Self "taught"

[Andrew]

I apologize for breaking your rules here (I am not a pianist, a piano teacher, or a university student), but I honestly do not know where else to find an answer.

I've been playing the piano for altogether nine years now, and only the first two were spent with a teacher (a high school student who needed a little extra cash - she was a very good teacher as I can remember, though).  At the end of those two years, when I was seven, I was playing easy versions of The Entertainer, to give you an idea of my level.  I took about two years off, and one day in a music store as I flipped through some sheet music, I came accross what I later learned was a Beethoven sonata (I forget the number, but it was titled Pathetique).  The main selling point for me was that it had "lots of notes."  I took it home and, measure by measure, learned to play it.

My philosophy, which I realize now was extremely flawed, was that once I'd mastered a piece like that I would be good enough to play pieces of equal complexity.  I've since learned to play a few more Beethoven sonatas (Tempest, Appassionata, Moonlight), Liszt's 2nd Hungarian Rhapsody, Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue, a few Chopin nocturnes, and a few things I can't really remember.  The latter brings me to an important point, which is that these take me an extremely long time to learn (and by "learn" I mean play such that it's easy as breathing, or at least comfortable in the case of more technically complex pieces), and I've often forgetten the old ones by the time I've finished the new one.  My knowledge of musical notation is more or less complete, but I can not sight-read, and I know nothing of theory.  I never know what key or time signature I'm playing (after enough practice I rarely even know what notes I'm playing), and I primarily focus on tone and stylistic interpretation.

I would not do this if I didn't enjoy it, and although I really have no desire to play the piano professionally, I would like to improve my situation.  Every time I learn a new piece it's like I'm starting from the beginning (each new measure - even the rediculously simple ones - sounds like it's being played by a timid 6 year old when I come to it).  Has anyone had any experience with this sort of thing?  And do you have any suggestions as to what I can do to put myself on track?

I generally practice a couple of hours every day, with no particular routine or aim (I just repeat what I'm learning and go through what I know at the time)

Thank you,
-Andrew Drummond

[OlderGuy]

Andrew, I totally admire what you are doing. It is incredible that you did get this far without a teacher.
Maybe you are the exception to the rule, but having a (good) teacher makes things very different.  He/she sees problems that you even may not be aware of, can show you "tricks" to make things easier, correct you technique.
I am a complete beginner (1.5 yrs) and I can testify that each new piece is a new challenge. At the beginning I always have a feeling "I never going to learn this…"
And I am experiencing the same things as you do: if I don't play something for a while I almost have to start it all over learning it again.  A good practice though: for warm-up I go through the last few pieces before I start working on the new piece.  As far as how long does it take to learn a piece: to me it is weeks at minimum.  This is frustrating to me too.
I also would suggest to record and listen to your own playing.  I was amazed how badly I sounded, and I could hear all imperfection, whereas it does not register during playing.
   Peter

[Andrew]

That (good) teacher part is pretty important, I agree.  On the other hand, a bad teacher will certainly do more harm than good.  It's sad how many people took piano lessons when they were children and "wish they hadn't quit" (granted this isn't always the fault of a bad teacher - unwise parents or a kid who's simply lazy will do it just as well).  I live in a small town and simply haven't found a good teacher yet.  I did take a single lesson a few years ago from a man who has since moved across the country, and the few bits of advice he gave bumped my playing up a couple of notches in the course of an hour.  Fortunately these bits of advice were principles and theories, rather than specific guidelines, so I've been abled to build on them and apply them in every aspect of playing.

The reason I have stuck with this is that, as I said, I simply enjoy it very much.  I don't worry all that much about "not being good enough;" I just want to shorten the time spent learning a piece a little bit (some have taken an entire year).

-Andrew Drummond

[88keys]

Andrew,

Most people here would tell you that getting a teacher is the most productive thing you can do.

Well, I honestly think they are wrong.

Not that getting a teacher is a bad idea. But there is something else which will be much more useful for you:

LEARN MUSIC THEORY!

Either find a good book on the subject, or find yourself a good music theory teacher (NOT a piano teacher! You need to strengthen your theoretical background, not your piano technique).

Learn about time and key signatures. Find out how to know not only what key the whole piece is in, but what key the current section is. Learn about some simple structures in music - Song-Form, Theme and Variations, Rondo and Sonata Form.

And don't hesitate to ask any questions you might on this forum. Sometimes a few tips from friends can be just as a useful as a textbook.

No matter how you go about this, learning music theory will help you understand the music you are playing better. And this, in turn, will do wonders both to your performence and your sight-reading abilities.

[Andrew]

Thank you, 88keys; I'll try that.

I must be honest and admit that I have enjoyed being a "naive" listener, though.  It fascinates me - even if I'm the player - to hear music when I have no clue what is going on.  Unable to evaluate any kind of form, progression, etc, I can only appreciate it note by note.

I suppose it's time to move on, now.