Would you rather have a Steinway B or a Mason and Hamlin BB?

[thalberg]

 Okay, I ran this poll in in instruments forum but no one was voting.  PLEASE VOTE!!!!  I'm curious about this.

[Waldszenen]

I see few people visit the Instruments forum.

[whynot]

Well, if I could try them first, then whatever I liked, of course.  But if sight unseen (which is how I voted), the M & S.  Sweet.

[pianonut]

i don't really know the difference between a hamburg steinway and a regular one.  what do they do different in germany?  is there little difference?  or is there some discrepancy in how the piano is made?

how about a steinway D?  ok, i voted steinway B.

[thalberg]

Well, pianonut, I *thought* I knew the difference between Hamburg and New York, which was that Hamburg had a Renner action and New York had a Steinway action.  But a salesman yesterday told me that is not the case--they ALL have Steinway actions.  So, that's out the window.

I've also heard that New York ones start with softer hammers then lacquer them, but the Hamburg ones start with harder hammers, then needle them. I heard this from a world-class piano technician, so that's reliable.

But you know, I've actually never played a Hamburg Steinway.  I read interviews where Leif Ove Andsnes and Emanuel Ax both prefer New York.  But people on this forum seem to like Hamburg, as does one amazingly talented friend of mine.

Does anyone know why it seems so much easier to play softly on a Steinway than on a Mason?  I'm frustrated by this, because I like the Mason sound better overall.

[pianonut]

maybe the action is stiffer.  about the hammers on ny steinways - laquered would be something you had to ask for wouldn't it.  i would refuse to buy one that had been laquered.  i hate that sound.  it's what honky tonk pianos sound like after 20 years when the felt is worn down and someone tries to save money on refelting.  a little fingernail polish?

[Floristan]

I've always loved M&H BBs.  My first serious teacher had one, and the sound has always stuck with me.  I like Hamburg Steinways better than NY Steinways, but I'm just tired of hearing nothing but Steinways.  They have such a stranglehold on the concert halls and universities.

[e60m5]

Hamburgs do use Renner actions.

[thalberg]

Hamburgs use Renner?  See, that's what I said to the salesman and he said I was wrong.  When am I going to learn never to believe a salesman?  They know nothing, and when they do know something, they lie about it anyway.

[Waldszenen]

Nothing annoys me more than salesmen who don't know anything about what they're selling... or those who mislead you.

[gfiore]

  Sorry Thalberg, the salesman was only half correct. The Hamburg Steinway's don't use a Renner action. The action is of the same design as the New York pianos, minus the half-round balance rail bearings, but  they do use Renner action parts and hammer heads.

[thalberg]

Oh, okay.  Do you think the half-round balance rail is the reason why NY Steinways have such a good palette of tone colors?  I've always found I can get what I want so easily out of them.

[gfiore]

 No the the half-round balance rail bearings are one the of the components that make up the Steinway accelerated action. They contribute to increasing repetition speed, and have nothing to do with directly manipulating tone.