to keep healthy balance and develops all the components wisely, in gentle and organized way.  For example, when I teach my students music pieces, which is very challenging for their coordination, I make visual presentation more elementary and when we start learning sight-reading I give them easy for coordination songs.

[lenkaolenka]

Are you limited to just what SM has in the computer, or can you vary the music, and put your own in? 

SM is a tool for music development of students and we have pretty solid and selected by best world's piano schools repertoire to establish the most professional foundation to play piano, read music, write music dictations and pick chords by ear. If some of our teachers suggest more pieces, we program them, but we keep the process under control, because OUR GOAL IS NOT TO GIVE PEOPLE A 'FISH' AND GET HOOKED TO OUR SYSTEM, BUT TO GIVE THEM A 'NET' – ABILITY TO READ MUSIC NOTATION FLUENTLY.

Do you have to keep buying more software to add music?

We acknowledge, that everything in this world cost money, but many music companies went too far by offering very low effective or no effective ways to teach music and charging people big bucks for that. We want to change this attitude.

Music literacy – is our primer goal. Here is our plan:
1.   Music teachers should not be charged for our system. Our partnership is based more on 'depositary' basis. They pay some insignificant 'honest' money, learn the system and start teaching with it.
2.   Students pay for the software and materials for home practice. Part of the payment supports a teacher – part invested in our company to let us grow.

Teachers who affiliated with us get the full version of software and they always have all the music pieces. Students have to download extra pieces off the Internet and pay insignificant cost for extra albums.

We KNOW, that program effectively works and it is practically fail-proof. We KNOW that soon enough this system would be in every house hold like TV or computers. This is why we offer more then we charge – we have future.

[lenkaolenka]

Did anybody try Note Duration game?