Greetings from the Philly Suburbs (and 2 questions)

[dkaplowitz]

Hello. It seems like a cool, and quite helpful, forum you have here. I thought I'd say hi and introduce myself.

I'm new to the keyboard and new to this forum. I've played and been a student of the guitar for ~20 years but had to retire from a career in music to a career that pays better. I'm mostly playing for my own enjoyment now, but am interested in composing, and in learning jazz harmony, polyrhythms, and counterpoint at a deeper level, which brought me to the piano/keyboard. I just picked up a Yamaha P-120 on Friday and have been enjoying it quite a bit. I have the Humphries "Piano Handbook", the Hannon exercise book, and some sundry sheet music I either had or have been downloading from the web.

My goals with the piano are to learn to sight read proficiently with it, to gain some level of skill with it while I use it as a tool of study and composition, and hopefully to have some fun with it and play some meaningful music on it. I'm also particularly interested in learning real independence, vis. being able to play ostinatos with my left hand while working out weird, oblique things with my right hand. I don't know if it's from being a long time Zappa fan or if it's an innate illness, but I have an affinity for odd metered music and in polyrhythmic music. I guess there's a lot of 20th century music that I can delve into for that kinda' stuff. 

Anyway, I've been enjoying reading your posts so far. I'm looking forward to getting to know some of you more.

I did have a couple questions:

1) Have any of you found any creative ways to keep your cats off your keyboard? I have yet to get the Yamaha stand for my keyboard, nor do I have the dust cover (both were out of stock when I bought the keyboard). In the meantime, one of my cats has fallen in love with what he considers a new perch from which he can monitor the goings on of our apartment. Right now I'm just using a cloth sheet to keep him from getting his dander in the keys while I'm not there to shoo him away. Thanks for any humane tips.

2) I've been looking on the web and in my local phone book and haven't had much luck finding a teacher very close to me, though I know there are probably several within just a few short miles. Does anyone have any recommendations for finding a decent teacher? I'm a pretty autodidactic person, so I really just want someone to help with learning the notes and in avoiding any bad habits that might crop up early on, so really any decent teacher would do, though I guess it wouldn't be bad to learn from someone who's a monster too.

Thanks for any help.


Cheers,

Dave

[chopintod]

Howdy and welcome...what suburb of Philly? I have relatives in one of them. 

About me: I'm a freshman at Ohio U, been playing for 13+ years (classical), and I like to argue...    Without upsetting people though (at least I try...my latest threads haven't been so successful; I STILL LOVE YOU JCAREY)

Can't help you with the first one, don't have cats.

About the second one, most local piano teachers (as in, teachers without their own studios) don't spend money on advertising; they usually don't have enough.  (Blame the parents for wanting to cheapen their kid's education without realizing that the teacher's gotta make a living too.  My teacher has maybe 15 students, and she gets 20 a week from each.  20*15=300 a week; 300*52= 15,600      Not much, eh?)

Instead, check with local institutions: schools, churches even.  I guarantee that at least one person you talk to (and probably several) will have good teachers to check out.

Welcome again and hope you enjoy.

Terry

[00range]

Welcome!

You've definitely found the spot on the web for information about all aspects of the piano.

Regarding the cat question, I would try to scare the bejesus out of the cat whenever you catch him up there. I know it's tough, nobody likes to treat their buddies badly, but you should let them know that they need to stay off of it. I've had my Clavinova in my house for about a year and haven't seen a cat on it since the first month or so. Other than that, I would try looking around online for some sort of pet spray repellent, although I don't know where you would spray it (you certainly wouldn't want to spray it ON the keyboard).

[pianistimo]

pet repellant spray?  what is this?  cats like music just as much as we do (sometimes).  othertimes, they are just looking for affection.  if i am busy on the computer and my cat comes walking by (over the keys), i just have a different 'busy' behavior.  i push her to the side (in a friendly way) and have to do it sometimes two or three times.  sometimes she jumps down on the chair beside me.  i would feel badly if she had to actually leave the room though.

i think you should buy your cat a perch or his/her own and put it near your keyboard.  that way, it's near the keyboard and they can watch you play.  cats are smart and they start knowing where you really want them, versus what they can get away with.  my cat doesn't purposely irritate me unless she's hungry.

ps.  i live in collegeville (about 1/2 hour from philly suburbs).  there are probably a lot LOT of teachers in your area, though, that are as good or much better than me.   what's good about me, is that i am able to take a tangent in music and run with it.  so, if you ask an off-the-wall question, i'm likely to follow.  whereas the really good prof's make you stick to a train of thought.  i'm not mean, either.  i don't have a ruler handy and i don't scream or cry when a students makes a mistake.  in fact, i just think keeping on playing is a good idea.  unfortunately, i don't know anything about jazz, but i recently bought two very interesting books at presser's and would be happy to work through them with you.  one is entitled "patterns for jazz" by jerry coker.  it goes through repetitive riffs and makes them 'accessible' for people who are just learning jazz.  (i would like to practice some of this myself - so i can seque music)  the second book i have is 'thesaurus of scales and melodic patterns.'  don't ask why i bought these!  i just happen to like LISTENING to jazz, and wanted to learn more myself (as i play mostly classical repertoire with a classical approach).  this thesaurus of melodic patterns gets into what composers actually think about and do.

for instance, busoni, who had earnestly explored new musical resources, found 113 different scales of seven notes.  mentioning as an example the scale:  C, Db, Eb, Fb, Gb, Ab, Bb, C -   he writes in his 'entwurf einerneuen aesthetik der tonkunst' "there is a significant difference between the sound of this new scale when C is taken as the tonic and when it is taken as the leading tone of the scale of Db minor.   by harmonizing the tonic with the customary C major triad as a fundamental chord, a novel harmonic sensation is obtained." cool, huh!

you have to get to know the basics of harmony before you strike out on this stuff.  or, you could learn both at the same time (but it might be confusing).  perhaps since you already played guitar for 20 years, you're ready for this no problem.

[dkaplowitz]

ps.  i live in collegeville (about 1/2 hour from philly suburbs).  there are probably a lot LOT of teachers in your area, though, that are as good or much better than me.   what's good about me, is that i am able to take a tangent in music and run with it.  so, if you ask an off-the-wall question, i'm likely to follow.  whereas the really good prof's make you stick to a train of thought.  i'm not mean, either.  i don't have a ruler handy and i don't scream or cry when a students makes a mistake.  in fact, i just think keeping on playing is a good idea.  unfortunately, i don't know anything about jazz, but i recently bought two very interesting books at presser's and would be happy to work through them with you.  one is entitled "patterns for jazz" by jerry coker.  it goes through repetitive riffs and makes them 'accessible' for people who are just learning jazz.  (i would like to practice some of this myself - so i can seque music)  the second book i have is 'thesaurus of scales and melodic patterns.'  don't ask why i bought these!  i just happen to like LISTENING to jazz, and wanted to learn more myself (as i play mostly classical repertoire with a classical approach).  this thesaurus of melodic patterns gets into what composers actually think about and do.

for instance, busoni, who had earnestly explored new musical resources, found 113 different scales of seven notes.  mentioning as an example the scale:  C, Db, Eb, Fb, Gb, Ab, Bb, C -   he writes in his 'entwurf einerneuen aesthetik der tonkunst' "there is a significant difference between the sound of this new scale when C is taken as the tonic and when it is taken as the leading tone of the scale of Db minor.   by harmonizing the tonic with the customary C major triad as a fundamental chord, a novel harmonic sensation is obtained." cool, huh!

I'd think of that scale as being the 7th mode of melodic minor, the "altered mode" or "super locrian". Sounds very jazzy when played over a dominant chord bearing the same root (here C7) because it contains all the altered tones (b9-#9-b5-#5) and the b11 thrown in (though I don't recall if that's technically considered an altered tone). I overuse this over every V chord in a progression I come across.

Those are great books you mentioned. I have them both. Coker's book is a great resource, as are any of the other books he's written. Slonimsky's thesaurus is also muy heavy duty. I would think of that more as a classical text than as a jazz text, though Coltrane was rumored to have worked extensively with this book while developing his sheets of sound. I was hoping to get more out of the Thesaurus with the piano since it's written for piano. That'll be something to look forward to. 

I'd take lessons from you but Collegeville's a bit of a journey for me. I'd be doing this after a long work day and any type of commute that might involve some traffic would put a serious strain on my ability to attend.

I'm in Narberth. I was hoping to get someone either here in Narberth, or someone in the Bala Cynwyd, Ardmore, Wynnewood, Bryn Mawr area (basically within ~5miles). There's the Harcum Medley school of music that's close to me. There's also the Bryn Mawr (and Main Line) Music Conservatory, but I don't know their availability and pricing yet. I'd rather support someone, like you said, who's just a local person who has a small roster of students. It's just tough finding them because of the low advertizing budgets.

Thanks for the tips about the cats. Ours are a couple of pretty willful young-ish boys, so it's hard to train them not to climb up...esp. over night when we're sleeping in another room. I'll try it though. I like the suggestion of another cat perch nearby. That is do-able.

And thanks for everyone's replies and welcomes. I appreciate it.

Cheers,

Dave

[llamaman]

My cat loves music. She can sit on the piano for hours. Though sometimes she attacks the hammers.

[pianistimo]

wow.  if you know all the modes of melodic minor, you're way more advanced than me.  i am a humble beginner at jazz.  you know who you would probably like to meet is dr. maggio at west chester university.  he teaches theory and orchestration.  that stuff is super hard to me, but you two could talk.  i want to take the orchestration class when i have enough money to buy sibelius.  then, i could start composing more 'by ear' so to speak (what sounds good to me) and incorporate the right progressions (or the ones that sound right) and try to remember all that stuff from 20 years ago.

bryn mawr and all, yes, there's lots of schools and lots of teachers, i'm sure.  like finding a doctor.  some specialize in the procedure you are looking for. 

[sleepingcats]

I've used a long sheet of aluminum foil on the piano bench to keep my cats off. They usually don't like the noise.

One of my cats loves to sit at my feet when I practise, sometimes laying across my right foot, which causes a problem with pedaling! Occasionally, he has tried to wake me up by improvising - I think he was hungry!

[00range]

pet repellant spray?  what is this?

There are products out there that are designed to keep cats away, or stop them from scratching, urinating.. etc.. I don't use them, myself, but they're something to consider as a last option.

i think you should buy your cat a perch or his/her own and put it near your keyboard.  that way, it's near the keyboard and they can watch you play.  cats are smart and they start knowing where you really want them, versus what they can get away with.  my cat doesn't purposely irritate me unless she's hungry.

Sounds like a good idea, if your cat'll take the hint. Better yet, get a cardboard box! I can't tell you how many nice plush cat nests have go unused while a random cardboard box is occupied 24/7.