The Appassionata Project

[m1469]

Please, do it, I mean livestreaming your performances!!!!

I think pretty soon I will be setting more stuff up, and I will want to include at least one livestream.

I understand about setting up the livestreaming at this point.  Getting ready for the concerts is enough to deal with.  The video recording would be great, actually, because I don't know if I would be here to hear all of it, and might miss it.  Nevertheless, to see you live would be wonderful, even if I had to tear myself away in the middle of it.

I'll need to review the videos, but I think at least yesterday's Appassionata is something I may put in this thread.  It wasn't flawless, of course, but it was probably the strongest of all of them, yesterday.  I have this Saturday now, and as I mentioned above, I think I will be setting more up.  This is all a very good, extremely needed step.

[m1469]

Ok, here is from Sunday's performance:

Mov. I (not the most fantastic opening, but a stronger performance overall out of the 2 days)

Mov. II,III

[costicina]

Brava m1469, such a sober yet intense rendition! Your composure doesn't take anything away from passion, it enhaces it....

(and if you allow me a frivolous remarke: veru nice outfit: green is definitely your colour!! )

[m1469]

Thanks, Margh.  Yeah, I'm not sure how to process it all, so I'm just kind of going along the path for now.  Ultimately, I have to admit that I feel proud of myself for taking these steps, but I'm focused on the steps ahead of me (which are many) of better musicianship, pianoship, and performership, too.  

I love clothes  , I'm not going to lie.  I just don't spend money on it right now (same with a haircut, which I *desperately* need).  Ultimately, I'd love to have much more beautiful clothing (and prettier shoes), but for now I'm happy to be doing this at all and will have to settle for imagining that I am wearing better things (and doing the best I can with what I've got ... this seemed fine for an "informal" house concert).  I'm also in a process of becoming more shrinky, which may change my clothing options down the road ... I won't be exactly my goal by the time I go to Italy in July, but by late Fall, I should be getting pretty close.  

[pts1]

m1469

A very nice effort!

You're quite poised and musical, and you do a great job of maintaining your composure and moving on beyond difficulties.

If you don't mind, could you tell me what you're using for the sound aspect of the recording?

I'm looking for something that give's a true piano qualilty recording without spending a fortune, and the technology has changed in the last 10 to 20 years to an incredible degree.

[candlelightpiano]

Wow, m1469!! Tremendous improvement!!!  You had many sparkling, brilliant moments in the first and third movements.  The variations of the middle section were beautiful.  You had a lovely singing bass melody there and a very bright tone in the next variation.  Your ending was fiery and powerful.  Took my breath away! 

[m1469]

m1469

A very nice effort!

Thanks, it's also quite an accomplishment so far  .

If you don't mind, could you tell me what you're using for the sound aspect of the recording?

I'm looking for something that give's a true piano qualilty recording without spending a fortune, and the technology has changed in the last 10 to 20 years to an incredible degree.

I don't really know what it is, it's some microphone that my husband wanted to purchase for the camera, made by the same company for that camera.  It's OK, I guess, but I'm not thrilled with it.  Marik is the man you should talk with about what to get   , as he knows ALL about microphones and sound and balance, and how to capture it beautifully in recording ...

Wow, m1469!! Tremendous improvement!!!  You had many sparkling, brilliant moments in the first and third movements.  The variations of the middle section were beautiful.  You had a lovely singing bass melody there and a very bright tone in the next variation.  Your ending was fiery and powerful.  Took my breath away!  

Thank you very much ... that writing gadget is cool .

[goldentone]

I listened to the 1st movement last night, and will get to 2 and 3.  I'll be back.  

[goldentone]

I watched the Appassionata in its entirety.  Thanks for uploading it.   I am impressed with the poise you demonstrated.  Though this is one step, it's an important step, isn't it?  

[m1469]

I watched the Appassionata in its entirety.  Thanks for uploading it.  I am impressed with the poise you demonstrated.  Though this is one step, it's an important step, isn't it?  

Thank you for listening and for your thoughts, Goldy.  Yes, this is one step, and it was important, I guess.  But, I have *no* idea what's going on with me   - today I've been contemplating divorcing the Appassionata and all the repertoire I've been working on for ... ever.  And I proceeded to have a very major "situation."  And I played only a brand new Mozart, instead, and I listened to it several times through (Horowitz), and I just played it and I didn't care about anything else in the world, I didn't care about trying to have some certain process (although some guiding thoughts from teachers weren't too far away), I just was playing it.  My piano self is perhaps the only reason I can scarcely be good at anything else ... there's plenty I'm supposed to be doing and probably quite a bit I could be fairly good at, but instead all I want to do is play the piano.  Live the piano.  Breathe the piano.  Last weekend changed the entire sound in my head/ear/life.  All of these amazing pianists back to back, playing on these amazing pianos ... and in some cases I was inches away from them when they were playing ... right in the middle of it happening.  It's like something rubbed off onto me.  And today, in the middle of the "situation," I felt like I didn't even know how to make a single beautiful sound on the piano, and I had to remember that my whole sound spectrum is changed and changing.  And, I can't help but think, what would it be like to be immersed in that for much longer?  Even years?  It makes me so sad I can't even explain it.

[austinarg]

Thank you for listening and for your thoughts, Goldy.  Yes, this is one step, and it was important, I guess.  But, I have *no* idea what's going on with me   - today I've been contemplating divorcing the Appassionata and all the repertoire I've been working on for ... ever.  And I proceeded to have a very major "situation."  And I played only a brand new Mozart, instead, and I listened to it several times through (Horowitz), and I just played it and I didn't care about anything else in the world, I didn't care about trying to have some certain process (although some guiding thoughts from teachers weren't too far away), I just was playing it.  My piano self is perhaps the only reason I can scarcely be good at anything else ... there's plenty I'm supposed to be doing and probably quite a bit I could be fairly good at, but instead all I want to do is play the piano.  Live the piano.  Breathe the piano.  Last weekend changed the entire sound in my head/ear/life.  All of these amazing pianists back to back, playing on these amazing pianos ... and in some cases I was inches away from them when they were playing ... right in the middle of it happening.  It's like something rubbed off onto me.  And today, in the middle of the "situation," I felt like I didn't even know how to make a single beautiful sound on the piano, and I had to remember that my whole sound spectrum is changed and changing.  And, I can't help but think, what would it be like to be immersed in that for much longer?  Even years?  It makes me so sad I can't even explain it.

Are you saying that your playing is ugly? That's weird, your videos say otherwise.

[emill]

I'm almost ashamed to post this.  Not so much for the smudges as the lack of music.  Still too preoccupied with the memory and notes.  I think I'll try one more time next week and then give it a rest. 

This is simply impressive in the sense that it has been only 6-8 weeks since the start of this project and you are playing the whole sonata practically from memory. There are many instances where Birba's touch, musicality and depth of piano experience created beautiful moments of music.

And even in the 3rd movement where there were some moments of "frustration" in the execution, the wonderful music/melody came through, something that can only come from someone thoroughly polished in music. It was a pleasure listening to the "Jedi Master".

btw, I was surprised by a sneaky cat who suddenly appeared at 2:30 of the 1st movement only to reappear as a cute dog with brown spots at 5:30 of the last movement!! I hope you did not name him beethoven!!

 
   

[emill]

x x x . . .  But, I have *no* idea what's going on with me   - today I've been contemplating divorcing the Appassionata and all the repertoire I've been working on for ... ever.  x.x.x.x

First, allow this non-pianist, who has loved the "APPASSIONATA" since he was young, to congratulate your superb effort in so short a time. And to think you played the whole sonata from memory!!!  wow!!! .... that would really speak badly of the present state my memory..hehhee   Considering everything, for me, you played the sonata very well and I am very sure in due time it will have a faster tempo and the fiery character that some parts have.  CONGRATULATIONS AGAIN!!!

regarding what you feel now.... I venture a guess that you can benefit from a short break from the project ... it is common and often happens ... we get a little filled-up without realizing it... and suddenly we feel different about things.  Yes a short breather will probably do you good.

[49410enrique]

yep. outstanding.

[pianowolfi]

You won't divorce the Appassionata. That's a lifetime relationship. Like all the great sonatas, it may require breaks, sometimes even longer ones, but then you will take it up again and bring it to a new level.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Alright guys, since everyone's talking about doing projects, I just started Appassionata.

I didn't put this in my winter break project thread, because this won't be the highlight of my winter break.  I'm just doing this because...  I wanna learn it.

So yeah, I'll keep you guys posted.

[vsrinivasa]

Alright guys, since everyone's talking about doing projects, I just started Appassionata.

I didn't put this in my winter break project thread, because this won't be the highlight of my winter break.  I'm just doing this because...  I wanna learn it.

So yeah, I'll keep you guys posted.

I've played the Appassionata. It is really fun to play, especially the third movement. Hope you have a good time with it!

[j_menz]

Alright guys, since everyone's talking about doing projects, I just started Appassionata.

I didn't put this in my winter break project thread, because this won't be the highlight of my winter break.  I'm just doing this because...  I wanna learn it.

So yeah, I'll keep you guys posted.

So you're doing the Rachmaninoff 1st sonata and the Appassionata?

How long is your break? 

[rachmaninoff_forever]

So you're doing the Rachmaninoff 1st sonata and the Appassionata?

How long is your break? 

My break is for like 17 days or something.

The Rach 1st sonata is only for the break.  After that I'll just take it on casually.  But I might sitch to the third piano concerto instead of the 1st sonata.  aaaagh I don't know what to do!!!

[j_menz]

aaaagh I don't know what to do!!!

You won't listen, but my advice would be to do neither. Sure, start the Appassionata, but otherwise I'd recommend getting together as much grade 4-6 stuff as you can lay your hands on and sight-read your way to a broader exposure.  It will be a much better way to spend 17 days than dabbling in a Rach piece that would be a major stretch (either of them).

[rachmaninoff_forever]

You won't listen, but my advice would be to do neither. Sure, start the Appassionata, but otherwise I'd recommend getting together as much grade 4-6 stuff as you can lay your hands on and sight-read your way to a broader exposure.  It will be a much better way to spend 17 days than dabbling in a Rach piece that would be a major stretch (either of them).

That's what my teacher is freaking making me do!!!

He freaking assigned three chopin preludes and I don't wanna do them!  

But I'm not getting out of break without at least Appassionata.

EDIT:

Duuuuuuuuuuude!!! John Cage would be perfect!!!  His freaking dream and landscape are sooooooooooo good!!!

[j_menz]

That's what my teacher is freaking making me do!!!

He freaking assigned three chopin preludes and I don't wanna do them!  

But I'm not getting out of break without at least Appassionata.

EDIT:

Duuuuuuuuuuude!!! John Cage would be perfect!!!  His freaking dream and landscape are sooooooooooo good!!!

Haha, if I were "assigning" a list it would be more like:

Chopin - Mazurkas (all), 3-4 Waltzes and a couple of nocturnes.
Clementi - Sonatinas (all)
Beethoven - Sonatinas (all) + some bagatelles
Mozart - 4-5 Sonatas and all the sonatinas
Haydn - First 6 Sonatas
Satie - Gymnopedies and Gnossiennes
Debussy - half a dozen preludes
Shostakovich - 3 Fantastic Dances
Bach - all the 2 part inventions and two suites

As a minimum!

That's what a "romp through the repertoire" looks like. 

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Haha, if I were "assigning" a list it would be more like:

Chopin - Mazurkas (all), 3-4 Waltzes and a couple of nocturnes.
Clementi - Sonatinas (all)
Beethoven - Sonatinas (all) + some bagatelles
Mozart - 4-5 Sonatas and all the sonatinas
Haydn - First 6 Sonatas
Satie - Gymnopedies and Gnossiennes
Debussy - half a dozen preludes
Shostakovich - 3 Fantastic Dances
Bach - all the 2 part inventions and two suites

As a minimum!

That's what a "romp through the repertoire" looks like. 

Eeeew!!!

[j_menz]

Eeeew!!!

 

Perhaps you should change your signature to "The odd plunge into a teensy bit of the repertoire"

[ajspiano]

Haha, if I were "assigning" a list it would be more like:

etc. etc.

That's what a "romp through the repertoire" looks like. 

Sometimes even I start to think we share at least some of our conciousnesses.

[j_menz]

Sometimes even I start to think we share at least some of our conciousnesses.

If I develop an addiction to tea, I'm seeing a therapist! 

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Okay so started off with the first movement, and I just finished learning page 8 out of 23...  Of the first movement.  

I'm having a little bit of trouble playing stuff up to speed, but I think that's because I'm not used to the notes yet

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Sometimes even I start to think we share at least some of our conciousnesses.

SEE THE LIGHT!!!

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Okay so I got the first 8 pages at a relatively decent tempo...?  I'm currently on page 11, but I'm having some difficulty on some of these runs.  Once again I think the main culprit for this is the lack of muscle memory, but I think technique is more of an issue than before. 

I looked through te rest of the first movement, and a lot of it is repetition of the other stuff, but just in a different key after page 13.  So I think most of the rest of the first movement should go a little more smoothly than so far.  And that page with those freaking runs don't show up again thank god...

[j_menz]

I think most of the rest of the first movement should go a little more smoothly than so far. 

Hahah, just wait.... 

Oh, and can you put bar numbers - my pdf copy is clearly differently paginated than yours and I'm having trouble following your progress.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Hahah, just wait....  

Oh, and can you put bar numbers - my pdf copy is clearly differently paginated than yours and I'm having trouble following your progress.

Bars 81-92 are giving me the biggest problems.

I wanna see if I can take care of the rest of 11 through 13 or maybe 14 by tomorrow.

[j_menz]

Bars 81-92 are giving me the biggest problems.

I wanna see if I can take care of the rest of 11 through 13 or maybe 14 by tomorrow.

I suspect it's the quintuplets (then changing to sextuplets) that's the real issue, not the actual notes (which you should find relatively straightforward). Thinking in 5s doesn't come naturally, and you probably haven't done an extended passage in these before. It may take a while for it to feel natural.

If you want something else to work on to help, try the opening of the Emperor Concerto - it may help make things clearer, though you may not think so at first. Just the scale like bits right at the start.

I'm assuming you've already got the RH pinky or LH thumb being used on the top note of each figure - it won't work otherwise.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

I suspect it's the quintuplets (then changing to sextuplets) that's the real issue, not the actual notes (which you should find relatively straightforward). Thinking in 5s doesn't come naturally, and you probably haven't done an extended passage in these before. It may take a while for it to feel natural.

If you want something else to work on to help, try the opening of the Emperor Concerto - it may help make things clearer, though you may not think so at first. Just the scale like bits right at the start.

I'm assuming you've already got the RH pinky or LH thumb being used on the top note of each figure - it won't work otherwise.

Do you think that a good exercise would be holding down the bottom note longer than all the other notes?

If you catch my drift...

[j_menz]

Do you think that a good exercise would be holding down the bottom note longer than all the other notes?

If you catch my drift...

Absolutely not!  I'd suggest make it extra extra loud for a bit, but don't play with the note lengths at all at this stage. 

Make sure you don't pause before it, emphasise it, and don't hold it longer than it should be.

I'd also suggest counting out loud.  I don't often suggest that, but here it will help.

And remember that it will always have a slight emphasis. Too many people don't  keep that note emphasised, so lose the rhythm and drive forwards, both for themselves and for the listener.

[j_menz]

Further to the above, this is also one of those reare instances where I'd seriously recommend doing just the arps, not the surrounding notes (sort of HS, but you use each as required).

As I said, the problem here is to get the quintulpets drummed into you as a natural figure. The notes themselves aren't that difficult, but if you don't have the figuration clear, they start to fall over one another.

Also, in quintuplets, it is important not to emphasise any note but the first. Not even a tiny bit.

DA da da da da DA da da da da DA da da da da

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Further to the above, this is also one of those reare instances where I'd seriously recommend doing just the arps, not the surrounding notes (sort of HS, but you use each as required).

As I said, the problem here is to get the quintulpets drummed into you as a natural figure. The notes themselves aren't that difficult, but if you don't have the figuration clear, they start to fall over one another.

Also, in quintuplets, it is important not to emphasise any note but the first. Not even a tiny bit.

DA da da da da DA da da da da DA da da da da

Nevermind, I'm fine now. 

I wanted to practice today, but couldn't get much done.  Stage crew auditorium people wanted to watch a movie, so I couldn't do anything.  In stead, I decided to watch Batman with them! 

I'm only on page 12.    

[rachmaninoff_forever]

hey how the freaking heck do you deal with those trills on measures 138, 142, 144, and 146?

[j_menz]

hey how the freaking heck do you deal with those trills on measures 138, 142, 144, and 146?

Hahah, just wait.... 

Don't say I didn't warn you. 

Slowly, and bring them up to speed over time.

They are a pain, and pretty much everyone finds them a real challenge.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Okay so I wanna see if I can finish the first movement by the end of Monday.

Those trills freakingnsuck man,,,

[j_menz]

Okay so I wanna see if I can finish the first movement by the end of Monday.

Those trills freakingnsuck man,,,

They really should have their own support group. 

[rachmaninoff_forever]

My teacher raged at me for doing Appassionata instead of the homework he assigned.

So tomorrow I'm working on the homework...

[vsrinivasa]

My teacher raged at me for doing Appassionata instead of the homework he assigned.

So tomorrow I'm working on the homework...

You shouldn't have told him you were doing Appassionata. You should have just said you didn't have time to practice or something. And maybe split your time more in favour of his homework, but don't abandon the Appassionata. It is a wonderful sonata.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Alright, so I'm picking it up again starting today!

I had to relearn some notes, but I'm surprised overall on how intact it still was.  So I moved on, and I'm on page 22 of the first movement, and I started learning some of the third movement.

Dude playing Beethoven really puts you in a bad mood afterwards.  I don't get this from any other composer but him.

[j_menz]

Dude playing Beethoven really puts you in a bad mood afterwards.  I don't get this from any other composer but him.

Not all Beethoven. The Hammerklavier always leaves me feeling greatly uplifted. But I believe I did warn you about the Appassionata.

[ajspiano]

Thats certainly not the feeling I get from the 2nd mov. of the pathetique.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Not all Beethoven. The Hammerklavier always leaves me feeling greatly uplifted. But I believe I did warn you about the Appassionata.

I was sightreading through the last two pages and I was like what the heck is going on?!  Who are you?!?!?!

[j_menz]

I was sightreading through the last two pages and I was like what the heck is going on?!  Who are you?!?!?!

I find it amazing that even after years of playing Beethoven, he still has the ability to genuinely shock you from time to time. Even in pieces you know.

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Yes!!!  Learned the whole first movement!

I still have to get some of the stuff near the end engraved in my hands, though.  But I don't need the score to practice it anymore!

[rachmaninoff_forever]

How the heck are you supposed to play this? 

The right hand melody in the middle bar.  The tied notes.

[austinarg]

How the heck are you supposed to play this? 

The right hand melody in the middle bar.  The tied notes.

You are worried about 4 notes in a separate voice in the right hand? Try to play Op. 111 and come back at this, you'll think it's child's play.