[VIDEO] Liszt Transcendental Etude No 8, Chopin Etude Op 25 No 8

[furiouzpianist]

Dear all,

I am back!
Long story, painful breakup, etc... but I am back on track now.
Will finish up the DMA soon.


Chopin Etude No 20, Op 25 No. 8

Liszt Transcendental Etude No 8 “Wilde Jagd”

All unedited.
More to come! A few pieces from the Liszt Années de pèlerinage coming up soon!

[furiouzpianist]

BTW, please subscribe to my youtube Channel here:

I will be posting new content regularly. Thanks!

[ronde_des_sylphes]

:tm: 

Both are obviously to a high standard, but I get the impression you're much more at home in the Liszt (which I really like your performance of).

[furiouzpianist]

Rezpek!

I’ll get a few other video files to post today, go ahead and subscribe to my youtube channel so that I don’t have to necessarily post on a forum each time to get my vids out.

I’ll probably post an alt take of the Chopin etude

-MK

P.S. yes I’m pimping my youtube channel the hell out

[ronde_des_sylphes]

Already subscribed earlier 

[furiouzpianist]

Nice. I’m subbed to you as well

[furiouzpianist]

I’ve played the Liszt since 2010.... always something to improve (or make worse) each time

1K views on it now

[blazekenny]

Hi,
I finally found the time to listen to these two recordings of yours, seeing as you are praised in the comments here.
Now I don't want to sound like snob or say an unpopular opinion just for the sake of it, but to me it just sounds like being played by a computer. Don't get me wrong, playing this  clean is definitely not something that I could achieve, but each of your choices in the pieces were made in order to be 100% in command of the instrument, but I don't hear even a slight resemblance of the will to express your love for music which I as a listener find very disturbing. I am usually a more open minded listener, but considering you are not just an enthusiast, but a professional and a teacher at MSM, I think these recordings are not to a really high standard..
I haven't played these 2 specific pieces, but we have all played Chopin and Liszt etudes, we all know they are difficult to execute well, especially in public, but hell it is music too...
I am looking forward to hear your recordings of some mazurkas, chorals or nocturnes in the future, seeing as so far it is all about octave unleashes and visuals in a scriabin etude  

[furiouzpianist]

perhaps you are right!
I wonder however, if the impression is rather from the 2 pieces in similar character which you listened to....


at any rate, hopefully I can reverse that impression which you had with some future videos that I post.
Thanks for listening and for commenting...
it is indeed a valid point, many of these so-called competitions tend to cultivate this kind of approach, and I am trying to conform to it to some extent....

oh well  
I thought my love for this wonderful music would be rather apparent from the care that went into the preparation for this unedited recording session. Onwards! I hope to do better next time  


do listen to the other things I have posted on my channel and see what you think....
another recording session in 2 weeks with less violent repertoire

[furiouzpianist]

Btw please sub to the channel, also:
Follow me on twitter @MichaelKaykov

https://www.facebook.com/michaelkaykovpianist

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I WILL improve

[blazekenny]

perhaps you are right!
I wonder however, if the impression is rather from the 2 pieces in similar character which you listened to....


at any rate, hopefully I can reverse that impression which you had with some future videos that I post.
Thanks for listening and for commenting...
it is indeed a valid point, many of these so-called competitions tend to cultivate this kind of approach, and I am trying to conform to it to some extent....

oh well  
I thought my love for this wonderful music would be rather apparent from the care that went into the preparation for this unedited recording session. Onwards! I hope to do better next time  


do listen to the other things I have posted on my channel and see what you think....
another recording session in 2 weeks with less violent repertoire

First of all, I really know what you are talking about. Everytime I have recorded in a studio, it has been a nerve racking experience for me. After all the stress, many of these recordings didn't even prove to be usable (provided they were uncut). I feel it is getting better with each recording session though. The case of piano competitions is also quite unfortunate and they indeed do tend to cultivate  - so many months polishing the pieces in order to achieve the highest possible level of professionalism, only to have it destroyed by basically any random factor.

Although I have already been rough enough, let me just point out what I believe are some misunderstandings from you as an interpret (objectively speaking):

1) In musicmaking, the only way to justify yourself is by your performance. No matter how much care or time have you invested, the result is what counts.

2)Let me paraphrase the famous quote "There is no such thing as a bad piano, just bad pianists" to "There is no violent repertoire, just violent performers". A great example of this would be Mazeppa by Liszt. When you listen to the piece as played by (insert a pianist name), you instantly get an impression that it is a vulgar and sh** piece, not reaching even half of the quality of its symphonic poem counterpart. When played by Claudio Arrau though, it is a whole different experience. He aims for the width of sound, the narrative factor of the music and nobility, rendering your "octave unleashes" as only a side product.

[furiouzpianist]

Yes and no...

I truly feel that some of Liszt music demands a rougher, violent treatment...
If anything, I toned it down in the recording studio.

Take a listen to Richter’s or Berman’s Wilde Jagd - I think that kind of take-no-prisoners approach is favorable to a low-octane approach...

[blazekenny]

Yes and no...

I truly feel that some of Liszt music demands a rougher, violent treatment...
If anything, I toned it down in the recording studio.

Take a listen to Richter’s or Berman’s Wilde Jagd - I think that kind of take-no-prisoners approach is favorable to a low-octane approach...

I see what you mean. Although I prefer Arrau's rendition in the case of Wilde jagd as well (And it is far from being low-octane..), I find Richter's recording very exciting. I don't really remember Berman's, but since he is one of my go-to Liszt performers, I would trust your taste on that one too.
 
Even though Richter's version is undoubtedly very masculine, I still don't think "violent" is the main keyword here. What makes it so exciting is the vigorous possession and willpower. The violence is also, in my opinion, present as a side product here. As opposed to Cziffra, where the circus-like violence serves as a generalization to his whole piano playing (Which I find distasteful, sry)
In other words, art is always a mix of various factors and I think some of them are more dominant than others. In Gould's genius Bach recordings case - Which one of those 2 would you pick ? 1) His insane harmonic, rhytmic and counterpoint sensitivity, or 2) his rather gimmicky phrasing ? Sounds like a no-brainer, yet most people try to imitate the later, for some reason..

[furiouzpianist]

I don’t think any one of us is in a position to diss Cziffra...
Imho he was one of the last truly great pianists in the Golden Age salon tradition.... consistently delightful, with jawdropping pianistic command and a whole range of emotions 

[blazekenny]

I don’t think any one of us is in a position to diss Cziffra...
Imho he was one of the last truly great pianists in the Golden Age salon tradition.... consistently delightful, with jawdropping pianistic command and a whole range of emotions  

While I agree with you I am not in a position to diss Cziffra, as his input in transcriptions is definitely worthy and he was an exceptional talent, I rather mentioned him as a bait to prove my point. Although there is something unique about him, he is generally a synonym to playing fast and loud for the sake of playing fast and loud and "octave unleashes" (And you have to give me that, most of the time he just does, no matter how emotional he might have been). This kind of pyrotechnics and jawdropping pianistic command might be admirable from a sportsman point of view, this mindless show off of it isn't benefical for the purposes of music. (Now I'm not saying Cziffra has only bad recordings, obviously there are a few interesting ones, but I am speaking generally now)
If you love playing piano for the sheer manual factor alone, I would suggest going for Lhevinne, Friedman, etc... instead, as their virtuosity always serves for the purpose of music (even in the most ridiculous circus pieces like The blue danube)
EDIT: I don't mean to offend "jawdropping pianistic mastery" as a whole, it definitely has its place in musicmaking and the more secure you are manually the better, but I think it is just a common sense to call it an additional discipline. Shouldn't the point of music be music ?  

[ronde_des_sylphes]

1) In musicmaking, the only way to justify yourself is by your performance. No matter how much care or time have you invested, the result is what counts.

2)Let me paraphrase the famous quote "There is no such thing as a bad piano, just bad pianists" to "There is no violent repertoire, just violent performers". A great example of this would be Mazeppa by Liszt. When you listen to the piece as played by (insert a pianist name), you instantly get an impression that it is a vulgar and sh** piece, not reaching even half of the quality of its symphonic poem counterpart. When played by Claudio Arrau though, it is a whole different experience. He aims for the width of sound, the narrative factor of the music and nobility, rendering your "octave unleashes" as only a side product.

1: obviously true in the final analysis.
2, however, I really don't agree with. There assuredly *is* violent music. Liszt's Orage would be a fairly obvious example; likewise sections of the Totentanz (where, incidentally, performers as temperamentally diverse as Cziffra and Michelangeli both bring that on board). Similarly you can, imo, find examples in Beethoven and Prokofiev. I think it's a misconception to believe that music is always "nice", "refined", "noble", or whatever. Very often, these are indeed positive attributes for a performer's interpretation, but not always.

[furiouzpianist]

Indeed, it seems to be the trend in conservatories and competitions now... to tone everythng down.

I would say that playing in an extremely showy manner and displaying octaves for octaves sake (not saying that I do that though) - is already a musical statement.

I can hear how some of Friedman’s mannerisms appear in Cziffra’s best recordings btw.
Cziffra was very much in the Golden Age tradition...

[blazekenny]

1: obviously true in the final analysis.
2, however, I really don't agree with. There assuredly *is* violent music. Liszt's Orage would be a fairly obvious example; likewise sections of the Totentanz (where, incidentally, performers as temperamentally diverse as Cziffra and Michelangeli both bring that on board). Similarly you can, imo, find examples in Beethoven and Prokofiev. I think it's a misconception to believe that music is always "nice", "refined", "noble", or whatever. Very often, these are indeed positive attributes for a performer's interpretation, but not always.

I respect that opinion and here I have to admit that as I am not a native english speaker, I might have understood the word "violent" incorrectly. When I see the word violent, I associate it with brutality or usage of rough force. Perhaps the music itself might be violent in its character, but somehow I have never seen violent approaches by the interpret to work, as it reflects negatively on the instrument's sound. And as I said, Richter's "violent" recordings are extremely exciting, but I genuinely believe it is NOT the most important adjective to follow there. Other factors seem to be much more spectacular there, such as his work with time and space, extreme power of will and realizing he has to leave some of his blood on this kind of exalted music, etc...

[blazekenny]

Indeed, it seems to be the trend in conservatories and competitions now... to tone everythng down.

I would say that playing in an extremely showy manner and displaying octaves for octaves sake (not saying that I do that though) - is already a musical statement.

I can hear how some of Friedman’s mannerisms appear in Cziffra’s best recordings btw.
Cziffra was very much in the Golden Age tradition...

I never said anything about toning everything down. Look at my Gould analogy above, too. You seem to be defending your showy and manual approach for the sake of it, because you have found yourself comfortable in it. I am saying look for other, more important aspects of piano playing. Make better use of the silences in the music. Think what the music is about. If you like to play only the virtuoso repertoire, don't just play notes, show us how you are possessed by your inner demon. Etc etc...

Bury me alive, but I believe generalization simply doesn't work in art...

[blazekenny]

I never said anything about toning everything down. Look at my Gould analogy above, too. I don't understand why you would like to copy one single piece of the mosaic, when you are given an opportunity to express something deeply personal through this wonderful instrument, something much more complex. You seem to be defending your showy and manual approach for the sake of it, because you have found yourself comfortable in it. I am saying look for other, more important aspects of piano playing. Make better use of the silences in the music. Think what the music is about. If you like to play only the virtuoso repertoire, don't just play notes, show us how you are possessed by your inner demon. Etc etc...

Bury me alive, but I believe generalization simply doesn't work in art...

Editted, screwed up

[dogperson]

I do not have the same level of skills to  be qualified to comment on this post, so I will comment from the standpoint of a student-listener. I am an avid listener of all the competitions——And what I find tobe memorable  is the performance where  there is  an obvious love of the music and a lack of focus on the self.  Skilled octaves? Sure, But these are a dime a dozen at that level. Skilled octaves plus a personal  interpretation/feeling  of the music ....., memorable.  

I have  the same expectation of online performances as well regardless if they are live or edited. Just another set of skilled octaves?  I stop  listening

[blazekenny]

I do not have the same level of skills to  be qualified to comment on this post, so I will comment from the standpoint of a student-listener. I am an avid listener of all the competitions——And what I find tobe memorable  is the performance where  there is  an obvious love of the music and a lack of focus on the self.  Skilled octaves? Sure, But these are a dime a dozen at that level. Skilled octaves plus a personal  interpretation/feeling  of the music ....., memorable.  

I have  the same expectation of online performances as well regardless if they are live or edited. Just another set of skilled octaves?  I stop  listening

This

[furiouzpianist]

Ok!
Both of you should subscribe to my youtube channel to witness my improvement.
Thanks!

[furiouzpianist]

so far it is all about octave unleashes and visuals in a scriabin etude  

https://twitter.com/michaelkaykov/status/981551256056582145

https://twitter.com/michaelkaykov/status/981667355880280064

https://twitter.com/michaelkaykov/status/982620860946223104

Any questions?
 

[furiouzpianist]

Listening to this old 78rpm recording.... showed up on my suggested vids.
maybe I will try and copy this style....

I think it really captures the essense of the Scriabin style, not just mindless mechanics...

[blazekenny]

Listening to this old 78rpm recording.... showed up on my suggested vids.
maybe I will try and copy this style....

I think it really captures the essense of the Scriabin style, not just mindless mechanics...

There are some things I don't get about it though - First of all, you are an artist, why would you try to copy anyone ?
Secondly, the piano playing doesn't sound very old in style, and strangely enough the mystery pianist seems to have only videos consisting of your repertoire - Including the very rare Donizetti Paraphrase. Now that is bloody mysterious

[perfect_pitch]

What's quite bizarre is that both Furiouz's recordings and the Mystery piano players as well seem to both be in the exact same pitch as each other (as far as I can tell as one of them has incredible scratch noises, so it's hard to tune out the noise)

Interesting???

[blazekenny]

Yes. Also, and most importantly, it is as mechanic as the take he posted here before. He changed the cover for his book, yet the content is still the same.
EDIT: In this case it might be laughable, but what if this is the future ? Instead of working on your very own personal take on deepening the beauty, rather work on your video editing skills to try to replicate an artist from the past? Seems a little frightening to me, just saying

[visitor]

im a fan of the op's playing in general and rarely if ever have i had anything but positive accolades to give, but since i studied and performed this piece years and years ago i thought i'd weight in on what was mentioned a few times, re tempo, passion/expression and caring for the work, saying something personal, etc.

i  think having the piece in one's control at these upper limit tempo/tempi are important , however that is so that when the reigns are loosened up and the pieces breathes a bit and relaxes into a more reasonable tempo (at least for my tastes and sensibilities), it is very stable and super controlled, ie performance tempo is not at upper limit of capability

i think the piece is good, but not great from an expressive standpoint, again just me as someone who wrestled this bear for a while and eventually performed it in a student recital many moons ago.

i think it can help to illustrate that despite the faults/flaws in my performance, there was very positive things to say and many people enjoyed the performance/recording, so this etude doesn't have to be a white knuckled hold on and try not to fall off race to the final d sharp minor chord.

not pasted to self promote since this post is 'ancient' by board standard,  but maybe to contrast a relaxed tempo, and that expression
, nuance in tone tempo microfluctuations (the planned kind vs the technically limited kind) can outshine keyboard pyrotechnics, and comments substantiate that.
https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php?topic=61326.0

i think if you/op let the piece simmer on the back burner a bit, like a good pot of stock/soup, the spices and everything is there but it maybe needs to be sipped slowly rather than chugged after it cools a bit for the flavors that are built in to the work to come out more.

that and i think i'm just hungry and want some soup.

[ronde_des_sylphes]

The mystery pianist seems to have only videos consisting of your repertoire - Including the very rare Donizetti Paraphrase. Now that is bloody mysterious

Is it *that* rare? Offhand I can think of recordings by Howard, Thibaudet and Kentner, plus a Busoni piano roll.

[furiouzpianist]

aaaand I passed to the Weimar Liszt comp with these vids






























and yes I'm the mystery pianist.

[perfect_pitch]

Listening to this old 78rpm recording.... showed up on my suggested vids.
maybe I will try and copy this style....

and yes I'm the mystery pianist.

So - basically you're just trying to copy yourself??? Or where you just aiming for a few more views on your YouTube Channel.

That type of vanity is starting to get sickening for goodness sake. I've deliberately stopped viewing threads started by you now because it's getting a bit over the top.

[furiouzpianist]

no, I'm doing it so I can play however I want...

what vanity are you talking about? An artist distributing his work is not vanity. Unfortunately I have to do it myself unless you want to sign up as my manager.

[furiouzpianist]

That type of vanity is starting to get sickening for goodness sake.

 

mildly over-reacting, bro?

[dogperson]

mildly over-reacting, bro?

Over-reacting?  No.  No other pianist here thinks it is appropriate to post a personal  performance under a thread for ‘great YouTube videos’. And even more egregiously, not to mention it is the poster’s own performance.

[furiouzpianist]

I’m a professional and I’m proud of my work

It’s up to the mods to delete anything they find offensive - bro

[furiouzpianist]

Cheers and happy listening

[blazekenny]

no, I'm doing it so I can play however I want...

what vanity are you talking about? An artist distributing his work is not vanity. Unfortunately I have to do it myself unless you want to sign up as my manager.

Hmmm i still don't quite understand why you hide behind those shallow and superficial things, like fake identity, your easy going bro image, octave unleashes etc., as an excuse to justify your piano playing - which you are proud of though ? Also, how does the fake identity help in playing however you want ? Because it was pretty clear mysterious pianist´s playing has the same traits as yours - except for the scratch noises, which only make your playing less hearable, so there is no point... ?

[furiouzpianist]

did you subscribe yet?
 

[furiouzpianist]

also, it's not clear that the mystery pianist has the same traits as me:

I'm doing it because it is fun.
hype is hype

publicity is publicity. I can play any way I want.


and.....seriously?
have some fun, guys.

at least I have a good sense of humor about this. be sure to click all my vids

[ Invalid YouTube link ]

[furiouzpianist]

Dear all,

I am back!
Long story, painful breakup, etc... but I am back on track now.
Will finish up the DMA soon.




Liszt Transcendental Etude No 8 “Wilde Jagd”

All unedited.
More to come! A few pieces from the Liszt Années de pèlerinage coming up soon!

[perfect_pitch]

did you subscribe yet?

Nope.

also, it's not clear that the mystery pianist has the same traits as me:

Anyone with a brain could. Blazekenny managed to sniff that, and so did I. That vanity comes from posting your own recording claiming it to be a mystery piano player, when you know damn well it's you playing - and your just trying to get views. You're just trying to hype your own playing up... instead of just being honest with us.

I have no problem people advertising their performances, but the whole PM'ing people when we're a PIANO FORUM and we already knew you existed when you post your recordings was a little over the top. Putting your own video in the 'Greatest YouTube videos' is pretty ridiculous - considering you had already created a thread with the video 6 weeks earlier. Posting your own recordings claiming them to be a mystery pianist was just plain ego bloating, so I won't be clicking any more videos of yours.

You pretty much just use this forum as an advertising board. I had no problem with the videos before, but everything in the paragraph above is the reason why I don't care anymore.

[furiouzpianist]

Well, you obviously cared enough to type that long message out.

I appreciate it 

If you would write some nasty comments directly on my videos - it would be a BIG help, even if you are not willing to subscribe.



A view is a view and a click is a click!
Yes I’ve read the Trump - Art of the Deal

Cheers, guys!

Stay CHILL and respect!

[perfect_pitch]

Well, you obviously cared enough to type that long message out.

No... I thought you might wake up and realise your behaviour seemed a bit pedantic, but I guess ignorance is bliss if you thought that.

If you would write some nasty comments directly on my videos

Not going to stoop to that level though... not even to give you a single view. Views mean nothing in this world. Chris Crocker got god knows how many views about his rant on Britney Spears... doesn't mean it was any good.

If your ego is tied to how many views you get, then best of luck to you mate. Your heads in the wrong mindset.

[furiouzpianist]

Congrats on being an expert psychologist in addition to being a piano know-it-all

I appreciate the support!

I’d recommend subscribing to Tiffany Poon.

 
Thanks for derailing this thread, bro.
I’m grateful for the over 1k views this thread got

Lighten up!














And sub

[stevensk]

Noo...you cant play Chopin

[furiouzpianist]

true?

[furiouzpianist]

But the mystery pianist can

 

[furiouzpianist]

Noo...you cant play Chopin

But you can?


Beat this:

[tenk]

But you can?


Beat this:

I don't exactly find anything about your endless self-promotion "humorous", nor your responding to criticism with, "Oh yeah? Can u do this?", at all becoming of an "artist".

Nearly every post of yours has a link to a vid and is borderline begging for views/subs. Have you not noticed your actions having precisely the opposite effect?

I'm with perfect_pitch. There are better (and worse) pianists out there more humble, and appreciative of having an audience than you seem to be. I'd rather send my view and sub their way.