Petrushka

[invictious]

This is a thread about the discussion of one of the most important works of the 20th Century - Petrushka. More specifically, the piano version with three movements.

Any advice about the first movement? Anything about it will do. Preferably something about the ridiculous left hand jumps, or the right hand voicing, or polyrhythms, or fingerings, or any of the 10000 difficulties encountered when learning it.

Links or people discussing about the work is also great too.

Fire away.

[perfect_pitch]

You know what - since this forum has helped me in the past - I'd like to help you.

Here's how I learned the first movement. I spent a good month or two learning all the notes and getting it rhythmically secure at a quarter of the speed. Once I could play it at that speed without any mistakes and without looking at music, I then began to play the thing at half speed but spent a bit of time focusing on the large jumps and hand-cross-overs etc... Then I began very slowly trying to increase the speed little by little until I got it up to full speed.

At the time I was learning the whole Trois Mouvements de Petrushka, and three other enormous pieces, so in all it took me 18 months to learn my program.

In terms of the voicing... Seperate the top note from the bottom - play the top note loud, then quickly all the underneath notes very soft. It's a lot of work, but it does help.

In terms of the ridiculous leaps (which I presume are on the 3rd page and the last page)... Lots of very slow practice, and try to do them without looking at the keys - feel the gap.

Polyrhythms I didn't have a problem with - it's only 3 against 4 most of the time which isn't so hard.

Fingerings... that comes from expermentation. When I started learning the piece at a quarter of the speed - I spent the time to work on the best fingering for myself.



Any other questions you have on Petrushka, I would be happy to help. It's still fairly fresh in my hand, I only dropped it two months ago, but it's still all there.

[invictious]

Currently learning the notes at a slooooow speed. I am up to the second page with the right hand octaves and left hand chords, although still not too familiar.

What was the fingering that you used on the second and third bars of the second page? I  use the thumb and index finger for the inner voice, but it trips my fingers when I get to that part.

The octaves section seems to be straightforward, although the left hand seems just a little awkward for a few of the chords.

Recapitulation of the main theme with a little variation, I foresee no problem there.

Then there comes the ridiculous large left hand leaps which on paper, but I am sure some practice will do.

Then the left hand broken chords on beginning of the fourth page may need even more practice.

The intricate voicing that follows should be fine, until probably the last few bars on that page where the left hand has to play a few extra notes. For some reason, I really really love the first bar on the third row with the inner tremolo.

Fifth page has the frightening looking left hand...

Beginning of sixth page seems fine, except just maybe that little five to four rhythm.

Recapitulation no problem.

Then the final run with the big left hand leaps. It is pretty much the same through the last page though, so MORE practice.

Hmmm, better go back to practicing the second page.

[perfect_pitch]

What was the fingering that you used on the second and third bars of the second page? I  use the thumb and index finger for the inner voice, but it trips my fingers when I get to that part.

Here goes:

3454 4345 5432 34123123 5
1121 2121 2121 2
                      1

...although the left hand seems just a little awkward for a few of the chords.quote]

Are you kidding me?? That LH chord E G# D F# used to piss me off...

Fifth page has the frightening looking left hand...

That's right - be scared. Although - What I used to do was do a lot of rhythmic work - as soon as I could play it slowly, but steadily to help with the turns I used to do this pattern:

A (pause)     BCDE (pause)    ACEF (pause)    EDCB (pause)   FDBA (pause)

Then try:

ABCD (pause)   EACE (pause)   FEDC (pause)   BFDB (pause)   etc...

Isn't it fun?   

[invictious]

Ok that E G# D F# IS pissing me off, even though my hands are quite large.

I am currently at the third page with the big leaps. Fun part to practice. So far so good though. Will keep you updated.

Thanks!

[john11inc]

one of the most important works of the 20th Century - Petrushka.

No.

[barnardo]

Here goes:

3454 4345 5432 34123123 5
1121 2121 2121 2
                     

Those two bars (19-20) can really pose a problem! So in case new people are searching these forums I'm adding my own experience to this old thread.
I find the following to be smoother for my RH, it may appear tricksy at first, but it can be played legato at tempo helping me crescendo through the whole thing and do that inner part justice!

3454 5434 5454 34123123 5
1212 3121 2132 1/2

[barnardo]

Ok that E G# D F# IS pissing me off, even though my hands are quite large.
\[end quote]
I too found that chord a problem for my LH. In the end it seemed best to omit the top F# both times in order to play the D natural clearly, which is part of a nice inner part ostinato (E F# E D etc) . When the equivalent chord comes after the next modulation it is more easy to reach.  I know the accuracy of the harmonic detail is really important for this piece so I'm glad this is the only note that I omit in the Russian dance. (Plus the bracketed ones)

[perfect_pitch]

Ok that E G# D F# IS pissing me off, even though my hands are quite large.

Although I can just reach a tenth, and I have small hands for a guy - I hate to say it, but even I can play that chord. I think if you try and omit it for an exam... be careful. Do it only if you truly can't play it.

I wouldn't.