Digital Piano for classical music

[pinkfloydhomer]

First of all, thank you all for this great forum

Now, I already own a Nordiska 120CA upright which I play on whenever I can (mostly Bach at the moment, trying to get my head around some preludes and fugues from the WTC). But I want to be able to practice much more, without disturbing my family and neighbors. So I figured I have to add a digital piano to the mix.

I have the following requirements:

- It has to be fairly portable so that I can put it away after practice. I don't have permanent space for both the acoustic and the digital.

- Action and key weight should be fairly close to a good piano. I have to be able to transfer any enhancement of finger strength and technique to an acoustic.

- The grand piano sound has to be fairly good, preferably excellent

- Speakers are not essential, headphones will be used primarily

- I will not be gigging with it, it will only be used for practicing classical piano.

I owned a Casio Privia PX-200 before I got the acoustic. Then I sold the PX-200.
What I am searching for now has to be better than the PX-200. It was portable enough, but the action and the piano sound was not good enough for me (but certainly ok for the low price of the PX-200).

Having searched around a bit, I guess my budget is around $1000, my that figure is not set in stone. If I can get something substantially better for a little more, I'm interested.

I am gravitating towards the Yamaha CP33 at the moment. But I find it a little odd that such and old piano (from 2006, I believe?) doesn't have superior competitors in the same price bracket. Or at least a superior successor.
Yamaha's own P155 looks superior on paper, but discussions on this and other forums suggests that it is actually inferior (not meaning to start a war here, just conveying my impression).

I hope you guys can answer some of these questions:

Does the CP33 suit my purpose?
Does the CP33 or the P155 suit my purpose better?
What are the major competitors at this price level and the level above, say, up to $1500 (probably more than I will spend, but who knows?).
How much better is GH3 than GH? What is the cheapest portable digital with GH3?

Thanks in advance!

[hfmadopter]

At the $1000 price point I'd probably look from the $699 to $1600 price range and include more options. For under $1000 I might consider Casio, the PX330 for instance. And at about $1600 the Yamaha Cp50. I'd be inclined to drop the C33 most likely, just that technology moves on and that is a 2006 model. I'd have to think there would be more offered in later models in some way, if not just feature sets and or finer layering.

On the low end ( I'd say $1000 and under is relatively low but good quality once you hit the weighted key catagory), Casio has done a decent job of representing open string harmonics considering the price point. Yamaha may have the finer touch of the keys.

 So everything is a compromise with digital, pick your compromise set that fits your needs best and go buy it ! It's almost like cameras these days.

[pinkfloydhomer]

But that's exactly one of my questions to this forum: What other options from, say, $699 to $1600 should I consider? Can you name some?

I tried the CP33 and the P155 today in a store. I also tried the CP50 and the Casio PX330 and several other Yamahas and Rolands, also much more expensive ones, just to compare.

My (subjective) conclusions so far:

- None of them, not even the most expensive ones, impresses me particularly when it comes to the grand piano sound, at least through the Sennheiser HD 555 I brought with me. Of course, the more expensive ones sound better than the cheaper ones, and better than the Casio PX-200 I used to own. But I concluded that the sound itself is immensely important for me, since it doesn't give anything close to a real piano anyway. I could live with either Yamaha or Roland or maybe even the better Casio ones. Also, the CP33 sounded as good as any of them, even the more expensive ones. At least to my ears. It also sounded better than the P155.

- The action of the CP33, the P155 and their closest competitors is much better than what I experienced with my old Casio PX-200. I don't think any of them feels like a real piano, but the most important thing is that the actions is good enough for me to develop finger strength and techique that can be used on a real piano. But then again, the action of the old Casio PX-200 was probably good enough for that.

I am leaning towards the CP33 at the moment. Can you guys name some alternatives that I should check out?

[hfmadopter]

But that's exactly one of my questions to this forum: What other options from, say, $699 to $1600 should I consider? Can you name some?

I tried the CP33 and the P155 today in a store. I also tried the CP50 and the Casio PX330 and several other Yamahas and Rolands, also much more expensive ones, just to compare.

My (subjective) conclusions so far:


I am leaning towards the CP33 at the moment. Can you guys name some alternatives that I should check out?

Seems to me you answered your own question by trying digitals above the level you are wanting to buy in and come back to the C33. In the end that one is suiting you best. Keep in mind that they still make acoustics for a reason and digitals are fine but not quite the same as acoustics. For me they serve a purpose, maybe silent practice, maybe portablity or space saving, more universal but not replacement of acoustics. If the c33 feels and sounds the best  even over Rolands and over more expensive models and the price is right, that may just be your best compromise.

You tried the CP50 Yamaha, you didn't care for that over the C33. That would have been and in fact was my suggestion.

 Have you tried any Kawais ? I have not myself but would like to. Listen to the Grand Piano sound of this MP6 Kawai. I think it sounds much like my own grand :  https://www.kawaius.com/main_links/digital/PRO_2010/mp6_audio.html

[pinkfloydhomer]

Unfortunately, I haven't tried the Kawai MP6 yet. It sure sounds nice, and from what I can gather from online forums, it should be an excellent DP, both sound-wise and action-wise.

The Kawai MP6 costs about $1800 where I live (Denmark, Europe), whereas the Yamaha CP33 costs about $1350. But maybe it's worth the extra price?

I wonder how the MP6 action feels compared to the CP33. Maybe someone on this forum have tried both?

Also, I know that I am not entitled to a certain number of answers or any answers at all on this great forum, but do you have an idea why no one else have answered my post? Is it too long? Maybe I should make a shorter post

Thanks in advance!

[hfmadopter]

Unfortunately, I haven't tried the Kawai MP6 yet. It sure sounds nice, and from what I can gather from online forums, it should be an excellent DP, both sound-wise and action-wise.

The Kawai MP6 costs about $1800 where I live (Denmark, Europe), whereas the Yamaha CP33 costs about $1350. But maybe it's worth the extra price?

I wonder how the MP6 action feels compared to the CP33. Maybe someone on this forum have tried both?

Also, I know that I am not entitled to a certain number of answers or any answers at all on this great forum, but do you have an idea why no one else have answered my post? Is it too long? Maybe I should make a shorter post

Thanks in advance!

All I can say is that the Kawai has actual action in it, it should feel very convincing. It's also adjustable for weight. I would love to play one, my nearest dealer is 90 miles away though. I would also assume that Kawai in their video used a top notch audio system they tied the mP6 in to. I ran into a blog reviewing the MP6, if I can find it gain I'll post a link but the actual head set you buy to use with these things is going to matter quite a bit regarding the sound you get ( you did say you were interested in that).

I do not know why others have not posted. Maybe ask your question politely explaining this in the performance forum. People there play a lot of different instruments. I know it's not the place for it but may be worth a shot ! Meanwhile, I'm answering more messages these days  as my sister in law is staying with us for three weeks. That adds up to less practice time and more locked away in my studio with my computer time !!! Most of the topics are a bit slow now I notice, I think people are letting out for summer, backing off of forums a bit.

[keys60]

Another reason you may not be getting a lot of hits is because there are hundreds and hundreds of different piano manufacturers and each have many different models. As well, a good majority of musicians here play acoustic instruments. You seem to have a solid foundation on what you need to accomplish your goals. I think the best thing for you to do is play the hell out of everything digital in your price range and beyond and choose what is best for yourself. Preference is so subjective when choosing an instrument.
Thank you, by the way, for posting this. I'm looking for a good digital for my daughter to use in her dorm room and this piqued my interest in the 2 new Kawai models. I was pretty much stuck on the Casios and the Yamahas, but the new Kawai ES6 and EP3 seem quite intriguing. They seem more portable and lighter with the same action design as the MP6. The sound quality may not be quite as good though.

[hfmadopter]

Another reason you may not be getting a lot of hits is because there are hundreds and hundreds of different piano manufacturers and each have many different models. As well, a good majority of musicians here play acoustic instruments. You seem to have a solid foundation on what you need to accomplish your goals. I think the best thing for you to do is play the hell out of everything digital in your price range and beyond and choose what is best for yourself. Preference is so subjective when choosing an instrument.
Thank you, by the way, for posting this. I'm looking for a good digital for my daughter to use in her dorm room and this piqued my interest in the 2 new Kawai models. I was pretty much stuck on the Casios and the Yamahas, but the new Kawai ES6 and EP3 seem quite intriguing. They seem more portable and lighter with the same action design as the MP6. The sound quality may not be quite as good though.

These models are nice too, almost the same kind of money for either but the MP 6 just has a special sound IMO. Kawai has nailed it with the Mp 6 , it's about the most non digital sound I've heard in a digital piano, at least online ( I still have not gotten out to play one) and it has a certain quality grand sound that I like ( maybe a bit nasal it could be said).. The piano seems to sing fairly nicely ( light sustain is often a problem in digitals).

If someone must own a digital, for me that's the one. Hearing all three from the Kawai site, the MP 6 stands tall. The studio grand sound of one of the others wasn't bad.

[maczip]

Recently I stood for almost the same question. I took the Nord Stage Piano for a couple of reaons:
-best samples of Yamaha, Steinway and Boesendorfer
-plus e-pianos
-plus very nice harpsichord!!!
-you can exchange differnet soundbanks if you like
-quite easy to transport
-pretty good touch and feel (of couse not comparebale to a real piano or grand)

[gvfarns]

I see a few questions unanswered in this thread. My views:

-- Yes the cp33 will do you and is a good option.

-- The p155 and cp33 are very, very similar in every respect.  I like the connectivity of the CP33 (usb to host) better so I'd personally probably go that way.  I use software pianos regularly.  I don't hear much difference in their sound quality personally.  Yamaha has not really changed much in their bread-and-butter digitals since 2006 in terms of sound.

-- Kawai MP6, ES6, and the new ES7 (with three sensor action) are competitors.  As well as the Yamaha CP50.  Roland has the FP7F but it's more expensive generally.

-- There is little to no difference between GH and GH3. The latter is mechanically the same but features a three-sensor action, which emulates the fast repetition capability of a grand piano.  Playing a two sensor action is analogous to playing an upright, rather than a grand, in this respect.

-- Yamaha does not put GH3 in any portable/stage pianos, nor in any piano in the Arius line.  Only Clavinovas above the CLP330 (iirc) level have it.  Kawai features a three sensor action only in the ES7.  Roland has it in any piano with a PHAIII action, like the FP7F.

[keys60]

I purchased a DGX640 for my daughter. Personally, I don't like it. Seems like a big toy. Hundreds of useless sounds (IMHO). I would like to return it, but she likes it. Went to look at the Kawais, they didn't have any, except for the MP10, which was to heavy and large for a small dorm room and over my budget. I personally thought the Casio PX330 had a much better action yet weak in volume and tone. Next time, I won't be so impulsive.

[pianoplunker]

First of all, thank you all for this great forum

Now, I already own a Nordiska 120CA upright which I play on whenever I can (mostly Bach at the moment, trying to get my head around some preludes and fugues from the WTC). But I want to be able to practice much more, without disturbing my family and neighbors. So I figured I have to add a digital piano to the mix.

I have the following requirements:

- It has to be fairly portable so that I can put it away after practice. I don't have permanent space for both the acoustic and the digital.

- Action and key weight should be fairly close to a good piano. I have to be able to transfer any enhancement of finger strength and technique to an acoustic.

- The grand piano sound has to be fairly good, preferably excellent

- Speakers are not essential, headphones will be used primarily

- I will not be gigging with it, it will only be used for practicing classical piano.

I owned a Casio Privia PX-200 before I got the acoustic. Then I sold the PX-200.
What I am searching for now has to be better than the PX-200. It was portable enough, but the action and the piano sound was not good enough for me (but certainly ok for the low price of the PX-200).

Having searched around a bit, I guess my budget is around $1000, my that figure is not set in stone. If I can get something substantially better for a little more, I'm interested.

I am gravitating towards the Yamaha CP33 at the moment. But I find it a little odd that such and old piano (from 2006, I believe?) doesn't have superior competitors in the same price bracket. Or at least a superior successor.
Yamaha's own P155 looks superior on paper, but discussions on this and other forums suggests that it is actually inferior (not meaning to start a war here, just conveying my impression).

I hope you guys can answer some of these questions:

Does the CP33 suit my purpose?
Does the CP33 or the P155 suit my purpose better?
What are the major competitors at this price level and the level above, say, up to $1500 (probably more than I will spend, but who knows?).
How much better is GH3 than GH? What is the cheapest portable digital with GH3?

Thanks in advance!

I have bought a few digital pianos .   I have tried out a few others as well.  Here are some that are portable, with a semi-realistic touch but most of all fabulous Acoustic Piano sound. A little bit older so maybe you can get one way under your price point if you were to buy used.
Roland RD150, Yamaha P80, Yamaha P60, Yamaha P-150, Roland FP8, Roland FP2.  The RD150 I mention has some overtone and other fine tuning adjustments that can be made to help create the perfect sound. Some of these pianos dont have speakers so you need a sound system to plug into.  What you may want to try is a midi-controller keyboard with a sound module that you like. That will take a little more trying out on your part but you could end up with a keyboard that has the best touch and a sound module that has the best sound.