Concerto for finals of national competition... URGENT

[danyal]

I'm entering into a national competition next year (the biggest non-international in the country) and need to choose a concerto for the final round. Will be competing against works like Prokofiev 3 and Rachmaninoff Rhapsody on a theme of Paganini etc etc need to think along those lines...

The few I can think of off the top of my head are

Liszt - 1
   "   - Totentanz

Rachmaninoff - 1
         "           - 2

Shostakovich -1

Chopin?

I dunno... need something exceptionally good for a competition... my favourite so far is Shostakovich 1 but is it right? Also, difficulty is not really a problem... well... sort of... just keep it in my though... be kind... I have a year to learn it.

Any help would be appreciated... thanks

[jamie_liszt]

Tchaikovsky 1, Prokofiev 3, Rach 2,3 + theme paganini, Chopin 1 are favs of mine but usually overplayed in competitions.

How about the challenging and very rarely heard Rachmaninov Concerto No 4 ? Its difficult and not usually played, this is just my opinion. go for Shostakovich if you like. Another one that i love is the schumann concerto Aminor, Or the Shostakovich No 2.

Not a fan of Grieg ?

[stevie]

rach1 is a winning concerto nowadays

[jamie_liszt]

I think people are sick of hearing Rach 3

What about a Beethoven concerto too, no 3 ? 4?

[brewtality]

rach1 is a winning concerto nowadays

yah but it's pretty bloody hard. I hope you take your vitamins.

[danyal]

If people are 'sick' of listening to Rach 3 they'll be definitely sick of Grieg. Please tell me if you think the Shostakovich is right for a big national comp. Then again, my friend is probably gonna take Gershwin F major... and someone else came 2nd with it last time... so it doesnt have to be Liszt or Rach or anything insane like that really, though it could help. I think I've decided against the Totentanz... i just listened to it following the score... hahahah... no thanks. I would like to keep my sanity. Rach 1...? I suppose... I'll stock up on my vitamins.

[shasta]

If you like the Shosta and can master it in time, then do it!  <-- along a similar vein, perhaps consider the Ginastera 1 or 2 (the 2 opens with Beethoven variations, which is cool).

It's nice to hear something different!

[sauergrandson]

Mac Dowell second.

[apion]

LISZT: PC1, PC2, TOTENTANZ

[thalbergmad]

If you are permitted to go a little off the beaten track, how about the Rubinstein 4.

A roof-raiser if ever there was one.

Do you have a list from which you have to choose??

Bortkiewicz, Arensky, Scharwenka ??

[danyal]

I dont really think I'm allowed to go so "off the beaten track" I can write a letter permitting me to play a concerto not on the list... (as I will do if I play the Shostakovich)... but ones like the Scharwenka is taking my chances.

The Totentanz scares me. Which is probably why I will end up playing it. Or just to annoy my mother. Virtuostic music scares her more.

I have never heard the Ginastera's, will look into them.

Liszt 2 is not a good competition work. Juries dont like it. Liszt 1 is one of my very strong options.

Right now I dont care about how overplayed a work is, its not what matters to me. If I play it exeptionally well it wont make a difference.

But thank you for all your suggestions!! I appreciate them... keep them coming!

[pita bread]

The Shostakovich is too much of a joke; if you want something short, go for the Prokofiev 1st or the Liszt Totentanz.

The Ginastera #1 is by no means a pleasant work, but could prove useful in scaring your mother.

[paris]

if i were in your position, i'd choose chopin e minor. i don't think its a big deal a fact that its overplayed, because if you play extremely well it can only bring you good. i wouldn't go with rachmaninov although 2nd is one of my favorite concertos, just cos i see chopin technically more approachable for me at this time, and you have whole year to realllly master it. i think its wiser (for me) to choose technically easier (though its relative thing) and master it to that degree that everyone falls on their ass when they hear me, then to do some harder stuff and not feel completely free when performing it.

btw weren't you doing saint saens africa and concerto too?

[panic]

I'd actually go for a lesser known concerto if I could. With hackneyed or oft-played concertos you are being tested and compared to all the greats that have come before. The concerto is already there, the orchestra is already there, and it's up to you to live up to a certain standard. With more obscure concertos you are leading the charge. There's less to compare your performance to and that might work to your advantage. I know that if I were faced with a challenge like this in a number of years I'd try something like the Sauer #1 because probably none of the judges would have heard it.

P.S. If you can pull off something by Medtner, you might very well win. 2 might go over particularly well.

P.P.S. More towards the mainstream, I don't know how technically difficult Brahms 1 is, but there's a real nice concerto that's not TOO overplayed. It is very long, but you will get major props for being able to manage something of that length.

[I Love Xenakis]

The big "winner", as in it will almost always win against inferior concerti, is the Prokofiev Concerto No. 2 Op. 16

[klavierkonzerte]

i think chopin concerto in e minor is a superb choice it's technically aprochable and it's shows everything you got, it's not a bad thing that it's overplayed because if you played it well enough they'll see the diffrence.

another concero i like very much is kullak concerto in c minor but it's a bit difficult.

you should seriously consider the concertos of medtner the'r all superb and as good as rachmaninov concertos if not better.

i also like very much the concertos of litolff they could be a good substitue for liszt concertos, he has a similar musical language to liszt but a bit more conservative
and the scores of the third and fourth are availble on the internet.

[etudes]

scriabin concerto?

i love chopin e minor but have to agree that The big "winner", as in it will almost always win against inferior concerti, is the Prokofiev Concerto No. 2

[brewtality]

If you are permitted to go a little off the beaten track, how about the Rubinstein 4.

A roof-raiser if ever there was one.

I agree, besides its not that far off the beaten track. Rubinstein was such an important musical figure that the jury are bound to be reasonably familiar with this concerto. Also, except for the third movement, it is pretty straightforward. Easier than the rach concerti. I wouldn't try the prok 2 unless you're some kind of prodigy with a well sorted out technique, you'll need more than vitamins to get through that pregnant cat.

[lisztisforkids]

Rimsky-Korsakof concerto?

[danyal]

I would not go anywhere near the Prokofiev 2 even with a gun to my head. It is an incredible work, but emotionally, physically, technically... suicide. I dont want to touch the Rimsky Korsakov or the Grieg because then I would be compared to the previous winner (one of our best pianists), and thats the last thing I want. I dont want to try and live up to other peoples achievements.

I just had a long talk with one of my pianist friends... and it boiled down to either the SS 2 or Totentanz. He's played both and apparently the SS2 is harder. If I work properly the Totentanz will be fine. And its an excellent competition choice. And its shorter and 1 "mvt". Also easier on the orchestra. But I'll talk to my teacher next week about it. I wish I could take SS Africa but its not comparable or good enough in any aspects. I've learnt it so I'll use it at some point eventually. The practising is not going to go to waste. I'll play it in a festival in 2 months time. (w/o orch though... argh)

What you think between SS2 and Totentanz? No matter what my friend said, and no matter how much better I feel about it... it still scares me.

[I Love Xenakis]

as far as competitions go, Totentanz is generally considered an amateur piece.  Go with the Saint-Saens Piano Concerto No. 2


Or maybe the SS 4?

[pita bread]

Octave runs up and down the keyboard and glissandi everywhere backed up by a powerful orchestra sound impressive, but aren't really that difficult of a feat to pull off in the Totentanz.

I still say Prokofiev 2nd though.

[I Love Xenakis]

Octave runs up and down the keyboard and glissandi everywhere backed up by a powerful orchestra sound impressive, but aren't really that difficult of a feat to pull off in the Totentanz.

I still say Prokofiev 2nd though.

That's what I said but he's a wuss XD


I'm telling you, the Prok 2 is the most winning concerto there is.

[stevie]

ss5 is awesome too

[lostinidlewonder]

Ravel's LH concerto. winning! Put to shame those using 2 hands and show how much better you can sound just with one.

[I Love Xenakis]

Ravel's LH concerto. winning! Put to shame those using 2 hands and show how much better you can sound just with one.

If he thinks the Prok 2 is too hard he definitely doesn't want to have anything to do with that.

[pita bread]

Ravel LH is great, provided that they don't cut you off before the cadenza for any time restraint reason.

Bartok #1, 2 would work too.

Does anyone have a recording of the Hindemith LH concerto?

[stevie]

If he thinks the Prok 2 is too hard he definitely doesn't want to have anything to do with that.

he is a she

[e60m5]

It's bleedingly obvious that the people suggesting Prokofiev 2 have not played the work and do not know how risky it is to perform live, especially under competition circumstances. I haven't performed it nor entered it in a competition, but having studied it to some degree I'm more than aware of the foolishness of such a suggestion for the vast majority of pianists.

[I Love Xenakis]

It's bleedingly obvious that the people suggesting Prokofiev 2 have not played the work and do not know how risky it is to perform live, especially under competition circumstances. I haven't performed it nor entered it in a competition, but having studied it to some degree I'm more than aware of the foolishness of such a suggestion for the vast majority of pianists.

Do not simply assume that the pianist asking this question is as bad as you, and don't assume that either Pita or I haven't studied this piece also.

[e60m5]

Do not simply assume that the pianist asking this question is as bad as you, and don't assume that either Pita or I haven't studied this piece also.

"...as bad as you..." 

[zheer]

"...as bad as you...

  LOL, as bad as you has a double meaning, it can also mean very very good.
I think e60m5 is a very gifted pianist, i guess.

[zheer]

Ok danyal i is had a little think, and i is think a Beethoven piano concerto will go down well, Try the first one.this something i is would like to listen to.

[phil13]

The Scriabin concerto is one of the most neglected piano concerti by a fairly mainstream composer. If it's at your level, I'd say go with that.

Other ones to consider:

Chopin 2 (still overplayed, but less so than the 1st)

Beethoven 3

Bach 1

Rach 4

Any of the Saint-Saens concerti

Shostakovich 1 or 2

Gershwin

I still lean towards Scxriabin.

Phil

[pita bread]

Beethoven 1 and Bach 1 probably wouldn't survive against a well-played Prokofiev 3rd.

[superstition2]

Play the one you like! That's the answer. Great pianists are ARTISTS, not artisans.

Prokofiev 2 has to be a joke. #1. It's too long. #2. It's too hard. I think the first movement is among the best all-time when we're talking about classical music. But, let's face it, the other three are not exceptional. The second can be exciting, and the third and fourth aren't bad. But, the first movement blows the rest out of the water, making the concerto anticlimactic and much too long. When you're said everything that needs to be said in the first movement, you don't need three more tacked on. The first movement is a complete piece in itself. I think Prokofiev should have taken the other three and written a new first movement, leaving the original as a completely separate work.

If you're concerned about pieces that are overplayed, I agree with the selection of the absolutely great Rachmaninov 4th. But, only the original or 1927 version. The piece is so much richer and more lyrical in its original form, not the chopped-up nonsensical form the "final" version is in, where the ideas don't develop properly.

The Scriabin concerto is a great choice.

Tviett's 1st concerto is very nice. Most people here balk at the name because it's unfamiliar. But, it is a beautiful piece that deserves a prominent position in the Romantic piano concerto genre. If you like nature, you'll like the piece. It invokes Scandanavian fjords, waterfalls, lakes, etc. It's completely tonal and not typical Romantic-period melodramatic rubbish (like so many lesser-known pieces from the period). The downside to this piece is that it's probably too easy and too short. His 5th concerto is long and more difficult, though.

If you want something innovative/modern in character, check out Tcherepnin's 5th concerto. It's not terribly difficult and it's melodic, although chromatic. It's VERY under-appreciated. Unlike melodically-challenged modern concertos (Rautavarra, Schoenberg, Bartok's 2nd), Tcherepnin is both modern and palatable. He doesn't grind listeners down with horrible dissonance (Bartok) or murky-chewy sludge that goes nowhere (Schoenberg).

[pita bread]

I concur with the Rach 4. Does anyone have recordings of the original or 1927 versions?

[superstition2]

I concur with the Rach 4. Does anyone have recordings of the original or 1927 versions?

1927 version
original version

Both versions have merits. I think I'd give the edge to the 1927 version, but it's difficult to say. Either version is superior to the final version.

I've attached a very low-quality mp3 (66k variable bit rate mp3, 22k sample rate) of the first movement of 1927. Please keep in mind the audio is very watered down. Since it's a commercial release, I don't want to put up a high quality track. (CD quality is 1411k at 44k sample rate.) The second movement is slightly better sound (83k at 44k). Both are also reduced to mono. I won't put up the third movement.

I don't know if the Buketoff/Black/Icelandic disc is out of print. Amazon.uk has one copy, and Amazon USA is out with no notice of re-order. It would really be a shame if it becomes totally unavailable. I had to specially order my copy years ago through Borders.

[Teddybear]

Liszt 2 is not a good competition work. Juries dont like it.

WHY?? 

[burstroman]

Saint-Saens #1, Bartok #1, Prok #5.

[danyal]

WHY?? 

Dunno, this is from what i've seen and heard at comps though, and what professors and others have told me, Anway, I have decided...

SAINT SAENS 2 IT IS! It just makes more sense as I have already played the 1st mvt, and the rest is not all that hard... I'm not going to kill myself learning it and its an awesome, amazing work.

Quite ironically, I decided this while listening to the finals of the int voice comp here tonight, while the singer was singing some or other Verdi aria... i had SS running through my head... hmmm...

Anyway, I'm just gonna need tips on how to memorise the trills in the 3rd mvt... its almost impossible... HOW???