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London based Karrot Animation Studios have been busy working on a music video for pianist Benjamin Grosvenor's performance of Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue. The brief was to assemble a four minute version from the longer audio track whilst creating an animated narrative about Benjamin getting to a concert at New York's Radio City Hall. Read more >>

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Author Topic: Recordings of Separate Parts?  (Read 254 times)
redheadrebby
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« on: August 31, 2017, 11:59:48 AM »

Hi,

I've just started learning Schubert's four-hand Fantasie in f-minor with my teacher. Ideally for me, as I learn sections, I would like to be able to practise them with the other piano part, but logistically I am unable to see my teacher that often. Does anyone know of any sites where there are recordings of just one of the piano parts, so that the other part can be played along? or is YouTube my best bet?
I had also wondered this for concertos; are there recordings of just the orchestral part?

Thanks Smiley
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visitor
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« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2017, 04:37:51 PM »

https://www.musicdispatch.com/search/search.action?_c&menuid=20390&subsiteid=325
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Bob
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« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2017, 04:47:07 PM »

Play through your part and record that.

Then play something from their part while listening to your original recording with headphones.  Then you've got some kind of recording of the other part, and you've learned the other part a bit more.

If you want to get more precise, make a click track of yourself "conducting" the whole thing and follow that.
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visitor
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« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2017, 04:53:02 PM »

i know kids that just learn the 2nd piano part too, theyn they record themselves paying accompanyment, then they play that while they play their own part. lot of work but if your reading chops are up to snuff, works, and you get a solid understanding for ensemble and how it fits w the other part
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tnan123
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« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2017, 05:07:39 PM »

Congrats on attempting such a great work. I've tackled this piece with a friend a long while ago. I remember I had the same issue with limited time together to practice with the other person.

First, here's the direct/quick answer to your questions. The resource I know of is musicminusone.com which i think is actually the same site as listed in an earlier post. Other than that probably just youtube or google it if there is anything available. Most of the time I find there isn't...

Although playing along to a recording is very helpful (as well as maybe attempting the other part to make a recording for yourself). I found that dedicating most of my time to actually mastering my part and getting precise timing with a metronome made it so much easier when we did have the time practice together. That was most efficient for me. Yes, the aural memory you develop while you practice with the other piano part is invaluable but in my mind, master your own part first. Specifically for this piece both the primo and secondo have great passages to work on that need musical mastery on their own. Which part are you doing btw?

Plus, you might be surprised how different a recording of the other part may be to how your teacher is playing it. That's when the time you do get to practice together is the most fun. You can work out how to bring your parts together Smiley Good luck!
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redheadrebby
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« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2017, 10:48:57 AM »

Thanks for the quick replies Smiley
That's a good link, thanks, I hadn't heard of it before but thought there must be something.
I will also use the advice to record myself, and play along, especially as my teacher would like me to learn both the primo and secondo parts so that we can play either way round.

What do you mean by a click track of me "conducting" it, Bob?
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Bob
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« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2017, 10:06:27 AM »

If you make a recording, even if it's you with your tempos, at some point there might be a spot where you need a cue to come in.  How do you do that if it's a recording?  Some kind of auditory cue, like a click, the same way a conductor gives a breath or prep beat.  Then you can come in on time with the recording.  Problem solved.

Say you record yourself playing to that first recording though.  Then you've got a recording of yourself following those little auditory prep cues.  You'd need to add those back in to the second recording... But that's getting nuts by that point.  Plus, you've got human reaction time, so with the second recording, it's actually a recording of you following the first recording.  It would be slightly off.

How do you get rid of that?  Just follow one recording.  One click track "conductor."  You make an "uber" click track "conductor" of yourself tapping the beat while imaging the piece.  Then you can record any part while listening to that.   (I guess a video would actually work too.  You could conduct it and see the beats, etc. visually.  Then follow the image of yourself conducting for any recorded part.  Same idea.)  You have to know the piece better to make the conductor click track though.  (Or you can push through it and use it as a way to learn the piece.  Re-record/revise it later.)  After you've got your 'master' click track, use that for any piece and make a recording of the parts from that.  Then you get the exact tempos.  It still gets human reaction time in though, but if you follow it the same way, you should be really close on each part recording.

That's what I learned with MIDI work that way.  I never figured out how to get the software to take that click track as "the" beat and automatically line up the parts with that.  That would have been very interesting.

Balance can be off too.

It's going off in a slightly different direction for a project and goals, but you do learn the piece a little differently that way.  And, it can really give you a nice overview (forcing you away from "thinking piano"), getting you to focus on things more like a conductor.


If you wanted to, you do the whole second part idea with a computer, sequencer software, synth sounds, etc.  Or get the actual orchestral part (the original) or whatever it is, and use similar instrument sounds to that instead of a piano second part.   It is possible to make a quick, useful recording though without having to spend any time really learning the other parts.  You end up with a more crude recording in some ways, but it's quick and useful.  I suppose ultimately, you should be able to mentally hear the all the other parts and should never need any of this though.
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