Metronome or not???

[nicolaievich]

People, i have heard that using the metronome too much is not good. how to know the limit?? or, in which stage of studying a piece should one get involved with the metronome?

[rapmasterb]

Golden rule: Metronome is used for scales and technical exercises only; you do not ever play a piece with the metronome running along for the duration.

The metronome is used with pieces to get a good read of the correct speed however you should listen to the beat, get it ingrained and then play without the metronome.

I have always been taught that the metronome is dangerous if used wrongly. I'm sure there are special circumstances (tough passages maybe?) in which you can play along with the metronome and break the above rule but I'd be conservative.

Don't get me wrong the metronome is very useful and a must for any aspiring pianist. Who was it that said "A metronome is worth it's weight in gold?" - oh yeah, ME.

[bernhard]

Good advice by rapmasterb.

When should you stop using the metronome? When you start enjoying it and looking forward to a practice session with the metronome (serious!)

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[timothy42b]

I think there may be a use for running the metronome during an entire piece - not all the time of course, but to teach the student to hear.

I have noticed that beginners, which includes myself, do not hear some of the hesitations that they make. 

In particular, as they go from section to section, or to a repeat or a coda, etc., they stop and reset fingers and mentally prepare to go on, without noticing it at all.  This breaks the fluency of the piece, but only for an audience.  The brain of the player seems unable to detect it.  That's a skill that develops, but slowly. 

Putting a metronome with it makes this instantly obvious.  You could use a recording to show the same thing, but the feedback is too delayed. 

So I sometimes use a metronome while running through an entire piece, and I start listening harder at those breaks of section that I know are going to give me trouble.   No, I don't enjoy it, yet!  If I ever do I'll quit right away, I promise. 

[maul]

Well, I used to use it for pieces when I was a beginner, but now I rarely ever do. I just use my "mind metronome" now.

[llamaman]

I use it for pieces that I have trouble with my speed with. And of course, scales/triads/arpeggios and hanon.

[timothy42b]

Well, I used to use it for pieces when I was a beginner, but now I rarely ever do. I just use my "mind metronome" now.

Yes, exactly.  I think that the mind metronome is developed, and one method is to internalize the external metronome.  

I also think the mind metronome is subject to getting out of calibration, and needs a periodic tuneup.  

[nicolaievich]

I have noticed that beginners, which includes myself, do not hear some of the hesitations that they make. 

In particular, as they go from section to section, or to a repeat or a coda, etc., they stop and reset fingers and mentally prepare to go on, without noticing it at all.  This breaks the fluency of the piece, but only for an audience.  The brain of the player seems unable to detect it.  That's a skill that develops, but slowly. 

That's true, i include myself in that category, there are sections where i seem to loose the beat.  Yes, the mind metronome is able to be improved, but how exactly? just turning on the metronome in the bars where there are problems?? because while playing one tends to have some kind of inertia, and that intertia grows from the first bar... Or one can just get rid of the metronome and repeat the conflict bars until one can hear the beat and the problem dissapear?? 

[Souza]

You can download a Dissertation, PDF files at:

https://etd.lsu.edu/docs/available/etd-04082004-223228/

Hanberry, Melody A. - Doctor of Philosophy (Ph.D.),  Dissertation:

"Effects of Practice Strategies, Metronome Use, Meter, Hand, and Musical Function on Dual-Staved Piano Performance Accuracy and Practice Time Usage of Undergraduate Non-Keyboard Music Majors"

The purposes of this study were: 1) To assess the effects of practice strategies, metronome, meter, hand, and musical function on piano performance accuracy of undergraduate music majors enrolled in piano class (N=39), and 2) To assess the effects of practice strategies on practice time relative to two unfamiliar pieces of keyboard music. Throughout an eight-week training session, treatment subjects were provided strategies for practicing unfamiliar pieces of keyboard music and were allowed time in class to apply the strategies while practicing. Strategies included score analysis, isolating hand position shifts, practicing unfamiliar chords, practicing measures with accidentals, and using the metronome to provide a slow practice tempo. Control subjects practiced the same pieces but were not taught the strategies.
Pretests and posttests were conducted. Subjects were randomly assigned one piece with right hand melody and one piece with left hand melody. Half of treatment and half of control subjects were selected randomly to perform pretest and posttest pieces with the metronome set to 60 beats per minute. Following each 8-minute practice session, subjects performed each selection.

Analyses of pretest and posttest performance data revealed main effects of test (posttest scores were higher than pretest scores with regard to pitch, rhythm, and beat), function (melody scores were better than accompaniment scores with regard to pitch), and meter (scores on the piece in 2/4 were higher than scores on the piece in 3/4 with regard to rhythm and beat consistency). Significant interactions among group and metronome; test, meter, and group; and meter and metronome were detected. No significant differences in pitch, rhythm, or beat consistency accuracy between groups due to the practice strategies were detected. Analysis of posttest practice sessions revealed that subjects spent the majority of their practice time performing the given selections at the piano, and the least amount of practice time analyzing the scores. Treatment subjects used score analysis techniques presented during treatment, but their practice did not reflect the strategies listed on their scores. Subjects in both groups devoted most of the performance aspect of their practice sessions to practicing both hands together.

******************
https://etd.lsu.edu/docs/available/etd-04082004-223228/


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[timothy42b]

Interesting thesis, but it looks like the use of the metronome was limited to providing a slow praqctice tempo, and that's probably the least useful method.

I've had another thought about metronomes and maybe it needs its own thread. 

[rlefebvr]

I agree, great for scales, especially to attain speed.

I also agree, it works great to get rid of hesitations, although it must be used sparingly.

[nicolaievich]

Thank you all for your posts 
Having a look at all of them i could reach the conclusion that the metronome is a badly necessary one. And it is recommended to be used in special passages, e.g. scales, and sparingly, basically just to get an idea of the beat. After that it's all left to the mind metronome.