Advice on Short List of German Pianos

[pianomanrsn]

After a long search, I have narrowed my short list to three or four European pianos that all sound pretty good to me. I am looking for an instrument in the 7-8' range and have narrowed my choices down to:

Bosendorfer 225
Steingraeber 205 (just under my 7' targer)
Grotrian 225
Bluthner 230

I have eliminated Steinway (both Hamburg and NY), and August Forster just missed the cut. I did not care for Bechsteins, Sauters, Seilers. or any of the rest although M&H BBs deserve honorable mention.

I have played all of these pianos - some serveral times, but there are so few Steingraebers around in the US, that I have only played one 205. I think they made 30 pianos last year.

My musical tastes tend toward Debussy, Chopin, Liszt, Saint Saens, and occasionally Rachmaninoff.  I also like Broadway show tunes.

I don't do concerts, so I don't have to justify my elimination of Steinway. I frankly think the quality issues on NY Steinways are significant and the five or six Hamburgs I tried, left me a little flat although they seemed well made.

I would be interested in specific feedback from anyone truely familiar with two or more of the pianos my short list.

Rob

[Brian Lawson, RPT]

For myself I've tuned a Bosendorfer and a Grotrian, though both about  15 - 20 years old - both fine pianos. I tuned and worked on older Buthners, also good.

If you have a handfull of people who answer liking one of those you mention will that sway you? i.e look at the other post of "which grand is best"

It is really hard to give you an answer, what do you think will be the deciding answer for you?

[dinosaurtales]

Woa!  Looks like we have similar tastes in pianos!  I tried all of them when I shopped last year except the Bosendorfer 225 - none around - I tested the little brother.  But I did test the others - I assume the Bluthner you refer to is the model 2?  I can tell you my take on them, but Brian is right - you reallyh will have to pick (I wanted one of EACH).

the Bluthner was smooth as silk, they say like dark chocolate, and they are right.  Deep dark base.  Beautiful sound.  made for Beethoven in my mind.  The action is a tad lighter than I traditionally like (The Sauter was REALLY too light! Gad!), but that's personal taste.  The piano was not a powerhouse - but incredible sustain and pure pure notes.  

The Grotrian was like the Dodge Viper of pianos.  It was probably my second choice just from the pure fun factor.  Slightly heavier touch, but not so much I wouldn't adjust fine.  Huge, beautiful notes, just gushing out of the tenor and bass.   Really nice piano - I played the 7'4" one.

The Bosendorfers in the 7' range seemed like 3 different pianos to me - on sound.  The treble was crystaline sounding, pretty sound, but different from the rest of the piano. Might have bothered me over time.  The 9' version didn't have taht problem, in fact, was practically a religious experience to play!  So don't know about the 225's.

The Steingraeber.  Now where did you find one of those?  I played one in Denver, and it was probably the best piano of those you have listed there.  Perfectly even notes, touch and sound, all the way up the keyboard.  Ahhhhhhh!    only deal breaker for me was I was after more OOOmph, like the larger pianos on your list.  If Udo ever puts out a 7'6" model, I'll have to check it out!

I ended up with  a Fazioli 212.  It's like a Ferrari.  Even, pretty notes everywhere. All the ooomph (actually too much) I need for my house.  Bunches of fun.  

That's my take.  

Mindy

[pianomanrsn]

Brian and Mindy,

Thanks for for your comments. Here are a few of my own for reference. I loved the touch and the feel of the Steingraeber and the musical tone was, as you mentioned Mindy, smooth and lovely. The trouble with the 205 is that it is pretty pricy for a sub-7 footer. The dealer I talked to in Florida was quoting me a list price of $60K (the big concert grand E-272 was about $100K and special order only). Even with some discounts, those are big numbers for a piano that may not be well supported in the US. I wish Udo would build a 225 or 230cm grand too.

The Bluthners I have played (a 230 Model 2 and two smaller grands) were lyrical and beautiful with reasonable base registers, but perhaps not ideal for the Rach 3 - not that I could play it worth a damn if my life depended on it.

I loved the Grotrian base - deep and full of overtones, but I played three different ones at three different places and the middle and upper registers on all three seemed to yield very different sounds. None were bad, just different.

I have played two Bosendorfer 225s and I am going to take a look at a 275 that was recently offered to me barely used. These are wonderful pianos, but I wish there was a little more growl in the base on the 225. The 275 should not have that issue. I have also been offered a used 290 Imperial at a good price, but it is 21 years old and even though it has been well maintained by a single owner, he is a professional musician that has used it a lot. For my home studio both the 275 and the 290 may be a bit much.

I played on two Faziolis at the most recent PGT convention in Dallas (F228 and F212). I was a little surprised at the base register on the F228. For a big instrument, it sounded relatively weak even when I was really banging away. I actually liked the F212 better. They are both on the pricy side of my budget.

Rob