appoggiatura-rising-falling (Bach)

[ridr27]

Hi all:

Help!  you know the little "c" sign (best I can describe)  where if on the line or space above a note:  it is a "falling" appoggiatura and,

if on the line or space below a note:  It is a "rising" appoggiatura.

OK, what if on the same line or space as the note?  Would I simply make the same note a quick appoggiatura?

Hope you can understand the question.

Thanx much.

[faulty_damper]

Hope you can understand the question.

No.

The more effort you put into describing clearly what you mean in a manner that is comprehensible, the more likely your audience will understand your question and be able to answer it.

Please don't make your audience use more effort trying to understand what you mean when you didn't make much effort yourself.

[beethoven_fan]

Hi, ridr27 !

I don't know really what is a 'rising appogiatura'. Which Bach piece is it ? Do you know the BWM number ? We could look at the score and help you.

[bernhard]

It may also be a misprint (if it is indeed on the same line, then yes, treat it as the same note, neither faster nor slower than any other appoggiatura  - I assume you know how to calculate the time value).

So, the best thing you could do at this point is to provide the score (or the name of the piece and the bar where the appoggiatura is to be found) as pointed out above.

Best wishes,
Bernhard

[ridr27]

First....thank you to "beethoven_fan" for offering to help me.  I think I have the answer now without trying to print the music to here or bothering someone to look at the Version I have. 

Second: thank you to Bernhard.  You have answered my question.  You see in Bach's "Ornamentation Chart", it only shows rising and falling. 

You know maybe it is a misprint, but I guess it does not really matte at this point.  I wanted to know how to play it, and you clearly answered my question.

but in case either of you wonder what I am talking about:
Henle Version:  "Notebook for Anna Magdalena Bach"
---page 12, Choral, BWV 691, Measure 4, the marking is on the G#.
Bernhard, what exactly do you call the marking in *English* as opposed to German?

Another Question:  Measure 7:  on Treble clef A---it has two markings on the one note.  Could you tell me what that is?  I love all this stuff but get confused!!


Bernhard, on another note:  I have been a long-time reader of all you have written.  I am so happy to see you back.  I was afraid you were gone for good.  Welcome back.
and thank you again for your help.
Rider 27

[bernhard]

You know maybe it is a misprint, but I guess it does not really matte at this point.  I wanted to know how to play it, and you clearly answered my question.

but in case either of you wonder what I am talking about:
Henle Version:  "Notebook for Anna Magdalena Bach"
---page 12, Choral, BWV 691, Measure 4, the marking is on the G#.
Bernhard, what exactly do you call the marking in *English* as opposed to German?

Yes, indeed is a misprint. The sign - called in English a “rising appoggiatura” (German: “accent steigend”) or in this case a “falling appoggiatura” (German: “accent fallend”), should be on the A-space, not on the G-line.

Like so:



And should be realised like so:



Some editions add a trill to that note as well:



And this is realised like so:

Another Question:  Measure 7:  on Treble clef A---it has two markings on the one note.  Could you tell me what that is?  I love all this stuff but get confused!!

Yes, that is a “rising appoggiatura with mordent” (German: “Accent und mordant”)

Here is how you realise it:

Bernhard, on another note:  I have been a long-time reader of all you have written.  I am so happy to see you back.  I was afraid you were gone for good.  Welcome back.
and thank you again for your help.
Rider 27

Thank you, and you are welcome.

Best wishes,
Bernhard

[bernhard]

I might as well give you the whole thing.






Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[general disarray]

I might as well give you the whole thing.






Best wishes,
Bernhard.

To Bernhard:    (thanks).

[ridr27]

Bernhard:  I just printed all this out......I am going to play it and see how I do, especially the timing!  This is grande!!

You know, I had thought I could trust the Henle versions, but obviously they too make mistakes.  It didn't seem right, buttttt     :-)

I wondered, what version did you use to compare, or perhaps you just knew it was wrong. 

I am having fun working on this.

Rider 27