Repetoire Comments? - competition

[Dazzer]

6.
Repertoire Requirements
6.1
Participants shall prepare a Competition programme covering works from at least three
of the following stylistic periods:
Baroque 1600 – 1750
Classical 1751 – 1828
Romantic 1829 – 1899
20th Century 1900 – present

V

6.2
Participants are encouraged to offer a balanced and varied programme that includes
virtuosic and lyrical works. No work may be performed if it requires the prior
preparation of the piano.
6.3
The participant’s Competition programme shall fall within the following durations
(including breaks between pieces):
Maximum Minimum

Open 50 minutes 45 minutes
Senior 30 minutes 25 minutes
Intermediate 25 minutes 20 minutes
Junior 20 minutes 15 minutes

6.4
In addition to the 50 minutes programme, Open category participants must prepare one
concerto from the following list:
Piano

a) Mozart Piano Concerto No. 23 in A major, K. 488
b) Beethoven Piano Concerto No. 3 in C minor, Op. 37
c) Saint-Saens Piano Concerto No. 2 in G minor, Op. 22

Competition Procedures
7.1
Quarter-Finals
Open, Senior, Intermediate and Junior Categories

7.1.1
Participants will begin their performance with a work of their choice. The Adjudicating
Panel may then stop the performance of the first work and request to hear any other
work(s) from the participant’s remaining programme. Performance durations at the
Quarter-Finals will be within the following time limits:
Maximum Minimum

Open 20 minutes 10 minutes
Senior 15 minutes 8 minutes
Intermediate 13 minutes 7 minutes
Junior 10 minutes 5 minutes


7.2
Semi-Finals
Open Category

7.2.1
The Adjudicating Panel will request to hear works not performed at the Quarter-Finals.
However, participants should be prepared to perform their Quarter-Final works again
in this round, especially in cases where only part of a work was performed previously.
The solo performance for the Semi-Finals will not exceed a maximum of 30 minutes.
7.2.2
In addition, Open category participants must perform the first movement of their selected
concerto, to be accompanied on the piano. Participants shall provide their own piano accompanist.

7.3
Finals
Open Category

7.3.1
Participants shall perform their selected concerto in its entirety with the Competition
orchestra.

Okay now that's out of the way, on to pieces i already have.

At the moment i'm putting

Scriabin Op42 No 5 Etude
Prokofiev Op 11 Toccata
Rachmaninov Etude (i'll pick one... some time)
Mendelssohn Variations Serieuses.

So the most trouble criteria i've yet to fulfil is the periods criteria. So i'm lacking in baroque or classical repetoire. So i'm just wondering what people might have in mind? I'm really looking for something to wow the judges. (that Is the plan anyhow...) Feel free to make comments about the pieces i already have.

Much appreciated. I await your speedy replies.

Dazzer

[Selim]

Bach: go with de Chaconne and good luck.
Classical: go with a Beethoven, op111 or 81 those are big Sonatas, if you want an earlier one try op10N°2 or 3, it is in C and it is really fun.


Concerning the Concerti, i would go with Beethoven's 3, it is a good choice, but if you go with this, you would have to take a Mozart sonata...Or to take something different than a sonata like maybe the 32Variations (Beethoven)

[Goldberg]

Isn't 10-2 (Beethoven) in F? And no. 3 is in D, right? In any event, the first one of those might not fair well, though I will throw out op. 10 no. 1 in C minor, op. 2 no. 2 in A major, and maybe op. 78 if you're into the "Romantic" Beethoven.

However, I'd personally go for Mozart's K. 282 or K. 284 and then play the Beethoven C minor concerto. Or if you wanted to get really funky, find a good Haydn sonata (gosh, what's the "big" one in Eb major? No. 52 is it? That would be excellent).

Also, are you sure you want two Russian etudes on there? With the Prokofiev, as well? Unless you are attached to Rachmaninoff (in which case I might recommend a prelude or Musical Moment, or now that I think of it maybe the G minor Barcarolle), maybe you could look into Berg (the sonata) or Schoenberg (piano suite) or Rzewski (North American Ballades).

Just some suggestions!

[TheHammer]

Bach: go with de Chaconne and good luck.
Classical: go with a Beethoven, op111

*looks at Dazzers age*
*imagines how the judges will think of a 19 year old playing op.111*
*decides to strongly recommend refraining from this sonata*

Well, however, I agree that Beethoven should be the first choice if you don't take the Concerto (if you do, take a Haydn Sonata as Goldberg suggested, and it IS the no.52 i think ). The Last Six are a delicate thing on competitions, but I would do the op.109 from them (or, if I could, op.106, but well ). Other than these, op.81a seems a better idea.
Op.22 is nearly never played though, if you are really brave, do this, perhaps (big perhaps) it will impress the judges (that you play a sonata which is really seldomly played). Or you could just to the usual suspects op.53 and 57,or op.2/3 but that would be boring wouldn't it (and way too long, perhaps?). I agree on op.78 or the op.10. Oh, and do not forget op.26 (but not very impressive) or op. 27/1 (not impressive either, but cooler, nice Allegro finale). Heck, there are so many of them, you could do op.31/3 as well....argh!

Well, you could always do a standard Bach (WTC, Italian Concerto, French or English (better is English) suites) for Baroque. Hmm...or something really unconventional? but what, hmm don't have time right now...

[shasta]

Go "unconventional" for Baroque - - - there's more to that period than just Bach and Scarlatti!! 

Perhaps do some investigating into:
  Soler
  Seixas
  Handel
  Couperin
  Rameau
  Duphly
  Arne
  Marchand

[Daevren]

Play pieces you love so its easy to play them well and with musical intelligence.

Unless you find some great obscure piece which the jury also like, which is possible but hard, playing a piece you like really well is the only way to impress the jury.

I would pick the Beethoven Concerto. I don't like Mozart and Saint-Saens isn't as good as Beethoven or Mozart. But I don't see the problem with a 19 old playing 111. I do see a problem with a 19 year old playing an immature 111.

I wouldn't play the Diabelli variations if I could play a Beethoven, Mozart or Haydn sonata.

I would play a piece in each catagory. So maybe no Rach etude. Playing your favorite WTC fuge sounds like a good idea to me. And not pairing them with the prelude shows you have your own ideas about music. This, assuming you do really like one. Otherwise maybe a thee part invention. And maybe something really modern.


I do like Shasta's advice in terms of looking at unconvetional repetoire. But maybe this is a good idea for the next competition. (not sure when this one is, but some careful research here is needed).

But, what are your strong points? You need to play pieces that make you look good.

So, pick a good mixed repertoire with pieces that you love and that put emphasis on your strong points.


What I would play:

(assuming I would compete in the Open catogory)

Quarter Finals:

J.S. Bach Fugue No. 4 Book I
Medtner Sonata Op.30

Semi Finals:
J.S. Bach Fugue No. 12 Book I
Haydn Sonata No. 43
Barber Sonata Op. 29

Finals:
Beethoven Concerto No. 3

I will probably anger the judges and love it, so don't take too much of my advice. It's just that people keep asking for stuff like this.

[steinwayguy]

A couple Scarlatti sonatas is a very fine idea indeed.

Why not Schubert? Either set of impromptus, moments musicaux or maybe even the Wanderer Fantasy? This would leave your options open for the concerto...

And, uh, Hammer is right about the judges' feelings about a 19 year old playing 111 (in a competition, no less).

And doing all Scriabin, Prokofiev and Rachmaninoff? No, no, no. Maybe do a Scriabin Etude and the Prokofiev Toccata, but definitely not a Rachmaninoff Etude on top of that.

So here's what I suggest-
2 or 3 Scarlatti Sonatas
Schubert Op. 90 Impromptus
Mendelssohn Variations Serieuses
Scriabin Etude
Prokofiev Tocatta
Mozart Concerto 23

And when is this thing? You had best get started now if you're going to learn all of that!!!!!

[Dazzer]

thanks for your comments guys.

I'm really focused on romantic/20th century russian music. Hence all the russian stuff. The 3 russian pieces were actually suggested by someone else. But i made some changes to it. The original suggestion was

Scriabin
Prokofiev
Rachmaninov etude op39 no 5 (eb-) chosen because its very lyrical.
Bach Chromatic Fantasia and Fugue (frankly i'm very scared about learning this... never was a good exponent of baroque)
Beethoven Tempest.
And
Beethoven 3rd

I'm not sure whether a rach moment musicaux would have much impact. But maybe no 1 would be a good lyrical piece.

The competition is in dec this year. I have to submit my repetoire in a couple of months. (late august)

Another little obstacle is i'm doing everything alone. I have no teacher at the moment. So its quite a daunting task. Not to mention while i'm serving my national service, which is eating up my practice and motivation... and i'm a lazy uncommited bastard

ALSO I'm only allowed to choose the FIRST piece to present to the judges. They'll pick the rest. Which is ANNOYING when i try to arrange repetoire to have a good pairing with each other and they just screw it all up.

I'm refraining from a beethoven sonata. Because i know there're going to be TONS of people playing a beethoven sonata. Last time i entered this competition there were 5 people playing appassionata, 3 playing the pathetique, and 1 playing the waldstein like a   tractor.

I was also looking at some bach partitas... no2 sounds nice. Italian concerto is a very popular piece in this competition. But i may have no other choice. Picking an "obscure" piece is easy to say, but i may not play it that well without the proper guidiance. Best not to then...

I personally dislike Mozart. So i refrain from playing him too. But how would the k576 (dmaj) fair? And i'm NOT playing his concerto. So i'm down to either the beethoven concerto or the saint-saens. But the SS isn't really such a good comp piece in any case (i doubt the orchestra can cope anyway... last time they screwed up the ravel g maj...)

Thanks again for your comments. I'm still learning the mendelssohn so please do give more input.

[TheHammer]

So no Beethoven (come on, op.22, for sure noone is playing it....play it, play it....) or Mozart?
Now that I think of it, a Haydn sonata may be not as good as an ass-kicking Schubert! I like the idea of the Impromptues (although I would possibly take op.142) OR the Wanderer Fantasy. What do you think of this? I mean, it is a bit longer than 20 minutes and a hell of a piece, until december you will probably fail to learn it, but then I have no idea what your technique is, and, compared with other pieces, there are not so many interpretation issues. Technique is very hard though...(all mov. form a huge compilation of any technique you could think of until Liszt...arpeggios!!!, double octaves, big jumps, chord tremoli (4th mov.!!!), fast runs....)
You could do a sonata as well...but not sure which one...
If you dislike Mozart, then do NOT play him in any case! I mean, K.576 is wonderful, but without a teacher and a deep passion for Mozart, this may be difficult.

Personally I love the Beet. concerto, and since the SS is overplayed as well (perhaps not as much), I say do the Beethoven.

Bach. Yeah, I thought of the Chromatic Fantasy too, but then again, I thought you would probably try something more obscure. Okay, Italian concerto isn't real Baroque style counterpoint, much more "classical" in some sense, so if you like it...

I think you do good in participating without a teacher... quite brave, keep it up!
(And perhaps give some more detailed information on your preferences and last pieces...)

[Dazzer]

I keep this short. In a hurry.

Well the thing about the 576 is that i've learnt it before. But that was awhile ago. But i gues yeh that is a bit of a desperate option.

Schubert... that's not classical isit?

Thanks again

Dazzer

[TheHammer]

Oh, if you learned it before, that is another story, could be a solution if you think you don't have enough time...

Schubert is generally considered a Romantic, I think, but he seems to be quite in between. But have a look at the requirements:

Classical 1751-1828

now, Beethoven died 1827, whereas Schubert died in? Right 1828. So, wonder why they took this year...
it is definite that the Romantic era begins with his death, probably before, but definitly then. So, as I understand it, he is considered a Classical componist according to this requirements. If you are not certain, phone/e-mail the competition.

[pianowelsh]

The Beethoven sonata op2/3? im useless with numbers C MAJOR is a fantasic show piece sonata - they cant want for any more scale and arps after youve done with it and its played less often than op110 and 111 - they will take a dim view of a 19 yr old hacking off the op106 so i would save yourself the zillions of hours it would take to perfect.. shame on you you dont like Mozart!(only teasing - i know i didnt used to) Haydn is a good idea but eb one is played quite a lot these days. You could look at Hummel and Weber (i am not 100% on their dates - might be too late) they are much less played BUT if you plan on taking many competitions it wont fit most peoples repertoire requirements -hence most people do (appassionata, Les adieux,op110/111).  Wanderer is cool but if your starting from scratch could be a tall order by December bearing in mind the other repertoire considerations too. Baroque suites can work well or even a group of preludes and fugues?

[Selim]

What about Beethoven's op90?

[steinwayguy]

Schubert Impromptus Op. 142 would be more impressive than Op. 90. These are often done in competitions, but not neeearly as often as Beethoven, Mozart, Haydn or Schubert sonatas. And if you're a Romantic/Russian music guy, Schubert would be the ticket for the classical requirement.

[Dazzer]

Okay i'll try looking up some schubert... strangely enough i haven't heard much of him...

i guess i'll try asking my old piano teacher ... thanks again people!

[ako]

If you're looking for some Schubert, I really like

3 piano pieces "Drei Klavierstücke"
Piano, 1828.   Time: 23'00.

and

Sonata No.13 in A, op. posth. 120
Piano Sonata   Time: 22'00.

Just some more choices...

[Dazzer]

whoa... long...:S i'm not sure if i have that amount of time available to me.

[dmk]

If you're looking for some Schubert, I really like

3 piano pieces "Drei Klavierstücke"
Piano, 1828. Time: 23'00.

and

Sonata No.13 in A, op. posth. 120
Piano Sonata Time: 22'00.

Just some more choices...

The Klavierstucke are awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!! really good pieces to play but for this kind of thing you might want a Sonata.

The op 120 Schubert Sonata is no where near that long if you take out the repeats....the third movement can be a real PIA though.....

A well played Haydn and Mozart nevers serves anyone badly- particularly over a bombastic and illconsidered late Beethoven...

but everyone has still suggested some excellent Beethoven's.....my personal favourite would probably be the op 27 n1, op 7 or op 31 n1 (op 7 is probably a little long though)

A few nice Haydn

BTW Dazz, if your an Aussie (which I thought you were)....which competition is this?

[steinwayguy]

If you want to go Beethoven, go Op. 7, 53, or 81a.

If you want to go Schubert, go Impromptus Op. 142 (ton of work) or Op. 90 (less work, but still a lot)

[Dazzer]

I'm actually singaporean. But i studied in aussie for awhile. But i'm in singapore now. This is a national comp here. And i'm going up against people from 3 schools (2 academies, 1 conservatoire) amongst whoever else would be joining... urgh.

Maybe what i'll do is just send in a screwed repetoire application very early, and then i'll probably get a reply if they reject the repetoire. and still have time to change the repetoire. Sneaky...

[Dazzer]

Okay sorry to bump this up again. Seems like Schubert looks like a way to go. So i had a look, and considered a couple of pieces. One impromptu from Op 90 (no3) and moment musicaux no3. I've considered choosing the moment musical, and pairing that with a rachmaninov moment musical... any comments?

[TheHammer]

Would just the Moment musical a bit too short? So I think when you just play two pages of a classical composer (who is actually Romantic ) that will not make the best impression, I deem? On the other hand, pairing sounds at least interesting to me. But again, only one piece here and one there... don't know...
And the Impromptu is certainly the way to go if you need a lyrical piece. If not, please look at op.142 (I especially enjoyed the fourth when first hearing it, that is a crowd-pleaser, the third is a theme-and-variation, also very nice).

[steinwayguy]

Yeah I will agree with TheHammer. One impromptu and a moment musicale does not look good on a competition program. Either learn all of either or none, in my opinion.

[dmk]

Yeah I will agree with TheHammer. One impromptu and a moment musicale does not look good on a competition program. Either learn all of either or none, in my opinion.

agreed...the moments musical is way to short..especially that one..

I still think you would be better off with all of op 142 or the Drei Klavierstucke (or one of them)

wasn't this supposed to be in substitute for a classical sonata??

[Dazzer]

Yeah I will agree with TheHammer. One impromptu and a moment musicale does not look good on a competition program. Either learn all of either or none, in my opinion.

all!? gosh...

agreed...the moments musical is way to short..especially that one..

I still think you would be better off with all of op 142 or the Drei Klavierstucke (or one of them)

wasn't this supposed to be in substitute for a classical sonata??

I'll have a look at the pieces you mentioned. thanks.

[lostinidlewonder]

I couldn't suggest any pieces for you without knowing you as a pianist fully but some general stuff which might sound very obvious but handy to keep in mind.

If you construct a repertoire for competition that does not explore a lot of aspects of piano playing then you are not really going to win. Whoever demonstrates more elements of piano playing than you may come out on top, so ensure that you reveal as much of your technical and musical ability as possible.

One would want to balance their repertoire with something that isn't heard so often, so that the elements of piano playing you are demonstrating sound "fresh" to peoples ears. People habitually compare you to recordings of common pieces you may choose to play and that can do you a diservice if you haven't got anything special to breathe life into a favorite. Of course if you can play a "favorite" really well and have full confidence with it do it, but I would think you must have known it for at least a few years and it has had time to matured in you somewhat.

You must be confident that what you are presenting effectively displays your ability as a pianist up to this point of time. Those that win competitions where the repertoire is very flexible will all admit they spend a great deal of time thinking about their choice and strive for a good balance where the repertoire effectively and evenly reveals all of their pianistic/musical ability.

[steinwayguy]

all!? gosh...

I'll have a look at the pieces you mentioned. thanks.

All meaning either the opus 90 impromptus, the opus 142 impromptus or the six moments musicaux. Not that much technically, but these pieces have huge potential if you play them to their full capacity. Plus, they're not too often hard in competitions.

[Dazzer]

but it eats up alot of playing time.