Hi, would love some help on picking first (digital) piano

[outin]

Thanks! And I have to call the tuner. There is this Voluntary association in Holland (or group/etc) officially recognized and when they support you, apparently you are a professional tuner. It's called "Vereniging voor Pianotechnici".

We have something similar here, but the tuning usually costs a bit more. Your price seems very reasonable...

[ranniks]

That's interesting to know! Well, I'm happy to pay for tuning if it means being able to play the piano.

This article: https://aftune.angelfire.com/buyused.html

Say this:

"Be sure the piano has 88 keys! Old English pianos, which have only 85 keys, are pretty to look at but frequently have serious tuning problems. There are also some pianos made with even fewer keys. While handy if you have very limited space, these are not suitable for serious piano study."

*Sigh*

I like the piano and I think that matters. And if my teacher thought it appropriate I guess 85 keys is plenty. I'm wondering something though: <1920s they did make 85 key pianos, only after they made the standard 88 keys pianos, correct? Most classical pieces are from before that time, so shouldn't I be able to play most, if not all classical piecess on this 85 key piano?

I'm not gonna complain though. For this price and all I mean.

[outin]

This article: https://aftune.angelfire.com/buyused.html

Say this:

"Be sure the piano has 88 keys! Old English pianos, which have only 85 keys, are pretty to look at but frequently have serious tuning problems. There are also some pianos made with even fewer keys. While handy if you have very limited space, these are not suitable for serious piano study."

I am not sure, if the amount of keys is the source of tuning problems, or the fact that they are old English pianos. Someone else can asnwer that.

For your purposes the amount of keys is absolutely no issue from the playing perspective. After you have advanced to the level where you would actually need to play the missing keys, you already will need and want a better instrument anyway. That shouldn't be before 5 years depending on how fast you go. With the price you payed for this one, you have well benefited from it then and you might even get the same money from selling it if you keep it well

[hfmadopter]

[quote ]

I've found a tuner for that. He asks 60 in euros an hour for tuning and about the same for maintenance. He'll even look at the piano while tuning it, so I think I'm set.

Don't I have to wait a week before tuning it though?

[/quote]

My main concern would be that the piano is very very old and the tuning pins loose in the pin block. That's about the extent of concern to you as the owner, the tuner will deal with getting it tuned. Ya know really a lot of this would have been sorted if you had gotten a tuner to look at the piano before you paid for it ! I suggested that you do that many posts ago. Hind sight is 20/20 and no need to harp on it, so I'm hoping the tuner has good news for you when he arrives and assesses things. And you can then get on with playing the piano.

I'm not aware of any special concerns in tuning an 85 key piano beyond age and with some models maybe accessibility. There are some harmonics changes/differences with more or less keys but it's more to do with using the sustain pedal.

If the piano is getting grossly out of tune since the move best to get it done. If not then wait till some weather changes occur.

I wouldn't want my piano near a heat source or in the sun. And if it must be there start thinking about humidifying it some how when the heat starts to run in the house ( not a bad idea anyway).

[ranniks]

I just had to have the piano David, lol. I thought I was paying a lot more for the transport, otherwise that tuner would have checked it out before.

I've played on the piano for a while today and the sound doesn't sound false/out of tune at all. It's like it hasn't been played on for a long while. That's it.

I'll wait until september for the tuning then I guess.

I'll look into humidifying things and taking care of it more tomorrow.

I tried finding the serial code for the piano but the only number I found was '110' behind the lid down of the keyboard (where the pedals are) engraved in iron/metal substance. I believe this piano could very well be a hundred years old .

Either way, I'm really happy that I finally have a piano to play on. And even more happy that it's an acoustic and that I'm all set to learn classical music!

Thanks for all the help David and you too Outin! Much love to the both of you!

I'll make another thread someday and show you how far I've come with learning the piano and all that good stuff (I hope I get that far at least).

[hfmadopter]

Enjoy your piano ! If it didn't go out of whack during the move then it's probably in pretty good shape.

Keep us posted !
David

[ranniks]

Hey guys! A little update:

- So far I've counted 5.5 hours playing on my acoustic piano.
- Only a few keys feel tedious (likely need of tuning or maintenance), but they don't bother me because I think I need to strengthen my left ring finger.
- Am working my way to perfectionize my first piece: Freude Schoner Gotterfunken from Beethoven's 9th symphony (sheet provided by my teacher for practise)
- Got a piano bench!

I've even been thinking of saving a bit aside and get a korg 250 for night playing in the future, maybe a year or two from now. Most likely there will be a better choice by then.

Also, when I went shopping for my piano bench I noticed this yamaha dp model. It coste around 7000 euros, which is around 10000 dollars. I was wondering who in their right mind would buy that thing when they could buy a brand new upright for the same price or a used grand! I guess there are people who can throw away money or just have much to spare.

When I played that dp, it didn't even come close to the acoustic feeling of my alexander herrman at home. My teacher has a yamaha grand or baby grand (not sure) on which he teaches the other students and me (the lessons are individual) and that dp did not resemble it in the slightest.

On a side note: My teacher had owned the alexander herrman piano (he told me since he teaches and is in the circuit he knows when someone is selling/needing one) prior and has played on it. When I asked him about it he said it was fine and that he had played on it.

I kind of get what people mean by acoustic>dp. But I can also understand the comfort of the dp though; nice to have lying around for night playing or spur of the moment and mobility.

I'm gonna take good care of my acoustic and get it tuned mid september or ask my teacher when to let it be tuned (he, like David said prior, suggested september but not a definite period in september).

My next post will be likely a few weeks away with an update telling you about the tuning/maintenance.

Until then!

[chopin2015]

Very Nice! My teacher has yamaha grand...the nice one. Their action is my favorite. So you have an upright? I looove uprights! I think spinets sound goofy, like a little toy. Get a digital in addition to your acoustic for private practice at any time, any place(with some headphones). Let us know how the piece is coming, as well as what other pieces you are working on!

Take care!

[hfmadopter]

Hey guys! A little update:
 

I'm gonna take good care of my acoustic and get it tuned mid september or ask my teacher when to let it be tuned (he, like David said prior, suggested september but not a definite period in september).

My next post will be likely a few weeks away with an update telling you about the tuning/maintenance.

Until then!

I was just thinking along the lines of you having the piano tuned once the weather has solidly changed over from summer. It's just a suggestion, you can have it tuned when ever you like or if it really needs it sooner.

I'm really glad it's working out for you and you are liking the piano ! FWIW, the fouth and fifth fingers take a while to strengthen for all of us. I too found my fourth to be the weakest early on.

[ranniks]

Update:

- Found the serial number of my alexander herrman piano: 11864
According to: https://www.pianoveiling.nl/lijst-bouwjaren/alexander-hermann.html

It's from 1942. I'm still enjoying it very much. And it doesn't sound out of tune/bad or anything.

The tuner is coming tuesday morning, so I'm really wondering if I will notice any change. The piano hasn't been tuned in a year (perhaps longer).

Also managed to set one hammer straight myself 0.o. I just put a little bit of pressure on it and when I hit the key it didn't 'stick' anymore. I didn't hear a 'click' or anything. Tried it with the other hammers; did not work. The tuner will take a look at it, he said.

My weekly lessons are going good. I found the patience and understand that I need to master the basics before even thinking of learning other classical pieces.
I've tried the 'counting' thing you suggested David; it seems like it is working.

Also inclined to buy a digital just for the heck of it. Will buy one next year maybe.

Will update again after tuner has visited.

Edit:

It's from 1924, got the date wrong, lol. So the piano is 88 years old 0.o! Feels good to have it!

[outin]

Good to hear things are going well...That's a pretty old piano and still working

[hfmadopter]

All great news ! Glad you are getting along well with the piano. If that piano hasn't totally whcked out of tune by now with the move and all it must be in decent shape. Even so I think you will be all the more pleased after the tuning.

Mine startng to do it's fall migration ! I'll need to tune soon.
David

[ranniks]

So the tuner is here! Well, I'm at my intership and he's with my dad at home.

So he said he won't be able to do a 'full' tuning but a 'global quick one' because he needs to take a look at the hammers as well. He said that some need some glueing (not sure what that is exactly), some substance he needs to put on them. Also a few are not good so he needs to use a pin of some sort and remove then or something.

So he'll do that for me. He also suggested I let him tune the piano later as well since he isn't doing a full tuning.

He also told me the piano was definitely out of tune and the hammers would make it hard for me to play something about 'this is not comfortable for you'. I'll let the expert do his job.

But he'll make the piano sound better and I''ll have him over in a month or 2 or a few weeks from now.

David, do you have any idea why the hammers need to be repaired? So it isn't just that it's put wrong at the bottom?

[ranniks]

On the bill it says he has replaced something with the top hammers (something with axis, can't read it properly) and he has tuned it. The hammers look cleaners somehow 0.o. I'd have to play on it to explain how it has changed though. My dad tells me he pulled the whole thing containing the hammers out and did some work on it the whole hour he was there.

[ranniks]

Piano technicians must be magicians!

I've practised for an hour orso and I must say: wowzers! The action is so much better now. Whereas before it was heavy and loose the action is now much more steady and lighter (or so it feels like that). The sound is absolutely much better (the tuning?). I have no idea what he did with the hammers, but only 2 stick out slightly now but I don't notice any difference while playing.

On the payment paper it says he replaced something of the top hammers. He wrote it down weird I have no idea. I don't think he replaced a hammer, but he did replace something! My dad told me he was busy tuning for about 20-30 minutes and the rest he spend on the hammers apparently. Maybe that's why he wanted to come and tune it 'fully'? He said he would do a global tuning now, but suggested another visit to do a tuning of an hour, not sure what he meant with that. But he told me that because he would be busy with the hammers too.

I just paid him what he and most of Holland's piano techs ask an hour; 75 euros. Which should be around 100 usd or something. That would be for tuning as well.

I would almost go as far as saying the action is the same as my teacher's yamaha grand, but it's not. The yamaha grand is lighter and more versatile.

Well, I'm a happy customer and my hands and ears are grateful!

[hfmadopter]

Piano technicians must be magicians!

Well, I'm a happy customer and my hands and ears are grateful!

Thought you would be happy. he probably did some regulating of the action for one thing. He may have worked on damper felts.

Often when time is short a tuning may consist of just leveling the strings to one anohter. In other words often in a unison ( the three string set of one key which the hammer strikes) of strings only one has dropped , so bring that one up to the two next to it. In 20 minutes there is no way he tuned the entire piano unless it was practially in tune already. When he comes back if there is a pitch change required he may do that , for instance . And in so doing all strings may need attention. He will work on how chords harmonize.

Your question earlier about working on the hammers more than the strings or why ? Yes, if the hammers aren't touching the strings correctly it will effect how you tune, so that needs to be addressed.
David

[ranniks]

I'M IN LOVE WITH MY PIANO! Even though it's a cheap piano, it plays so well! Maybe I've played so long on it that I've grown accustomed to it. My fingers are stronger and the action has become lighter.

I played the first line of the Minuet, and gosh I felt so liberated when I played it. I only played like the first 10-16 notes btw. The right hand movements aren't to tedious in the beginning, just gotta get the left hand movements down.

Today's practise went by so quickly! I printed out a Dutch sinterklaas song and played it, it was in the c-position and g-position was possible as well.

Thought you would be happy. he probably did some regulating of the action for one thing. He may have worked on damper felts.

Often when time is short a tuning may consist of just leveling the strings to one anohter. In other words often in a unison ( the three string set of one key which the hammer strikes) of strings only one has dropped , so bring that one up to the two next to it. In 20 minutes there is no way he tuned the entire piano unless it was practially in tune already. When he comes back if there is a pitch change required he may do that , for instance . And in so doing all strings may need attention. He will work on how chords harmonize.

Your question earlier about working on the hammers more than the strings or why ? Yes, if the hammers aren't touching the strings correctly it will effect how you tune, so that needs to be addressed.
David

But isn't it odd David? Before he came when I pressed a key it went in too deep and it felt heavier. After he left the playing was light and cool and brisk and just awesome!

He told me the piano was in no way from 1920s, but from the 60s or 70s rather. 0.o Must have mixed up the serial numbers.

[hfmadopter]

I'M IN LOVE WITH MY PIANO! Even though it's a cheap piano, it plays so well!

He told me the piano was in no way from 1920s, but from the 60s or 70s rather. 0.o Must have mixed up the serial numbers.

I'm not surprised by the age, it didn't look older than you indicate in this post. But maybe get the right serial number and someone will run it through the piano blue book for you.