Welcoming a new age of classical performance in our lifetime.

[Derek]

Hey everyone, I just found an excellent website about classical improvisation. I'm finding more and more stuff like this on the internet as time goes on, evidence that the classical music world is awakening from its long slumber, and realizing it is very much allowed to create freely at an instrument, unfettered by the written score.

Here's one article from the website...but check out the others. Also there are some youtube videos of cello improvisation and a cello/piano duet improvising what sounds to me like some kind of European dance style piece.

Composer/Performer split

Read and be inspired!

Regards,
-Derek Andrews.

[michel dvorsky]

Mmm...pretentious and boring improvisation. 

[gerry]

I don't buy the premise that the classical music world has been in a long slumber. Performers have always been free to improvise or do anything they wanted with music - I'm not aware of anyone standing over them saying to the effect of thou shalt not. If there's an audience to buy it then great, more power to them. However, just as one is free to take a copy of a Rembrandt, da Vinci, Klee, or what have you, and add their own colors to it, after all is said and done, and you wash the recently-added affectations off, you are still left with the masterpiece that was necessary to start with. I think it's been the public that's been in the slumber, not the art itself, deadened by media sensationalism and instant gratification. Let musicians go where they will with their improvisations, the masterpieces will survive just as they have decades of bad interpretations.

[dan101]

Detailed music that should be followed strictly is not a negative thing. Performers appreciate variety of styles in composers of the past and present.

The article was somewhat intesting, but fairly subjective, in my view. 

[slobone]

In the 20th century, there were still performers, like Godowsky, Busoni, and Horowitz, who made their own arrangements of familiar pieces, which is pretty much the same thing. And Volodos still does it. And performers of 18th century music are expected to provide their own ornaments and cadenzas.

But really, if you like the idea of improvising, why not just learn to play jazz? It's much more musically exciting and fresh than anything that's being written in the "classical" world today. And I guarantee you'll never come to end of what you can do with it.

[pianowolfi]

I think that the great advantage of our time is the fact that we as musicians have the possibilities to choose all that we want, we can use every stylistic element, there are no restrictions from any authorities and no "forbidden" things. To limit ourselves to a certain "style" or period is not necessary. We can express our intentions, we can develop new styles and we can use new elements. If we need Jazz chords we can use them. If we need polyphony we can use it etc. It's all up to the individual.

[slobone]

That's an advantage -- but also a disadvantage  It means someone who wants to be a composer has to start pretty much from scratch. Should I write something minimalist or 12-tone? Influenced by African folk rhythms or sounding like Muzak on a spaceship? Should I write it for a cappella choir, synthesizer, or just a bunch of guys banging on garbage can lids?

In the old days at least you could say, I'll bet if I wrote a set of 12 minuets, I could make enough money to pay the rent this month. Today you more likely have to have a day job.

[pianowolfi]

That's an advantage -- but also a disadvantage  It means someone who wants to be a composer has to start pretty much from scratch. Should I write something minimalist or 12-tone? Influenced by African folk rhythms or sounding like Muzak on a spaceship? Should I write it for a cappella choir, synthesizer, or just a bunch of guys banging on garbage can lids?

Imo all these are no questions if you are really wanting to be a composer, that means, if you have goals, intentions, ideas, and inspiration. You will find that for some of your ideas (YOUR ideas) you need something minimalistic, or African, or Synthy or Muzak, or whatever. It's not only about constructing.

In the old days at least you could say, I'll bet if I wrote a set of 12 minuets, I could make enough money to pay the rent this month. Today you more likely have to have a day job.

Sure, if you want to survive as "only" a composer, it's a hard thing

[Derek]

In the 20th century, there were still performers, like Godowsky, Busoni, and Horowitz, who made their own arrangements of familiar pieces, which is pretty much the same thing. And Volodos still does it. And performers of 18th century music are expected to provide their own ornaments and cadenzas.

But really, if you like the idea of improvising, why not just learn to play jazz? It's much more musically exciting and fresh than anything that's being written in the "classical" world today. And I guarantee you'll never come to end of what you can do with it.

I got the same reply seven years ago when I asked on a piano forum if anyone improvised their own "classical like" piano music as I put it back then. "You'll find your way to jazz."

Welp, I just don't like jazz! (not much of it anyway)  So what is a man to do, who REALLY REALLY REALLY loves music like Bach, Beethoven, Chopin, Rachmaninoff, Stravinsky, Scriabin, etc. etc.  but NOT jazz...but who ALSO wants to create his own music?  Should he give up, and assume that only great early 20th century virtuoso concert pianists could imitate those old styles?  Or should he ignore all that nonsense and simply learn (and invent) as many scales and chords and rhythms and harmonies and figures as he can...and try all kinds of sounds and find out which ones he likes?

That's exactly what I did. I still don't like jazz, and I don't suppose I ever will! I did actually pick up boogie woogie on the way though...its fun, but nowhere near the vast expanse of satisfying sounds that non-jazz provides me.  (I hasten to add I agree with all the "freedom from style" remarks above, and that I don't consciously avoid any jazz like sounds--but I have absolutely zero interest in imitating or learning "Jazz" as one typically hears it on CDs or in elevators)

[slobone]

Well, I'm a little confused, because I checked out that link you posted, and it seems to be talking about adding ornaments and so forth to existing pieces -- not to composing something new. So which are you interested in? They're two different things.

As for jazz, if you don't like it, fine. But if you refer to it as "elevator music" that just shows you don't know very much about it.

[Derek]

All I know is, I keep trying to give jazz a chance, I buy albums from time to time, I sample mp3's from time to time, and none of it satisfies me anywhere near as much as non-jazz stuff (except Gershwin, some Jarrett, some boogie woogie, and a few others). So I'm just saying, what is someone to do if they enjoy non-jazz music so much and they want to improvise?

I think the above website provides plenty of evidence that the classical world is beginning to realize that improvisation is not necessarily always jazz. If you'll dig a little deeper you'll find some videos of totally improvised classical compositions, I seem to recall finding a cello/piano duet that was pretty good. It isn't just mere embellishment of written pieces.

[michel dvorsky]

All I know is, I keep trying to give jazz a chance, I buy albums from time to time, I sample mp3's from time to time, and none of it satisfies me anywhere near as much as non-jazz stuff (except Gershwin, some Jarrett, some boogie woogie, and a few others). So I'm just saying, what is someone to do if they enjoy non-jazz music so much and they want to improvise?

I think the above website provides plenty of evidence that the classical world is beginning to realize that improvisation is not necessarily always jazz. If you'll dig a little deeper you'll find some videos of totally improvised classical compositions, I seem to recall finding a cello/piano duet that was pretty good. It isn't just mere embellishment of written pieces.

Here is a great contemporary example of improvisation that is neither classical nor jazz:

[pies]

a