When learning a new piece do you...

[justliam]

When you start learning a new piece, due you learn say one line at a time, till you can play it almost perfectly or even by heart before you carry on?  Because I promise myself everytime the next piece I learn I'm gonna wait till the first line, section etc, is absolutely perfect before I move.  But I constantly find myself just sight reading the rest of the page after a few plays, and gradually it all becomes more and more familiar till I can play, but I know it is just familiarisation and theres no real work or thought gone into it, other than playing it through till it's no longer really sight reading, and I think that means it takes me much longer to learna piece.  Then again learning a line perfectly could take longer.  Any thoughts? What do you do?

Also, when memorizing a piece, do you learn it till you can play it well, and then start memorizing it, or learning it as you go?  I never perform so I've no need to memorize stuff super quickly etc, I just like the idea of sitting down and being able to play a few pieces, but the only piece I've just naturally been able to play by memory from the second I stopped learning it was, La Fille Aux cheveux de lin, so any thoughts on that too? lol

[mike_lang]

Regarding the memory: one plays better when not relying on the sheet music, so you should memorize it as you learn it.

[a romantic]

Yeah, and the easiest way to learn complex/hard to read music is to memorize it.

[justliam]

Problem is, as far as my repetoire the only decent pieces I have (say grade 6-Diploma) are 5 or debussy pieces, 4 or 5 chopin pieces, a bartok piece, a mozart sonata, couple of Bach Inventions.  So I need to build a bit of a repetoire and memorizing can take so long, especially  in learning a new piece, since my sight reading isn't too bad.  I know memorizing is importent, I love playing the pieces that I have memorized (largely by chance) I just wonder if in my case its better to learn new pieces and say spend some time in practise sessions memorisings older pieces I can already play? Anyone else in a similar situation?

[mike_lang]

Problem is, as far as my repetoire the only decent pieces I have (say grade 6-Diploma) are 5 or debussy pieces, 4 or 5 chopin pieces, a bartok piece, a mozart sonata, couple of Bach Inventions.  So I need to build a bit of a repetoire and memorizing can take so long, especially  in learning a new piece, since my sight reading isn't too bad.  I know memorizing is importent, I love playing the pieces that I have memorized (largely by chance) I just wonder if in my case its better to learn new pieces and say spend some time in practise sessions memorisings older pieces I can already play? Anyone else in a similar situation?

I think that it's more valuable for you to learn how to memorize quickly your new pieces than to memorize old ones.

[letters]

ive never intentionally memorized anything before... so im having a go with the maple leaf rag. i would say i have a pretty good memory so firstly, because theres about 3 sections, i just started with the first section playing it through until i could basically do the whole section pretty well. then randomly came to sat down at the piano and found i could play most of it. then onto the next section. i dont really find it that difficult, but if i were under pressure to learn something by heart i would probably find it much more difficult. i have never gone through a piece line by line but perhaps i should try that sometime. ive got about halfway through maple leaf rag now (can play all the way through badly but trying to get it good) - who knows it may be my first pianostreet recording.....

so basically i have no idea if my memorizing technique is good or not.

[palika dunno]

https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,5767.msg56133.html#msg56133

[cjp_piano]

When I learn a new piece, I do both:  I read the whole thing even if I have to leave out some notes, just so I know how it goes.  And I also begin working on small sections in detail, establishing a fingering to be able to play it up to tempo and easily, etc.

I think it's helpful to play through the entire piece, but just once each practice session.  I agree with you about this being a slow way to learn a piece.  You don't want to learn the piece this way, by always just trying to get through the whole thing.  Just once, so you can get a feel for the whole picture so you know how all the little sections will fit together in the end.  I disagree with you about it being thoughtless since it's no longer sight-reading after the first time.  You are learning the notes, the rhythms, and most importantly you are READING.  Your reading skills will improve as you read more.

I play through the whole piece everyday, probably just once though, but then spend most of my time perfecting small sections.  As I work out each little section, I automatically memorize it because I'm repeating it so many times and watching my hands.  As I connect the sections together, more and more of it becomes memorized.

I never actually work on JUST memorizing a piece, I memorize it AS I'm practicing it. 

[chopinfan_22]

This is what I do..... I figure out how many measures are in the piece. For example, let's consider Chopin's Nocturne  Op. 72, No. 1. It has a total of 57 measures. Now, say you want to learn this piece in 10 days. To take care of all the measures, that means you'd have to learn 6 measures a day, or roughly, the first two lines. I do hands seperate at first, and I continually practice each hand until I know it. This takes me about... 20/30 minutes. Since it starts off with the left hand, I did the left hand first, and learned the notes for the left hand for the first six measures. After I knew them, I integrated the right hand, and practiced it until I felt competent. The next day, work on the next 6 measures. The next day, the next six. So it would look like this:

Day 1: 1 - 6
Day 2: 7 - 12
Day 3: 13 - 18
Day 4: 19 - 24
Day 5: 25 - 30
Day 6: 31 - 36
Day 7: 37 - 42
Day 8: 43 - 48
Day 9: 49 - 54
Day 10: 55 - 57

At this point, you should be familiar enough with the song to be able to play it all the way through, maybe not perfectly, but well enough, in which case you can practice the runs in measures 32 through 37. I read about that strategy in one of Bernards threads. Here's the link if you want to read it:

https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,4710.msg44538.html

[mike_lang]

This is what I do..... I figure out how many measures are in the piece.

This makes logical sense, but I think that this is not a very musical approach to memorizing.  Because you are dividing this completely mathematically, there is a disregard for structure.  I think that it would be more productive to pick small sections to memorize, but as I say, sections.  I believe that the x measures/day method is, on a larger scale, akin to memorizing a sequence of notes, rather than a melody.

Best,
Michael

[chopinfan_22]

It's not saying you have to follow it exactly, it's just an example. You can stop or do whatever you want. But that's what works best for me.

[kriskicksass]

Generally I break music up into sections based on musical content, usually phrases. Then, after I learn each individual one, I start putting them together. First you put the ones next to each other together until you can play through the whole thing. Then, to cement your memory, you link nonadjecent sections, playing the music between them in your head. This really helps fight memory slips, and even if you get one, you're bound to have a beginning of a section nearby to start off at.

[mike_lang]

Generally I break music up into sections based on musical content, usually phrases. Then, after I learn each individual one, I start putting them together. First you put the ones next to each other together until you can play through the whole thing. Then, to cement your memory, you link nonadjecent sections, playing the music between them in your head. This really helps fight memory slips, and even if you get one, you're bound to have a beginning of a section nearby to start off at.

Another good thing is to elide sections in practice, i.e., start before the end of the previous section and/or go a little into the next.  This allows you to have both a sectional and complete memory of the piece.