piano starting age

[pianojam]

 If you start playing the piano at 14 do you think you can ever get as good as if you started  at an age like 5, or could you try really, really hard and never get that good? what age did you start learning to piano? what do you think? ? ? ? ?

[thalbergmad]

If you start playing the piano at 14 do you think you can ever get as good as if you started  at an age like 5, or could you try really, really hard and never get that good? what age did you start learning to piano? what do you think? ? ? ? ?

A large percentage of great pianists started at a very young age, but there are exceptions such as Paderewski, Volodos and Bauer and I am sure there are many more.

My own teacher did not start until 13 but still carved out an excellent career and has a superb technique.

Personally, I think someone could start at 80 and still become very good, but the chances of a career would be small.

[kyle556]

I started when I was 8, so it's in the middle.  Not old like 15, and not really young like 3-5 years old.

[alwaystheangel]

Adult students are impossible.  The younger they are the easier it is to mold them and the chances are far higher for them to become really good.  My piano teacher refuses to teac adult students because "they don't get it" and expect to immediately play like Paderowsky or something.  *'s a good age 3 isn't good, they could beurn out and never play the piano again.  I'm sure that there are good paino players that started at a late age but they're essentailly rare.  There's one member here that is trying to get into some secondary msuic program and he/she (I can't remember) started at age 15.

[abell88]

Adult students are impossible.  The younger they are the easier it is to mold them and the chances are far higher for them to become really good.  My piano teacher refuses to teac adult students because "they don't get it" and expect to immediately play like Paderowsky or something.

Frankly, I am appalled at this. Certainly it is extremely unlikely that an adult beginner is going to become a concert artist (and actually, most of them don't want to), but they can make very good progress.  I think your teacher's attitude is ageist, condescending, and inflexible.  I am sorry that it sounds like you have picked it up.

[letters]

i started when i was 5, but i think thats probably the youngest, or maybe 4, because they just havent got the concentration span to actually learn a great deal. but i think you can start learning and become a very good pianist in your teens, and when you are an adult i think they play it for a different reason, eg to relax, rather than become the next Horowitz or whoever. But i think anyone can learn at any point, just the way they learn and are taught changes for each age group.

[alwaystheangel]

I'm sorry that you don't quite understand what I mean I think, Abell, I don't think I wrote it down properly:  It's a proven scientific fact that adults don't learn things the same was as a child so children learn  things at a far greater speed and better than most adults ever can.  It's the same thing with languages.  You can learn a language as an adult but you'll never be as fluent and comfortable in it unless you learned it as a child.  There are always exceptions, don't get me wrong and if you're immersed in a language (and piano too probably) you can develop the skills to a great degree.  I think the magic age for languages is 12, after that age, the neurological pathways die if they are not used and exercised so that ability is lost.  Interesting stuff though. 

[queenrock]

I started piano two years ago at the age of the 13 and i think i'm progressing quite well i'm grade 3 with distinctions and will hopefully be grade 4 by the end of the year. I think it's probably better to start younger but i think if i had've started younger i don't think i would have enjoyed it. Especially i think it is better if someone decides to learn an instrument because they want to, not because their parents want them to.

[frederic]

i started learning music at 12, playing the keyboard, switched to piano a year later, and won a local piano concerto competition (all the other competitiors started at 4 or so). I passed my grade 8 with distinction when i was 14, and gained LTCL last year with 94%. This year i'm 17 and i've skipped a year of high school to start my tertiary studies working towards a bachelor of music in piano performance. I used to practice like mad to try and catch up to others who have been learning since a very young age, but now i'm kinda slack.  .....................which i shouldn't be...... teenage years *sigh*

[kelly_kelly]

I started 4 years ago when I was 9. Sometimes I regret not starting earlier... ah well.

About the starting age thing, I don't think there's really any definite answer. My sister started at 5 and couldn't handle it, but I'm pretty sure I could have started when I was 3 (if I could learn to read, I probably could have started piano).

[nanabush]

I started when I was 7.....I had a slow start, 30 minute lessons for like 2 years..... It picked up when I was around 11-12....  Now, like 5 and a bit years later, I feel I've accomplished alot... but I'm not saying much, cuz according to lotsa ppl on this forum, you suck unless you're like a 10 year old prodigy..

[alwaystheangel]

Ignore them. Everyone' is better looking, younger, sexier (and in this case) better piano players than they are in real life.

[juliax]

I'm sorry that you don't quite understand what I mean I think, Abell, I don't think I wrote it down properly:  It's a proven scientific fact that adults don't learn things the same was as a child so children learn  things at a far greater speed and better than most adults ever can.  It's the same thing with languages.  You can learn a language as an adult but you'll never be as fluent and comfortable in it unless you learned it as a child.  There are always exceptions, don't get me wrong and if you're immersed in a language (and piano too probably) you can develop the skills to a great degree.  I think the magic age for languages is 12, after that age, the neurological pathways die if they are not used and exercised so that ability is lost.  Interesting stuff though. 

It sounds like your teacher just isn't competent enough to teach adult students.  I have many adult students, and I use all kinds of techniques to work around this issue.  Hal Lenord has an excellent adult keyboarding book that teaches rhythm using a CD accompaniment.  It's an excellent supplement to Alfred's Adult All In One.  As a professional teacher it is completely against my policy to turn down a student for any reason.  I have had students from age 4 to retired, and I teach them all because I am a piano teacher.  Turning down a student is like a car salesmen not selling to women because they don't no anything about cars, or a clothing salesmen turning a man away because he can't figure out what to buy for his wife.  Except what you are selling is knowledge, not cars, which is so much more valuable.  Classifying other people as "slow learners" is a self-fulfilling prophecy in teaching, and it is what seperates the good teachers from the bad teachers.  All my students want to play above their level immediately, and I just tell them to practice hard the way I instruct, and someday they will.  Then I play along with them so it sounds like they are playing well beyond their level, so they can kind of get a feel for it.
Anyway, I don't know if you really care, I just wanted to let it be known that is NOT an acceptable attitude from a teacher.

[alwaystheangel]

You have to audition for her, have an interview with her to even be considered as one of her students, she physically does not have enought time to teach all the people that want to be her students.  If you do not practice she will drop you so that she has time for a student that is comiitted to learning.  I think she feels this way because the majority of her adult students did not practice.  My mother is her onlt adult student and because my mother practices she reamins one of her students, if I stopped practicing, I'd be dropped too.  I think it's perfectly acceptable for her to pick her students when she is in such demand and is the highest calibre teacher in the city.

[pianoperfmajor]

In a word:  No.

[juliax]

You have to audition for her, have an interview with her to even be considered as one of her students, she physically does not have enought time to teach all the people that want to be her students.  If you do not practice she will drop you so that she has time for a student that is comiitted to learning.  I think she feels this way because the majority of her adult students did not practice.  My mother is her onlt adult student and because my mother practices she reamins one of her students, if I stopped practicing, I'd be dropped too.  I think it's perfectly acceptable for her to pick her students when she is in such demand and is the highest calibre teacher in the city.

Yes, I too had teachers that would not teach me unless I practiced.  One would actually call before the lesson to make sure he needed to come.  He was also a professional concert pianist, so he had a really busy schedule with that as well.  I mean, if a student never practices, they are going to quit eventually anyway.  Not practicing is a sign of lack of interest, and some people just aren't good at getting people excited about music.  Some teachers are good at inspiring practicing, and sparking interest in others, but I can see how not all teachers have time for that sort of thing, I guess.

[alwaystheangel]

Yes, I too had teachers that would not teach me unless I practiced.  One would actually call before the lesson to make sure he needed to come.  He was also a professional concert pianist, so he had a really busy schedule with that as well.  I mean, if a student never practices, they are going to quit eventually anyway.  Not practicing is a sign of lack of interest, and some people just aren't good at getting people excited about music.  Some teachers are good at inspiring practicing, and sparking interest in others, but I can see how not all teachers have time for that sort of thing, I guess.

Truce?

[bernhard]

If you start playing the piano at 14 do you think you can ever get as good as if you started  at an age like 5, or could you try really, really hard and never get that good? what age did you start learning to piano? what do you think? ? ? ? ?

This has been asked before many times.

Like so many other controversial topics, the same (contradicting) opinions keep being voiced albeit by different people. Have a look at these threads and have fun:

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,2444.msg24025.html#msg24025
(Can you make it as a pianist if you start late?)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,2855.msg25276.html#msg25276
(where should one be after 10 years of piano study?)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,2976.msg26082.html#msg26082
(advantages of being a late beginner)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,3636.msg32469.html#msg32469
(How young prodigies do it? anyone can do it)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,3992.msg36199.html#msg36199
(do children learn faster than adults?)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,4059.msg37072.html#msg37072
(Does there come a time when piano learning will not be so difficult – The problem: a good teacher, enough practice and yet very slow progress –  approach maybe everything: practice to make it easy. Guardian link to Alan Rustrbridge article – summary of PPI - alternate hands)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,5515.msg53745.html#msg53745
(do you need to start at 2 years old? Analogy with brain surgery)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,4105.msg37603.html#msg37603
(Does age and practice time matter? –  Summaries of the 7 x 20 approach – averages and standard deviations are given for the several numbers – need for a practice diary – how to deal with mastering something and forgetting it next day – what exactly is mastery – the 3 stages of mastery)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,2125.msg17864.html#msg17864
(Age limitations – Barenboins’s there are only bad teachers philosophy)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,3524.msg32403.html#msg32403
(adults learn faster than children)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,143.msg35967.html#msg35967
(differences in learning/teaching children and adults)

And by the way, as far as playing to the highest standards is concerned, I do not believe it makes any difference what age you start, provided you do it right (doing it right is very hard though). Older people (let us say, in their 80s) have a time disadvantage, in that they may not have that much time left to acquire the necessary repertory (acquiring repertory is the real time consuming task in piano playing – all the rest: technique, sight reading skills, theory, etc. - can be easily acquired in 1-3 years if one knows what one is doing – a big if, by the way).

Having a piano career on the other hand usually requires one starts early. But his has little to do with piano ability, and more with market demands.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[juliax]

Truce?

[alwaystheangel]

I think I just got told by Bernhard.