Is Baroque music even good?

[nightlordq]

For some reason, I don't play Bach. I just think the music in the Baroque period is just....boring. Alot of people say Bach is famous but is he? I like pieces from Early Romantic and onwards.
And what does Polyphonic mean?

[db05]

Ah, Romantic onwards, I like that too. I hate Classical the most, except for Beethoven because he was really out there sometimes, very original. I once confused Carulli for Mozart, my apologies to both. 

Polyphonic means there are 2 or more melodies, such as in (you guessed it) a Bach fugue.

I don't like Bach very much either, but I don't have much of a choice. You'll find Bach no matter where you study. But before judging all Baroque as bad, check out the following composers first:
Telemann
Scarlatti
Handel
Vivaldi

I admit that Scarlatti is one of my favorites, on a piano it sounds a bit more modern- as opposed to harpsichord where everything for me is zoom zoom.

Vivaldi is well known for his 4 seasons.

Welcome to the forum and enjoy playing piano! 

[pianochick93]

I don't mind listening to baroque, as long as it isn't being played on a harpischord (shudders), however, I can't play it properly. I like to play it, but my instinct is to try and make it sound romantic, which isn't how it's meant to be played.
So generally I just stay away from learning overly-baroqueyy baroque (if that made sense), and go with the stuff that it doesn't matter that much is everything isn't strictly short and non-romanticy.

[db05]

I don't mind listening to baroque, as long as it isn't being played on a harpischord (shudders), however, I can't play it properly. I like to play it, but my instinct is to try and make it sound romantic, which isn't how it's meant to be played.
So generally I just stay away from learning overly-baroqueyy baroque (if that made sense), and go with the stuff that it doesn't matter that much is everything isn't strictly short and non-romanticy.

I don't quite understand what you mean. Polophony aside, baroque and romantic have some similarities. I guess it is Bach's fault for being so popluar among pianists and composers that some Baroque-ness is left in every generation after him. And if you like to play romantically, why not? And I like would some rubato with my Minuet in G, please.

[rc]

I didn't like Baroque or Classical to begin with either.  What opened them to me was just to learn a couple of pieces.  After learning my first 2 pt invention, I was hooked.  I can see why Bach is so revered, there's so much in his music.  The counterpoint, how he plays with the motifs, rich harmony.

With Classical, I'd once heard that you could take the opening phrase of almost any Mozart piece and multiply it by some number to get approximately the length of the rest of the piece.  When I heard this I thought it was pretty lame, how predictable is that?  Now I see that's a large part of the appeal of the classical aesthetic, it's balance of structure.  What's interesting is what they can do within the limits of the framework of sonata form, how they treat the themes as the movement progresses.

I'm thinking that the reason I couldn't appreciate these styles so much until I played them is that my ear couldn't catch what's going on, but when I learn it I can take my time and understand the music better.  Especially with Bach, where there's often so much going on.

It's a matter of understanding the style of an age.  Some things, when I come to understand them I like them less.  If I find there's not much to it, it holds only a superficial appeal, I'm disappointed...  Other's surprise me that the more I understand, the more I find.  So far, all the famous musicians have not disappointed.

[rc]

IMO, the idea that baroque should be played with a limited dynamic is a bit flawed to be forced on a modern piano. 

I believe the reason for this 'rule' is based on what we know of the keyboard instruments of the time - they had limited dynamics.  So the idea is that since Bach would have played his pieces on a harpsichord, that was his conception of them and we should try and be true to that.  I've read that a couple decades ago many had the opinion that Bach shouldn't be played on the piano at all.

But, it IS a piano.  I'm fairly sure that Bach would have wanted dynamics in the instruments he composed for that were capable of it - I doubt that people in that era never sang with dynamics!  So, now that we have the technology, I don't believe we should tie down the poor piano with such a rule.  That's just cruel

I've also heard the idea of playing baroque metronomic, which I think is even more ridiculous.  I have no research for this, but it just seems too unnatural to me for any good musician of any time to not fluctuate the beat at least a little.

[queenrock]

To me, Baroque music is just like the mathematics of the music world. It's clever and logical but doesn't generally seem to have much emotion behind it, although there are of course exceptions.

[concerto_love]

it's kinda bit boring at the first time.. but I can enjoy it at last... 

[rc]

To me, Baroque music is just like the mathematics of the music world. It's clever and logical but doesn't generally seem to have much emotion behind it, although there are of course exceptions.

Again I will suggest that if you were more familiar with the style, you would find the emotion in it.  I find it as emotional as anything else worthwhile.

[richard black]

Alot [sic] of people say Bach is famous but is he?

Yes. I can't see there's any room whatsoever for argument on that point.

[jabbz]

I put forth that Bach's music is probably some of the most passionate music around really. But the passions of a reserved, mature man, in a reserved and polite society. Some of his music is profoundly aching (Mass in B minor, as one example), some very serene (WTC bk1, prelude C major), some very raw and aggressive ( D minor, WTC bk2). You just need to connect with the music really.

[Bob]

First sarcastic thought that popped into my head.  Nah... Baroque music's not that good.  They just didn't realize it for a hundred years or so.


I think of music in terms of line.  If it's melodic/tuneful enough, then it's a melody.  Two or melodies that can move along at the same time make it polyphony (many voices).

I ran into people who were really into Baroque or early music and that kind of brushed off on me.  Make sure you hear good performances of it and listen to it enough to get immersed in it. 

I'm not very fond of sight-reading polyphonic music, but that's because I don't work on it much and it's the nature of the music. 

[akonow]

If you start to play some Scarlatti sonatas I think that Baroque music will open itself up to you. I believe Scarlatti is probably the most accessible composer of this era--his sonatas are very melodic and you truly can't appreciate them fully until you actually just go out on a limb and dive into a piece. Look at K141 and K450; they are a lot of fun, incredibly exotic (at least that's what I thought ), and, not to mention, they look very impressive. You just have to have an open mind and, before you know it, Baroque may be your favorite era. Telemann, Rameau, and Couperin are also quite lovely once you get into their music.

Please do give Baroque a chance and I promise you won't be disappointed.

[minor9th]

Bach is God.

[daejiny]

No offense to anybody, but I think just generalizing about a whole period can be quite ignorant - it doesn't show the depth of understanding of the music.

Next, without Bach, Chopin's Etudes and Preludes would probably be a lot different - for example, compare his first etude and prelude with Bach's WTC 1 C Major prelude.

Also, I if you haven't heard or played Bach's fugues, you're in for quite a suprise - the opening to Kunst der Fuge (Art of the Fugue) is quite magnificent.

If you still consider Bach "boring," what can you expect? Do you derive any sort of deep internal pleasure from Gregorian chants or any Renaissance music? I don't think you do or will, especially if the Baroque is nothing to you.

[aewanko]

Die in hell, fool! 

[welltemperedpianist]

wow. I wont even respond to this.

[lau]

well i can only appreciate this music for it's genius, but i guess that's it.

The title for this thread made me physically laugh. it's good.

[akonow]

No offense to anybody, but I think just generalizing about a whole period can be quite ignorant - it doesn't show the depth of understanding of the music.

I think it's only ignorant if you choose not to give it a chance by listening to several pieces from several composers first, which is what is usually the case. On the other hand, it's sometimes the case that someone just can't appreciate a certain type of music as much as they appreciate another. I, for example, listen to a lot of contemporary music every once in awhile but I don't think I'll ever like it as much as I like Scarlatti, Telemann, Beethoven, Mozart, Schubert, Alkan, Brahms, Chopin, Liszt, Mendelssohn, Scharwenka, Rachmaninoff, Debussy, Ravel, Satie, or De Falla. I dislike Gershwin but I do have two CDs of his music just because I wanted to try to like his music.

But, honestly, I think the OP was either kidding or he just wanted other people to substantiate his own viewpoint.

[invictious]

Too bad Bach was 400 years too early before the era of the electric guitar, otherwise he would be obscenely rich.

No seriously though, Bach was actually an emotional composer.

[general disarray]

For some reason, I don't play Bach. I just think the music in the Baroque period is just....boring. Alot of people say Bach is famous but is he? I like pieces from Early Romantic and onwards.
And what does Polyphonic mean?

Uh, this post (which must be spam) doesn't even merit a response, let alone a thread.  Let's let it die the death it deserves before you people embarrass yourselves even more than you already have.

[pianisten1989]

For some reason, I don't play Bach. I just think the music in the Baroque period is just....boring. Alot of people say Bach is famous but is he? I like pieces from Early Romantic and onwards.
And what does Polyphonic mean?

Wut?! Don't you think Bach is famous? Well... If alot of people say it, then they probably know who he is, and then he kind of has be be famous.

Polyphonic means many voices, like in a fugue.

And yes, Bach is good. Both for ones technique and ones ears, in my opinion.

[teresa_b]

This:

For some reason, I don't play Bach. I just think the music in the Baroque period is just....boring.

Plus This:

And what does Polyphonic mean?

= 0 (knowledge and understanding of Bach)

Start with a few of his Little Preludes, then study the Inventions, then work your way into the WTC.  You gain appreciation for this incredible music only by exposure, real listening, and deepest understanding through studying and playing it.

Good luck.
Teresa

[db05]

wow. I wont even respond to this.

Wow. You posted some sort of response anyway.

Uh, this post (which must be spam) doesn't even merit a response, let alone a thread.  Let's let it die the death it deserves before you people embarrass yourselves even more than you already have.

Uhh, great way to scare of a new member. Obviously, the OP is new with regards to Baroque music. 3 years ago, I'd have said the same thing.

[moscheles001]

All of the composers after Bach took Bach as their first model. Chopin had his students study Bach, Beethoven studied Bach. The music theory that all musicians study is based on Bach.

Can you really be bored by an Invention or prelude and fugue by Bach that lasts only a couple of minutes? If so, you may have ADHA.

[Bob]

Or if you're listening to Bach for heart-on-the-sleeve emtoins... That type of music was written as more of a science or mental game, so the emphasis on emotion isn't there the way it is in Romantic music.  (I know it's still emotional, etc., etc., etc., but it's not the same as Romantic.)

[healdie]

I am strugglinh to understand the point of this post? apart from the question at the end.

it seems you are just stating you don't like Barouque music which is fine everyone one has their opnions but i don't like prawns but i didn't start a topic on it

i would disagree with what you said about Bach not been famous he is one the the 3 B's along with Beethoven and Brahms, Bach is also probably one of the most famous barouqe composers along with Handel.

it also seems wrong to catigorise all arouqe music I enjoy the music of Bach but i don't like alot of Handel and Vivaldi who are also Barouqe so it is childish to say that all Barouqe music is bad

[rc]

Uh, this post (which must be spam)

I'm not so sure of that, the OP only has a few posts.  It only took a minute to peruse them, they overall seem sincere.

To me, the purpose of the thread is simply discussion.  The OP shows he doesn't know much about baroque - that's not a time for ridicule!  It's an opprotunity to try and help him understand something new.  Like Db, I wasn't born with an understanding of the style.

The petty mean spiritedness in here is weak.

[pianorin]

I like Bach. the more you listen to his music, the more you love it.
I like music from all eras. As long as it's not those hip hop music. I dislike noisy music.

[db05]

I like Bach. the more you listen to his music, the more you love it.
I like music from all eras. As long as it's not those hip hop music. I dislike noisy music.

Good for you! Hip hop isn't always noisy. It's pretty good when added to rnb/ pop. Try looking for samples of these guys' music (the first may be a bit rare):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nan_Quan_Mama - I have the 1st CD, with the old members, some songs are good, some are too weird.
https://www.jaychoustudio.com/ - Very consistent. Most songs are good.

Now, maybe some reaaaaaaaally noisy and distorted heavy metal would be a nightmare for you... Nah, I'm sure there are gems in there, too.

[etcetra]

I find Bach's music just as passionate as romantic music.. but in a different way.. Bach is writing his music mainly for God, and his music is more about perfection of form than outpour of emotion.  I hear just as much intensity in Bach as I do Chopin, just like how i notice just as much intensity in Haiku as Paradise lost.. it's a different kind of aesthetic and its a matter of how willing you are to accept and receive it.

It's funny how math and things related to form are automatically associated with being mechanical and boring.. I read a book called "poetry and mathematics" and that changed my perspective on that idea.  Just look at how much Robert Frost adheres to form when he writes.. I think what make Bach great is that he write n very strict form order but he is able to do so musically and emotionally.. something that most of us fail to achieve.

Again it's about how willing you are to be open about it, and try to listen to it until you get.. there are a lot of "snobby" people who thinks that the only trust art form is such and such..and never get out of that mold. well its a shame for them because they really are missing out in life.

[lelle]

If you think bach is boring, I really think you should watch these videos I found on Youtube:

If you still think Bach is boring after this, I guess you are lost to us...

If you want even more romantic, you should try this Liszt transcriptions of Bach:

[kelly_kelly]

Try listening to Bach's Chaconne from violin Partita no. 2 in D minor.

Violin:

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Piano (Busoni transcription):

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And yes, I consider the Busoni transcription to be a baroque work, because I personally find the original violin version to be just as dramatic, if not more.

[Bob]

I think that's one the best posts I've seen on here lelle.  Thanks.

[eternal_interval]

I must say that Bach is one of the greatest composers of all time.  I am not just saying this from a bias standpoint but I have listened to many of Bach's compostions and there is nothing quite like counterpoint being played on a piano.  I would suggest listening to Glenn Gould, Andras Shiff, or Jeno Jando.  I was told by one of my earlier piano teachers that Bach's preludes/fuges are like the old testament and Beethoven's sonatas are like the new testament for piano students. 

[momopi]

Yes, it's good. I love it.

Of course, at first, I didn't. But my aunt had a Bach CD which she played often. the music kind of grew on me. And now, I love it