What kind of Digital Piano should I choose?

[infectedmushroom]

I'm thinking of buying a digital piano soon, since I only have a keyboard at home at the moment. I don't got the space for a "real" piano, so I guess I have to choose for an digital one. But I'm not really "into" digital piano's, so I really don't know wich one I should choose.

Of course, everyone has an different taste, but what kinda digital piano do you guys recommend me to buy?


P.S: I can spend about $1000 atm.

[classicarts]

 mUshroom, I suggest you find the biggest music store where your at, and spend a few days trying out different digital pianos.  Everyone else here will give you different opinions, and it can be confusing if you don't know anything about a digital pianos.  Go experience a few brands and know the differences in aural and available options these digital pianos have today. Good luck.

[infectedmushroom]

Yes, I guess you're right. I will visit the music store near me place soon. Though, all suggestions are still welcome. 

And since I never played on a digital piano; does it really comes close to a "real" piano? Well, atleast I bet it's better than my keyboard I have now.

[gilad]

i've only been playing piano 6 months, but i would have been miles behind where i am now if i never had a digital piano. at no time does it feel exactly like a real piano(imho),though it's a good simulation,and surely better than a keyboard, for my purposes of getting me moving quickly at my late age of 24 it's been instrumental(xcuse the pun!)being able to play anytime has really helped me get moving, my teacher told me to get a digital and i'm so happy i did. find out what specs are important to you and try out all the painos in your range, dont rush into it, give it a few weeks, they'll be restless ones, but you'll be happy with what you get if you buy one. i have no idea how it effects technique in more advanced players,anyway,best of luck.

[infectedmushroom]

Thanks for your answer gilad.


Do digital piano's have weighted keys too, like a real piano? I spoke to a pianist yesterday and he said the biggest difference between a keyboard and a piano are the keys. Well, I never played on a piano before, so I don't know if the difference between a keyboard and a piano is big or not. Well, if a digital piano really plays like a real piano, then I guess it's the best choice for me know to come as close to a real piano.

Anyway, I will take my time and I hope I will find a nice digital piano soon.

[leahcim]

Do digital piano's have weighted keys too, like a real piano?

Yes. Well, not always exactly like a real piano - although a few models do have real piano keyboards in them, they are more than your stated budget.

Why not play on a few real pianos? They aren't all the same either, there is no single sound, nor single action on grand pianos or uprights, but if you play on a few in stores you'll have an idea what a piano is supposed to feel like.

Then go and test out the digital pianos.

i.e don't compare digital pianos with each other, compare them with real pianos.

There's not a huge difference between the different manufacturers and in theory $1000 should get you something that's largely as good from the pov of being like a real piano.

The key things are

• 64 polyphony - although a budget model with 32 isn't the end of the world
• Hammer action weighted keyboard
• A piano sound you like
• 1/2 pedalling

Manufacturers, roland, yamaha, technics, gem, kawai et al all generally have stage pianos that match those specs.

It's worth considering a real piano, or at least an upright - space isn't _that_ much of an issue because the footprint of a digital isn't vastly smaller than an upright. A full-size 88 key keyboard is nearly as wide as an upright. With you sat in front it is going to take up nearly as much depth into the room too [you do save a bit of depth because uprights have lots of gubbins behind the keyboard like strings, but not much] and obviously it'll have less height for the same reason but unless you live in an igloo that won't matter.

Of course, weight, noise etc are different issues.

But your dilemma won't go away, in fact buying a real piano is probably a bigger can of worms, especially on a low budget There's always hiring though - I did consider hiring an upright for a year, on a sort of "play better in 12 months on a real upright and then worry about buying something or just forgetting the whole thing" but my SO pointed out that our house is smaller than an upright piano [at least that's what she said ]

When I was looking for a digital, I had the same dilemma, the biggest problem being knowing basically nothing about playing or about pianos or digital pianos and whether such and such an action was like a piano or not. So I read usenet, saw that everyone had a yamaha p90 or p120, and got a yamaha P60 [because it had the same action]

Today, if I bought a yamaha I'd get the P90 or P120 - but I wouldn't I'd get something that samples a different piano, like gem.

But you can't go wrong w.r.t yamaha in terms of build quality, popularity, selling it on ebay when you want something else, the keyboard action and finding a model that fits your budget. OTOH, if you look around, especially after you've played for a while you might find others that you prefer.

[infectedmushroom]

Thanks for all your information leahcim!


Well, the reason why I don't consider to buy a real piano is that it won't fit in my room. They prolly can't even take it up into my room, cause our house is kinda old and the stairs are really small (maybe it's possible, thru the window  ). And you can't really make a real piano silence. With a digital piano you can play with headphones and turn the volume down , right?

And like you recommend; I will play on some real piano's first. Though, it'll be kinda hard for me since my keyboard at home doesn't have a pedal, so I'm not used to use my foot. To be honest: I don't even know really what those pedals do. Do they add some "reverb" to your sound or something? Nobody really told me what those pedals do and since I never played on a real piano... 

Anyway, I will keep the information you recommended in mind and I'm busy with some searching already. First I want as much information as I can get, so I won't make a mistake when I buy one (I made a big mistake a few years ago when I bought my first guitar, so that won't happen again).

[leahcim]

With a digital piano you can play with headphones and turn the volume down , right?

Yep.

And like you recommend; I will play on some real piano's first. Though, it'll be kinda hard for me since my keyboard at home doesn't have a pedal, so I'm not used to use my foot. To be honest: I don't even know really what those pedals do. Do they add some "reverb" to your sound or something? Nobody really told me what those pedals do and since I never played on a real piano... 

Lose the self-conscious, you don't need to play like Horowitz

Let me expand a bit, what you need to do is perhaps get a feel for the action, what the keyboard feels like up and down the keyboard, and get a feel for the sounds a piano makes.

First the pedals :-

The main pedal, on the right if there's more than one, in an acoustic holds the dampers up, so the notes continue to sustain after you've released the key. This is the most used pedal - and it's what folk are referring to if they talk about "the" pedal. Chances are on a stage piano you may only get this pedal, but that should be fine for beginning.

The pedal on the left is the soft pedal, it changes the timbre of the notes, in a grand piano it makes the hammers hit 2 strings instead of 3, but in uprights it often just moves the hammers closer to the strings. It's often [incorrectly] associated with quiet playing, but that's not strictly true.

Where pianos have a middle pedal - the function of this on grand pianos is to sustain the notes, like the damper pedal does, but only the notes currently held down, other notes you play will play normally without sustaining when you release them. This pedal is hardly used at all.

In fact, on uprights that have 3 pedals, it often doesn't do that at all and instead operates some function like engaging a quiet mode for practise, or on silent pianos it can switch from the acoustic to the digital instrument - in effect, these pianos only have 2 pedals.

So, you need a damper pedal, and as I said, preferably one that has 1/2-pedalling [which is where a smaller depression of the pedal makes the notes begin to sustain more, but not fully [imagine the felt dampers resting on the string, as you press the pedal they lift, there's an amount of pedal movement between being completely on the string [damped] to completely off [full sustain] where you can get a different sound or level of sustain, this is 1/2-pedalling]

A soft pedal is useful for some repertoire, but it won't really hamper you if you buy a stage piano that only has one pedal.

The middle pedal isn't worth worrying about - they tend to be mechanically awkward on real pianos and, aiui often don't work if they are fitted - which isn't a problem for digitals, but nevertheless you aren't likely to miss it.

It's worth bearing in mind that one of the significant differences between digitals and acoustics is the sound that an acoustic makes other than the actual note you're playing -

e.g When a note is released, a long string is stopped moving by a short  felt damper, which means the notes don't stop dead ["key-off"]. The acoustic properties of the soundboard and case means that strings that aren't damped are energised by other notes playing ["sympathetic resonance"] The timbre of piano notes changes when you play from soft to loud [I don't know what to call this]

When digitals make a sound, they play a recording of that sound. To get the change of timbre between soft and loud, they typically use different recordings at different velocities and switch between them - so when you see "3-layer samples" that's what they mean.

Some digitals have more samples - recordings of the sound made when the key is being released "key-off samples"

Some digitals try to emulate the sympathetic resonance too. A way to test this is to hold a chord in your left hand pressing the notes slowly so they don't play, and then hit other notes on the piano, the notes you hold down should make some sound.

Some digitals use a [damper] pedal that has a potentiometer rather than a simple switch, so they can try and emulate the 1/2 pedalling effect.

So, if you play a real piano, that's the kind of thing to listen for and play with - as well as listening to the overall sound - use the damper pedal as a control, not as an on-off switch and hear the sound it makes, play a chord and listen to the effect when you release it. Play notes quietly and loudly and listen for the timbre, as well as volume change [and of course, at the same time you'll have an idea of what the action feels like] play notes and listen to them sustain, often for a loooooooooong time before it fades away.

You'll find that on digitals, even where they say they have some of these effects, often they use filters or reverb and although there is an effect, it's not exactly the same. On a digital that has sample layers being switched to get dynamics, you might find it's not a completely smooth transition between soft and loud. That's not to say they are bad, it's
just they aren't exactly like acoustic pianos yet and you'll hopefully be able to hear why and see what you're missing on the model you try.

Some of the artifacts you can get with digitals, are things like sustained notes beginning to loop because the recording memory can only be a certain size, they often loop the sample to get a long sustain - , this is ok unless it's done badly and you can hear the loops. The amount of memory, partly, and the quality of the recording matter too - up to a point, the more memory used to hold the samples, the better quality. Similarly, some digital pianos don't record every single note, they record 30 or 50 notes and then electronically change the recording to get the notes inbetween - again, in general, the more sampled notes [or sample points] the better quality the sound will be, as raising / lowering the pitch electronically will affect the sound. But don't worry too much about the numbers in specification tables, use your ears - but it's a fair comparison between different models in the same range, because someone like yamaha record a piano and then squeeze that recording into 30 sample points, one layer, 5mb rom for the p60, or 50 sample points, 3+ layers, 30mb for the top models and that's why the top model piano sound is better.

Gem do most of these effects with maths rather than with samples - kawai do some as well on a couple of their models - in principle that means they are closer than others to recreating them, in practise a lot of people play yamaha, roland et al, aware of these things, but nevertheless still able to practise and learn to play on them, so don't read it too negatively.

[infectedmushroom]

Thanks a lot for your help and this information leahcim, I understand a lot more of it now. 


Well, I'm gonna search for a digital piano with 1/2-pedalling, like you recommended. And after reading your explanation, I can understand why 1/2-pedalling is nice to have.

And one thing is clear to me: these pedals (well, atleast the damper pedal) are very important. I bet you can put a lot of emotion in your playing with the pedal(s) and I'm curious to try it, so I'm gonna visit the music store this weekend when I'm off from work.


What can I say more, thanks again and I hope I will find a digital piano, that suits me right, soon.