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Topic: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?  (Read 2271 times)

Offline orlandopiano

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Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
on: July 09, 2005, 12:14:03 AM
Anyone?

Offline presto agitato

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #1 on: July 09, 2005, 03:10:29 AM
Pollini 1:02.

Im sure Martha Argerich play it faster no matter if sounds horrible  ::)
The masterpiece tell the performer what to do, and not the performer telling the piece what it should be like, or the cocomposer what he ought to have composed.

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Offline JP

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #2 on: July 09, 2005, 03:45:30 AM
0:58 <-- Aregerich
0:58 <-- Rubinstein

Pollini's sounds the best IMO, but Argerich's shows sharper technique.

Offline orlandopiano

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #3 on: July 09, 2005, 03:59:56 AM
0:58 <-- Aregerich
0:58 <-- Rubinstein

Pollini's sounds the best IMO, but Argerich's shows sharper technique.

As far as know, the 3 fastest are Argerich, Kissin, and Rubinstein. I was just wondering if there were any faster.

Offline raymagini

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #4 on: August 29, 2005, 08:44:14 PM
sorry to dig up an old post, but....

Mei Ting Sun, live in minneapolis

57 seconds

Offline chromatickler

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #5 on: August 30, 2005, 03:10:36 AM
dong-hyek lim live, 54 seconds

Offline orlandopiano

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #6 on: August 30, 2005, 03:21:24 AM
dong-hyek lim live, 54 seconds

That's impressive!  Are you sure a lot of that isn't from rushing through the opening six chords?

Also, anywhere I can get a recording of this?

Offline chromatickler

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #7 on: August 30, 2005, 05:41:57 AM
without the chords (50secs), it's 2 seconds faster than the argerich studio (52 secs).

Offline stevie

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #8 on: August 30, 2005, 02:15:52 PM
and argerich is pretty sloppy and uneven, dong sounds much more in control

Offline phi

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #9 on: August 30, 2005, 04:04:43 PM
and argerich is pretty sloppy and uneven, dong sounds much more in control

I'm gonna tell her you said that

Offline spirithorn

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #10 on: August 30, 2005, 05:39:52 PM
Just a comment:  The tempo marking is "Presto con fuoco", not "Prestissimo con fuoco"...
"Souplesse, souplesse..."

Offline hazypurple21

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #11 on: August 30, 2005, 06:38:15 PM
Just a comment:  The tempo marking is "Presto con fuoco", not "Prestissimo con fuoco"...

Excellent point. I hate these kinda threads.
"There is one god-Bach-and Mendelssohn is his prophet."

Offline thierry13

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #12 on: August 30, 2005, 09:07:00 PM
Just a comment:  The tempo marking is "Presto con fuoco", not "Prestissimo con fuoco"...

Rachmaninoff prelude op.23 no.9 is presto and is slower than much allegros. With your logic, explain that to me.

Offline stevie

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #13 on: August 30, 2005, 09:19:16 PM
Just a comment:  The tempo marking is "Presto con fuoco", not "Prestissimo con fuoco"...

tempo markings are there to be ignored, we all know chopin intended all his pieces to be played as fast as possible.

Offline BoliverAllmon

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #14 on: August 30, 2005, 09:55:13 PM
tempo markings are there to be ignored, we all know chopin intended all his pieces to be played as fast as possible.

oh really?

Offline llamaman

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #15 on: August 30, 2005, 09:59:07 PM
Some anyway. Just like Czerny  ;D
Ahh llamas......is there anything they can't do?

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Offline m

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #16 on: August 31, 2005, 06:39:14 AM
Rachmaninoff prelude op.23 no.9 is presto and is slower than much allegros. With your logic, explain that to me.

Tempo in music is very relative. Presto in double notes (your example with Rachmaninov Prelude) can be slower than some Allegro. Also, keep in mind, Presto in 1/16 and Allegretto in 1/32  are also different, meaning that 1/32 Allegretto can be faster. Besides, tempo marks very often show the character of the music, rather than actual speed.

tempo markings are there to be ignored, we all know chopin intended all his pieces to be played as fast as possible.


There is something VERY WRONG with this. Mr. Chopin was not as dumb as your statement might suggest. Very clearly he marked it as Presto CON FUOCO. I really don't care about the tempo, as soon as "CON FUOCO" is there. I don't really care for either Argerich or Pogorelich tempos here. They play it fast and LIGHT, which IS completely contrary to what Chopin intended in this piece. 

In whole my life I heard only one person who did it right, and it was Gregory Sokolov. I heard him live three times with complete Chopin Preludes: in Novosibirsk (Siberia), Moscow (I believe the commercial recording was recorded then), and in S. Petersburg. Only once in this Prelude he managed to create this feeling of the whole world crushing. It was in Novosibirsk. I still have a bootleg recording of it. There is no sense of the tempo (however astounding it was), because the music was beyond of that. The only feeling I had then was of the piano roaring and moaning. Who cares about the tempo when it was achieved...

Offline quasimodo

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #17 on: August 31, 2005, 11:26:33 AM
And, as it has been stated million times by knowledgeable people, the clearer, more articulate your notes are, the faster you sound. It's not a sprint competition.
" On ne joue pas du piano avec deux mains : on joue avec dix doigts. Chaque doigt doit être une voix qui chante"

Samson François

Offline spirithorn

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #18 on: August 31, 2005, 02:11:17 PM
Strange... if Chopin intended this to be a time trial from measure 2 on, then he was very foolish to indicate "stretto" at measure 30 and "sempre piu animato" at measure 34.  He must have momentarily forgotten his (apparently) obvious intention for this Prelude -- a virtuoso race against the stopwatch! 
"Souplesse, souplesse..."

Offline orlandopiano

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #19 on: August 31, 2005, 03:19:09 PM
And, as it has been stated million times by knowledgeable people, the clearer, more articulate your notes are, the faster you sound. It's not a sprint competition.

And if this is the case then Kissin's sounds the fastest , although I have not heard dong-hyek or Mei-Ting's (if someone can offer me a link it would be greatly appreciated).

Offline quasimodo

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #20 on: August 31, 2005, 03:46:45 PM
Samson François (1'00) is quite legendary (to me at least)
" On ne joue pas du piano avec deux mains : on joue avec dix doigts. Chaque doigt doit être une voix qui chante"

Samson François

Offline etudes

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #21 on: August 31, 2005, 03:54:56 PM
and argerich is pretty sloppy and uneven, dong sounds much more in control
anyway dong was presented by argerich (i think he also studied with her,he came to salzburg to study with jazinsky in masterclass)
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Offline stevie

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Re: Fastest Chopin 28/16 prelude on record?
Reply #22 on: August 31, 2005, 10:05:05 PM
anyway dong was presented by argerich (i think he also studied with her,he came to salzburg to study with jazinsky in masterclass)

well then he superceded his master then, his recording is live and simply technically superior.
 

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