Most Difficult Transcendental Etude

[Skeptopotamus]

I only put those three up there cause I doubt anyone's gonna vote for something else.

[Skeptopotamus]

awwwwwww!  i forget when you put teh question marks together they make those stupid faces.  =(

[pianonut]

i'm guessing on this one.  mazeppa.  i've heard it more times than the other ones mentioned - and always impressed with the impression of the byronic poem of this 'stallion' rider.  it's liszt imagining his spritual battles, too, and he travels a wild road that he sometimes cannot control as he has to hang on for dear life.  and, he expresses some interest in the spiritual at times: "up rose the sun, the mists were furled, before the solitary world ...who booted it to traverse plain, forest, field...."   isn't that from mazeppa - or is it someplace else.  (goes to read the poem)

ps  the idea of transcendental - is a new one - for composer's as well.  it's a little insight into how his techniqes 'transcended' technique and went into the realm of 'fantastic' and descriptively programmatic.  i suppose anyone playing this, should imagine the piano the horse, and that they are going to have a wild ride.  just read that liszt lifted the idea from voltaire.  supposedly a polish guy named mazeppa had an affair with the wife of a polish nobleman.  he was caught, tied to a horse half naked, and the horse was 'let to rip.'  the man barely survived and ended up staying in the ukraine afterwards.   

[Waldszenen]

Chasse Neige

[Skeptopotamus]

i also thing chasse is the hardest to play well.

[pseudopianist]

I'm pretty sure that Feux Follet is the hardest by FAR

[etudes]

i think technical speaking Feux Follets is the most difficult
but to play is mazeppa
and to make it sound well is chasse

[jehangircama]

can you play all of them?

[orlandopiano]

Chasse Neige is terribly frustrating for me to play.  I can't say much for FF or Mazeppa because I've never played them.

[musicsdarkangel]

I can't believe that Feux Follet isn't slaughtering the other 2.


Have you guys seen the music?! 
 

[thierry13]

I can't believe that Feux Follet isn't slaughtering the other 2.


Have you guys seen the music?! 
 

We all saw the sheets, and all read the three at least once. Feux-follet requires a harder technique to develop, wich is double note. When you can play well in double-note... what's the problem with the piece?

[musicsdarkangel]

shifting the thumb.

Keep in mind, double note isn't one technique.  This requires ultimate finger independance......... 


There isn't only one combination of chords through the hand, but many more.

It's almost like every finger is paired with another at some point.

[etudes]

We all saw the sheets, and all read the three at least once. Feux-follet requires a harder technique to develop, wich is double note. When you can play well in double-note... what's the problem with the piece?

you still have some running passage and bring the lh melody
and then jumping in lh while your rh busy with double notes.....................

[thalbergmad]

Feux Follet by a mile.

Horowitz thought so to.

[prometheus]

Chasse-Neige for the same reason that Chopins 25/6 is his hardest etude.

It may not have the most insane notes on the score, but getting both pieces to sound perfect makes Chasse harder, imo.

You can just bang Feux Fullet, some even do it at lower speeds.

[ted]

I have never tried Chasse Neige. Mazeppa might be physically taxing if you're not in the mood for it, but it's hardly complicated or subtle piano music. Feux Follets, on the other hand, in addition to finger dexterity, seems to me to require much more thought and variety of touch to make it sound well.

[nanabush]

If Feux Follets is as simple as learning double notes then playing it, how come it is so difficult and is viewed as one of the most difficult pieces?  If you think it's that easy, then surely you could learn it very quickly...

[thierry13]

If Feux Follets is as simple as learning double notes then playing it, how come it is so difficult and is viewed as one of the most difficult pieces?  If you think it's that easy, then surely you could learn it very quickly...

First of all, it is, and by FAR, not close to be the hardest piece. I didn't said it was easy, I said if you have a good double note technique it's easy... now the thing is... get a good double note technique  Wich is not easy at all.

[etudes]

Chasse-Neige for the same reason that Chopins 25/6 is his hardest etude.

It may not have the most insane notes on the score, but getting both pieces to sound perfect makes Chasse harder, imo.

You can just bang Feux Fullet, some even do it at lower speeds.

btw you cant bang feux follets everyone will know if you make some dirty sound in that piece

[Skeptopotamus]

mmmmmmm.


They are all nasty in their own way.  Feux Follet is so delicate, Mazeppa is so tiring and Chasse-Neige is so fast and musically nasty.  o.o


wow that was a pointless post =D

[BoliverAllmon]

FF

[stevie]

mmmmmmm.


They are all nasty in their own way.  Feux Follet is so delicate, Mazeppa is so tiring and Chasse-Neige is so fast and musically nasty.  o.o


wow that was a pointless post =D

actually, it summed up what i thought.

however i would call feux follets the most difficult in generla, because for the vast majority of people double notes are a complete pregnant dog.

[Skeptopotamus]

oi.  double notes aint so bad for me.  the complex tremelos in Snow Whirls give me bigger problems =(

[mlsmithz]

Obligatory plug of the Lyapunov Transcendental Etudes follows below.

These comments on the relative difficulties of 'Feux-follets' and 'Chasse-neige' could equally be applied to an argument about which of the Lyapunov Transcendental Etudes is most difficult - or, at least, which of the major key etudes is most difficult (No.2 in D-sharp minor, 'Ronde des fantomes', and No.4 in G-sharp minor, 'Terek', are strong candidates for the title of most difficult overall).  No.9 in D major, 'Harpes eoliennes', features the same complex tremolos/runs as 'Chasse-neige', tremolos which interweave with the melody to create some very complicated textures.  No.11 in G major, 'Ronde des sylphes', also features numerous awkward double note passages and requires feather light touch, as does 'Feux-follets'.  So I suppose the more difficult of the two of those would be as much a subject of contention as the identity of the more difficult of the two Liszt Transcendental Etudes in which the tonic note is B-flat.

[arensky]

                                                Feux Follets

[practicingnow]

                                                Feux Follets

Yes

[ahinton]

Obligatory plug of the Lyapunov Transcendental Etudes

Indeed - especially since neither the originator or any subsequent contributor to this thread has actually mentioned Kiszt by name.

So - now an equally obligatory plug for Sorabji - and there are, as some of you may already know - 100 Transcendental Studies from which to choose...

Best,

Alistair

[mlsmithz]

Indeed - especially since neither the originator or any subsequent contributor to this thread has actually mentioned Kiszt by name.

Well, no-one has mentioned Kiszt by name, but there are two posts which mention Liszt by name, one of which is mine. Interesting point, though - the subject line doesn't specify Liszt transcendental etudes....

So - now an equally obligatory plug for Sorabji - and there are, as some of you may already know - 100 Transcendental Studies from which to choose...

Very true, Mr. Hinton - any comments on which ones are considered to be the most difficult? (Though presumably only Sorabji himself was familiar enough with all of them to know which ones he had written to provide the greatest challenge.  At any rate, it seems fair to assume there are several which leave the Liszt and Lyapunov etudes far behind! )

[thierry13]

At any rate, it seems fair to assume there are several which leave the Liszt and Lyapunov etudes far behind! )

Indeed. Do a search on them, some sheet music and random records were given (by link). Some are very interesting !