At what point can you say that you can 'play' the piano

[leemond2008]

OK this is completely subjective

I had a conversation with someone I work with this morning, I showed her a little video of me playing a piece that I'm currently learning, we got into a little debate because she said I can already 'play' my argument was that I am still 'learning'

I've been playing now for 9 or ten months and can play a fair few grade 2 pieces and am getting ready to jump into the grade 3 pieces, I have a few more pieces that are a lot more difficult which I can work my way through.

I still class myself as being very much a learner, I don't think that in my eyes I will be able to say confidently that 'I can play the piano' until I reach the grade 4 sort of level and can learn pieces a hell of a lot quicker than I can at the moment.

I know that the overwhelming answer will be 'you never stop learning' but in your eyes can you say that you can 'play the piano' when you can bash out twinkle twinkle little star with one finger or is it when through hours and hours of practice you can muddle your way through a grade 2 piece, maybe its when you can sit down and look at a piece for the first time and play it rather competently after 20 minutes, maybe it is only when you feel you are on a par with Ludwig Van or Chopin.

I'm not after a definitive answer just curious as to when you personally felt that you could tell people you could play rather than you were learning.

[mjames]

when you can play all of chopin's etudes in one sitting.

[chopinlover01]

Anyone can play the piano. Children will sit up on the bench and obnoxiously smash keys.
At what point can you make music seems to be the better question to me.

[outin]

For the last few weeks I have been debating myself once again whether I should just quit because after 4 years of working my butt off I still cannot play the piano at all. And I don't see that changing in the near future.

I won't quit of course because I am an more obsessive than sane in this matter...

[kazlock]

For the last few weeks I have been debating myself once again whether I should just quit because after 4 years of working my butt off I still cannot play the piano at all. And I don't see that changing in the near future.

I won't quit of course because I am an more obsessive than sane in this matter...

I say that if you put enough effort into playing piano that you can say you've worked your butt off, you can say you play piano. I don't like the idea that you need to reach some arbitrary skill threshold to say you can "play" the piano. If you enjoy piano, put forth effort to practice, and make it a part of your life, I think you can say you play piano.

[outin]

I say that if you put enough effort into playing piano that you can say you've worked your butt off, you can say you play piano. I don't like the idea that you need to reach some arbitrary skill threshold to say you can "play" the piano. If you enjoy piano, put forth effort to practice, and make it a part of your life, I think you can say you play piano.

Yes, I do play the piano in some sense, just cannot really do it

[bronnestam]

Yes, I do play the piano in some sense, just cannot really do it

baah, you can play the piano. I know, because I have heard you.

I think you in general can say you can play the piano when you have a good idea on what to do when you sit down at it. Being able to read sheet music decently and adapt it to the piano keys is of course a sure sign, but there are, undisputably, some good pianists that cannot read notes ...

So, let's look at two persons, let's call them Jane and John. Jane learned to play "Happy Birthday" from a friend. She can sit down at the piano and play it flawlessly with two hands, but she can NOT play the piano. Why? Because she only learned the sequence on the keyboard. She cannot for her life play anything else, unless her friend does not show her that sequence too.
Larry, on the other hand, can also play "Happy Birthday". But he has also learned the basic tools - he knows what fingering is, he can name the keys, read notes decently well, and he has some basic ideas on HOW to press the keys. If you give him another song to play, of the similar level as Happy Birthday, he will learn that too. In fact he can learn to play almost everything provided that you give him it in small portions and let him take the time he needs.

So, Lisa can by definition not play the piano, and Larry can. He may be a lousy pianist at the moment, but he has cracked the code, so to speak.

When it comes to children and reading, teachers like to talk about "cracking the reading code". This means that the child does not only know how to pronounce all the letters, it also understands the principle on HOW to read. It may read a bit slowly in the beginning and has to struggle hard with long and complicated words, but it understands the idea. The rest is just about speeding up.

Maybe you can say the same about piano playing. Once you understand HOW to play, all you need is to speed up ... The rest is just polishing.     

[timothy42b]

After your first paid gig, no matter how cheap.

[brogers70]

I still feel funny saying that I play the piano, even though I've practiced several hours a day for >10 years, because I can't sit down with a violinist friend and just read through the Bach suites for violin and keyboard. When I told my teacher that, she gave me a weird look, and we went back to working on Chopin Op. 10 #9. If your teacher and your family and friends think you can play the piano, they are probably right.

[bronnestam]

baah, you can play the piano. I know, because I have heard you.

I think you in general can say you can play the piano when you have a good idea on what to do when you sit down at it. Being able to read sheet music decently and adapt it to the piano keys is of course a sure sign, but there are, undisputably, some good pianists that cannot read notes ...

So, let's look at two persons, let's call them Jane and John. Jane learned to play "Happy Birthday" from a friend. She can sit down at the piano and play it flawlessly with two hands, but she can NOT play the piano. Why? Because she only learned the sequence on the keyboard. She cannot for her life play anything else, unless her friend does not show her that sequence too.
Larry, on the other hand, can also play "Happy Birthday". But he has also learned the basic tools - he knows what fingering is, he can name the keys, read notes decently well, and he has some basic ideas on HOW to press the keys. If you give him another song to play, of the similar level as Happy Birthday, he will learn that too. In fact he can learn to play almost everything provided that you give him it in small portions and let him take the time he needs.

So, Lisa can by definition not play the piano, and Larry can. He may be a lousy pianist at the moment, but he has cracked the code, so to speak.

When it comes to children and reading, teachers like to talk about "cracking the reading code". This means that the child does not only know how to pronounce all the letters, it also understands the principle on HOW to read. It may read a bit slowly in the beginning and has to struggle hard with long and complicated words, but it understands the idea. The rest is just about speeding up.

Maybe you can say the same about piano playing. Once you understand HOW to play, all you need is to speed up ... The rest is just polishing.     

Oh, so I seem to have renamed my two models in this story. Jane and John became Lisa and Larry near the end. So, nobody noticed.    I pretend I was not confused, I say it was an exercise in sight reading, ha ha ha.

[tenk]

Whether you think you can or cannot play the piano, you are right.

(Shamelessly stolen from famous quote)

[dcstudio]

Whether you think you can or cannot play the piano, you are right.

(Shamelessly stolen from famous quote)

 that's for sure 

when did I first start saying I could play the piano?   hmmm... ok... saying it and MEANING it or saying it in an effort to fool those around me into thinking I could play?  big difference.

lol... you see after University I thought I could play... and I said I could play..  then I had my first jazz gig which turned into my first long-term house gig...   then I realized I couldn't play (as well as I had hoped)--and started referring to myself as someone "learning jazz on the gig."

As an accompanist I almost always claim to already be able to play whatever the job calls for--it makes the soloist rest easy...

so I guess my answer to your question is... it depends on the day and who I am talking to. 

btw.. I have played the piano for 47 years... so it is safe for me to say I am an decent pianist...

[irrational]

I know what you mean and I think there are a few angles.
I have only been learning for 5 years and the more I learn the more I know in myself that I can't play yet. I am busy with grade 7 out of 8. But then again part of that measurement is against professional pianists. Since I am not one or aiming to be, I will never play like a professional pianist. I don't have the time or skill to do that.

You can differentiate between playing the instrument and playing the music.

My musical talent is not as good as my motor skills. I can learn almost anything really fast. So form that point of view, I can play a piano instrument.
I know how to make different sounds and dynamics with the action on the keys. There is so much more to learn of course, but I can still play.

Musicality is different. I don't have enough innate feeling of music and have to work at it and that understanding takes time to learn. So for myself, I can't play yet. My hands won't do what my brain says as I don't understand what I need to do to make music properly. I am now learning that musical analysis is a whole world of new required knowledge to make music that much more amazing.

BUT. People that have heard me have invited me to play in restaurants or just asked to play more etc. So relatively speaking from most people's point of view I can play.

So to personal satisfaction, not even close.
Can I play. Yes. And it sounds like you can say the same.

Perhaps when you start thinking "I can play, but not well yet", you can play?
I remember grade 3 pieces. I still play them now and then. Little gems. If you can play them, you can certainly play already I'd say.

[timothy42b]

After your first paid gig, no matter how cheap.

I'm going to revise this suggested test.

After the first time somebody hires you again. 

When they want you back, you know you've crossed over.

Caveat:  sometimes you don't get hired again because you're a jerk, rather than because you can't play.  And conversely, I've been hired over better players because I'm a bit easier to work with. 

[pianoplunker]

OK this is completely subjective

I had a conversation with someone I work with this morning, I showed her a little video of me playing a piece that I'm currently learning, we got into a little debate because she said I can already 'play' my argument was that I am still 'learning'

I've been playing now for 9 or ten months and can play a fair few grade 2 pieces and am getting ready to jump into the grade 3 pieces, I have a few more pieces that are a lot more difficult which I can work my way through.

I still class myself as being very much a learner, I don't think that in my eyes I will be able to say confidently that 'I can play the piano' until I reach the grade 4 sort of level and can learn pieces a hell of a lot quicker than I can at the moment.

I know that the overwhelming answer will be 'you never stop learning' but in your eyes can you say that you can 'play the piano' when you can bash out twinkle twinkle little star with one finger or is it when through hours and hours of practice you can muddle your way through a grade 2 piece, maybe its when you can sit down and look at a piece for the first time and play it rather competently after 20 minutes, maybe it is only when you feel you are on a par with Ludwig Van or Chopin.

I'm not after a definitive answer just curious as to when you personally felt that you could tell people you could play rather than you were learning.

If you can gracefully accomplish from beginning to end, you can play. Even then you will still be learning. It is good to be a life-long learner. dont fear it.  Now if you can play impromptu in a public place and get virally posted on youtube, then you can really really play

[pianoplunker]

I'm going to revise this suggested test.

After the first time somebody hires you again. 

When they want you back, you know you've crossed over.

Caveat:  sometimes you don't get hired again because you're a jerk, rather than because you can't play.  And conversely, I've been hired over better players because I'm a bit easier to work with. 

That reminds of a Billy Joel interview where he said when your playing can pay the rent, then you know you have made it. sorry I dont have a direct reference to the interview but it was interesting.

[dcstudio]

That reminds of a Billy Joel interview where he said when your playing can pay the rent, then you know you have made it. sorry I dont have a direct reference to the interview but it was interesting.

IDK my playing pays the rent (most months) --I have 1.7 million hits on my YT channel  and I have played "Piano Man" more times than I care to count-- but I do not feel like I have "made it" by any means...  lol      I do, however, know that I can play... most of the time, anyway.

[briansaddleback]

At what point can you say that you are an artist?

Who is the artist,

The one who, in a month, hastly traces out a hundred famous portraits including the Mona Lisa with his pencil and see-through paper and announces he has replicated the art works?

or

The one who , in a month, painstakingly views and contemplates one of Van Gogh's simpler still lives like "Lemons on a plate" because it personally convicts him/her in some fashion, and carefully replicates it to the best of one's ability w technique and unique expression  (whatever his/her current talent level) and announces this is my expression of and hommage to this famous painting?


Who?

Who will Claude Debussy criticize less?

Huh?





also, let me add..
an 'artist' has many definitions unfortunately by everyone.
I define it as a state of being. Not a label.
I dont chase a label.
Be an artist today. You don't know for tomorrow.