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Topic: Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering  (Read 2158 times)

Offline jhon

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Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering
on: July 23, 2005, 06:15:32 AM
Before, I taught I could just transpose any piece in any key that I like; but I realized this is easier said than done. I learned from my teacher that each key signature has its OWN set of "PLAYABLE" passages that is BEST (if not ONLY) suit to be executed in that specific key signature. For instance, the left-hand passages in Revolutionary Etude is almost impossible to play when the piece is transposed to C#m. Or just imagine a Fantasie-Impromptu put in Cm. In this case, a greater strech is needed for the left hand and the right hand is another story.

Thus, the conclusion is, there are passages that is PIANISTIC for one key but UNPIANISTIC for the other. (We say "pianistic" to mean how EXECUTABLE a passage is as far as FINGERING is concerned.) This is primarily the reason why often you will notice SIMILAR passages among pieces having SAME key signature (even if they are of different compsoer).

This theory cannot be easily noticed yet in Baroque music but is very obvious in Classical and Romantic music whose compsers are great geniuses that they know what key is best pianistic for a specific piece they compose - especially Beethoven, Chopin, Liszt, and Rachmaninoff. However, some Modern/20th Century composers became unpianistic, somewhat deviating to this norm by composing "FREE FORM" music (such as ATONAL pieces - pieces not necessarily having a specific key).

All in all, I learned that it is not really true that you can just transpose any piece in any key you wish.  Just imagine a "Revolutionary" etude transposed in C# minor...the LH passages would be almost impossible to play - thus, unpianistic.

Now, I believe the best key signature is the one having the MOST pianistic and playable passages possible. The obvious contenders are Cm, Eb, Fm, Ab, Bbm, and Db. But since they are overused, I would want to explore posssible pianistic passages in underrrated keys such as B or Gb, for instance.  Even the key of C is actually underrated!

Offline Barbosa-piano

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Re: Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering
Reply #1 on: July 23, 2005, 06:34:26 AM
Well, it is known that Bach transposed his pieces to many other keys, so did Chopin while composing. My friend said that Rachmaninoff's Prelude in G minor sounds better in G# minor. I would not transpose a regular piece to different keys, because in my opinion that will do nothing but spoil one's ear sense to different notes and because that is the key that the composer thought was the most suitable, and the one that fits best under the fingers. When I hear to old recordings, I realise that great part of them sound half step higher, probably because of the recording devices used at the time. That ruined my view of some pieces. There is a Brazilian pianist, Magda Tagliaferro, which I read could transpose all of the Well-Tempered Clavier to any key by heart...
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Offline xvimbi

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Re: Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering
Reply #2 on: July 23, 2005, 01:16:10 PM
Well, it is known that Bach transposed his pieces to many other keys, so did Chopin while composing. My friend said that Rachmaninoff's Prelude in G minor sounds better in G# minor. I would not transpose a regular piece to different keys, because in my opinion that will do nothing but spoil one's ear sense to different notes and because that is the key that the composer thought was the most suitable, and the one that fits best under the fingers. When I hear to old recordings, I realise that great part of them sound half step higher, probably because of the recording devices used at the time. That ruined my view of some pieces. There is a Brazilian pianist, Magda Tagliaferro, which I read could transpose all of the Well-Tempered Clavier to any key by heart...

Bach wrote the WTC, because he used a different temperament than is used today. In equal temperament, there is no difference between keys. Therefore, a piece in G minor sounds the same as in G# minor, except that it has a different pitch. Any differences that are perceived are psychological, and only people with perfect pitch would notice the difference anyway.


Quote
Now, I believe the best key signature is the one having the MOST pianistic and playable passages possible. The obvious contenders are Cm, Eb, Fm, Ab, Bbm, and Db. But since they are overused, I would want to explore posssible pianistic passages in underrrated keys such as B or Gb, for instance.  Even the key of C is actually underrated!

This is a piano-centric view, because this problem does not exist in all instruments. Most of them have their own problems in this respect. So, if you are composing for piano, you could take fingering into account, but if you are writing for the violin, you would have to take other things into consideration.

Offline jeremyjchilds

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Re: Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering
Reply #3 on: July 23, 2005, 04:21:38 PM
First person to play the revolutionary in C#- gets a golden star.
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Offline Barbosa-piano

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Re: Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering
Reply #4 on: July 23, 2005, 04:56:13 PM
Bach wrote the WTC, because he used a different temperament than is used today. In equal temperament, there is no difference between keys. Therefore, a piece in G minor sounds the same as in G# minor, except that it has a different pitch. Any differences that are perceived are psychological, and only people with perfect pitch would notice the difference anyway.

True, and in his Well-Tempered tuning each key had its own characteristic, the reason why I wrote it, when he occasionally transposed his Partita in C minor to B minor, he wanted to give the piece its perfect key (characteristic) based on his Well-Tempered tuning.

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Offline maryruth

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Re: Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering
Reply #5 on: July 23, 2005, 08:35:08 PM
I have a beginning student that did a little transposing on his own.  Unfortunately he didn't know it until I pointed it out.  He had three weeks off for his summer break and at his first lesson back he played the new piece he'd been working on ( a simple country dance with basic I-V7 chordal patterns).  The song is written in the Key of G.  We practiced it in the key of G.  Then at the next lesson he had it perfectly learned in the Key of C!  He played it and looked at me like "well, how was that?"  He didn't even know he'd done it!  I'm like speechless...one because he had transposed the whole thing and some people really have a hard time with this, and two (which is more concerning) that he didn't realize it.  I'm like, Well, the rhythm was correct.... the notes were not as written.  Look at the page and play the first notes please.  Ohhhhh....Ooops. 

Offline lostinidlewonder

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Re: Theory on Key SIgnature and Fingering
Reply #6 on: July 28, 2005, 02:28:31 AM
Knowing how to transpose is sorta becoming obsolete with the electric pianos being able to do it with one touch of a button.
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