Painful chord

[ccr]

Hello,

  I'm trying to learn the Brahms vals number 1 from Opus 39 and have a problem with a left hand EG#C#E chord. The fingering I'm using is 5321 and the problem is that I'm barely able to strech my 2 and 3 finger to reach the G# and C#. if I practice it more than a few minutes my wrist really starts to hurt.

  My hand span is a 9th (i can barely reach a 10th but can't play it) so I think I should be able to play that chord easily, but that separation between 2d and 3erd fingers is killing me

Anybody knows exercices to overcome this problem?

  Thanks

Carlos

[bernhard]

If you truly cannot play this chord, then you always have the option of rolling the chord, or of leaving one note out.

However, I suggest you try this first:

1. Play the EE octave and see how your other fingers []naturally[] fall on the G# and C#. Personally I find 5421 more comfortable.

2. Now for stretching. Understand this basic principle and you will not need stratching exercises or anything. Here is the principle:

a. Try to open your fingers 2 - 3 as wide as they will go. You will notice that a lot of effort may result in a bery small opening.

b. Now, try to do it again, but this time, instead of using your muscles, use the other hand to do it. You will see that as long as your fingers are passive and relaxed you will be able to stretch a lot more than in a above.

c. From a and b above you have the obvious conclusion: in order to stretch your fingers withou too much discomfort, you need to do it passively, that is, an external agent must stratch your fingers for you. Now, you cannot use your other hand to stretch your fingers to reach the C# and G#, (although I guess you could bring someone to do it for you, just like a page turner, you could have a finger-stretcher ), so you must use the keys themselves to stretch your fingers. It is dificult to describe this in writing, but I trust you will catch my drift. Let us say you are using 5321. Playing the EE octave is not a problem. Now place the 2nd finger on the C# and anchor it on the key 9this is easy as the balck keys are above the keyboard), and then "push" your hand towards the left (without any help from the finger abductors) and you should be able to manage the stretchwithout undue stress.

I hope this helps.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[ccr]

If you truly cannot play this chord, then you always have the option of rolling the chord, or of leaving one note out.

Hello Berhand,

  Well, it's not that I can't play this chord, but if I repeat 5 or 6 times in a row my wrist starts to hurt.  Yes rolling will be a possibility, but I left it as a last resort because is not what it's written and I don't like how it sounds.

However, I suggest you try this first:

1. Play the EE octave and see how your other fingers []naturally[] fall on the G# and C#. Personally I find 5421 more comfortable.

  5421 is even harder for me    My 3d finger fall in between G# and A# if I put 2d in C#

2. Now for stretching. Understand this basic principle and you will not need stratching exercises or anything. Here is the principle:

a. Try to open your fingers 2 - 3 as wide as they will go. You will notice that a lot of effort may result in a bery small opening.

b. Now, try to do it again, but this time, instead of using your muscles, use the other hand to do it. You will see that as long as your fingers are passive and relaxed you will be able to stretch a lot more than in a above.

  Yes I did notice that, and that's the reason I have hopes that I finally will be able to play that chord comfortably

c. From a and b above you have the obvious conclusion: in order to stretch your fingers withou too much discomfort, you need to do it passively, that is, an external agent must stratch your fingers for you. Now, you cannot use your other hand to stretch your fingers to reach the C# and G#, (although I guess you could bring someone to do it for you, just like a page turner, you could have a finger-stretcher ), so you must use the keys themselves to stretch your fingers. It is dificult to describe this in writing, but I trust you will catch my drift. Let us say you are using 5321. Playing the EE octave is not a problem. Now place the 2nd finger on the C# and anchor it on the key 9this is easy as the balck keys are above the keyboard), and then "push" your hand towards the left (without any help from the finger abductors) and you should be able to manage the stretchwithout undue stress.

  Well I've tryed the anchoring method and.. ehem I need more time because it's very difficult to do it in tempo and pressing all the keys at once. But point 2 and 4 have led me to experiment with the gesture and have found that opening my fingers not only in the horizontal plane, but also in the vertical one (and turning my wrist a little inwards to compensate) is relieving some of the pain.

I hope this helps.

  It surely gave me some hints I can use


   Thank you very much Bernhard

Carlos

[bernhard]

You are welcome