Most Difficult Chopin Piece

[bflatminor24]

While we're on the shallow and mundane subject of the "most difficult piece" written by a composer, I thought I would write a topic about Chopin. His works are much easier to identify because he didn't write hundreds of random transcriptions of great difficulty that go unplayed. Chopin's works are all very well known to us pianists...

So what do you guys think? I'll throw in my two cents -

I'd say his hardest pieces are the Sonatas 2 and 3, Scherzo 1, Polonaises in C sharp minor and F sharp minor, and Etudes 10/2, 25/6.

Thoughts??

[kriskicksass]

My vote's for the B minor Sonata.

[matt haley]

  difficulty in etudes would always be very subjective but i certainly agree with you on one piece.....

   chopin's sonata no 3 op 58 in bminor....

       to pull off the 4th movement(rondo) you must be a virtuoso as  i beleive this movement was chopin transcendental study!!

  Matt Haley

p.s theres a lot of tough passage writing in the allegro maestro......thats what i found!
 

[lisztisforkids]

I would say his concerto in eminor..

[bench warmer]

That Presto Finale of Op.58 Sonata is a bugger for sure. I've tried playing it a few times. It's always won.

The other piece thats mentally tough to get thru is the Last Movement Presto "Wind over the Graves" thingy of  the Bb-minor Sonata.

[bflatminor24]

I learned the latter two movements of the B flat minor sonata, op. 35 (Funeral march and Graveyard movements), and found them to be adequately challenging, but the real technical challenge is getting the "hammerless" effect to make the synchronized voices sounds like a wind swirling through a cemetary.

I think the Chopin Polonaises pose the most technical difficulties as a whole, and out of his fifteen polonaises, I found 7-8 of them very very challenging. The B minor sonata is very difficult also, but don't underestimate the first movement. That is no easy piece!

I still vote for his polonaises/b minor sonata/10/2/25/6/scherzo 1

[presto agitato]

Sonatas 3 and 1, yes num 1 in C minor by far

[orlandopiano]

Sonatas 3 and 1, yes num 1 in C minor by far

For me, here they are:

Short pieces:
10/7
10/10
25/6

Longer pieces:
Polonaise in f# minor,
Sonata #2 (final mvmt)
Sonata #3 (final mvmt)
A flat Ballade (c# minor section)
Fantasy in f minor (contrary motion octave section)

[Kassaa]

For me, here they are:

Short pieces:
10/7
10/10
25/6

Longer pieces:
Polonaise in f# minor,
Sonata #2 (final mvmt)
Sonata #3 (final mvmt)
A flat Ballade (c# minor section)
Fantasy in f minor (contrary motion octave section)

Hmm, I find the beginning and the main theme of the ballade more difficult than the c# part. With Chopin I have the feeling that most of the problems aren't technical like octaves, but more like getting perfect sound, getting it to sound interesting. That's why I don't start on his second ballade, because of the first part.

[invictious]

Any piece with 'Dedicated to George Sand0
because george sand was a man (hehehe) and chopin fell in love with 'him'

So ignoring the gayness in the pieces is the most difficult bit, when I close my eyes (i am synaesthetic) i see gayness! 

[allthumbs]

Any piece with 'Dedicated to George Sand0
because george sand was a man (hehehe) and chopin fell in love with 'him'

So ignoring the gayness in the pieces is the most difficult bit, when I close my eyes (i am synaesthetic) i see gayness! 

Actually, George Sand is the pseudonym of Madame Amandine Lucile Aurore Dudevant, a woman.

https://www.nndb.com/people/409/000103100/


Cheers

allthumbs

[matt haley]

  I think one would have to play the entire repertoire of  'Chopin' to tell you what is the hardest work in a pianists personal opinion.....

  when i first got deep into chopin i thought his heroic polonaise was one of the hardest pieces of music,but now ive matured over the years,i play it now with relative ease(the majority of it) and have discovered that there is so much more difficlut works out there...

 from listening to 25/6,it sounds terribly difficult but ive never attempted it..........

   so from what ive played(not to performance standard have it known), i still stand that the hardest work of chopin... is the B Minor Sonata

[orlandopiano]

Actually, George Sand is the pseudonym of Madame Amandine Lucile Aurore Dudevant, a woman.

You probably didn't get that invictious was being facetious. It's widely known that George Sand was a feminist, didn't like the unequal treatment accorded to women (hence her choosing the name George) and definitely wore the pants in that relationship (both figuratively and literally).

[franz_]

Fantasy in f minor (contrary motion octave section)

I don't believe it is SO hard. For sure his 3rd sonata, yes. Other pieces: 25/6, 4th ballade, 4th scherzo, 2nd pianoconcerto,...

[rapmasterb]

I'm surprised at the mention of the 4th movement of the b minor sonata. I know people who know it well but wouldnt dream of attempting the 4th ballade or the first scherzo. Also, the grand fantasia - piano and orchestra - is very difficult. (I'm of course talking technically here - let's not confuse the issue by injecting musicality into the equation.)

[matt haley]

I'm surprised at the mention of the 4th movement of the b minor sonata. I know people who know it well but wouldnt dream of attempting the 4th ballade or the first scherzo. Also, the grand fantasia - piano and orchestra - is very difficult. (I'm of course talking technically here - let's not confuse the issue by injecting musicality into the equation.)

 im curious..... why are you suprised
   
   M. Haley

[rapmasterb]

Because

I know people who know it well but wouldnt dream of attempting the 4th ballade or the first scherzo.

This has led me to believe that in comparison with some of his other works it is easy which, of course,  meant I was surprised to see it in a thread marked "most difficult chopin piece". Perhaps I'm wrong.

[matt haley]

because

  hah,sorry not with it today.......

    i personally find it far harder than bits ive played of the ballade,but i suppose its very subjective.....

   whats you personal opinion rapmasterb??

[franz_]

I'm surprised at the mention of the 4th movement of the b minor sonata. I know people who know it well but wouldnt dream of attempting the 4th ballade or the first scherzo. Also, the grand fantasia - piano and orchestra - is very difficult. (I'm of course talking technically here - let's not confuse the issue by injecting musicality into the equation.)

I play his first scherzo, and it really isn't that hard.

[rapmasterb]

I feel Ballade no. 4 is the hardest because if you think about it it encompasses the technique of about 8 of the études in one piece plus there's extra on top. (By the way, I also believe that if you included musicality in its difficulty rating it would be up in the stratosphere.)

[orlandopiano]

I play his first scherzo, and it really isn't that hard.

Agreed.

[matt haley]

  take no offence to them daft smiley faces...... i didn't even put them on...

     for some reason everytime i post a reply that unhappy face keeps tagging along   lol


           M. haley

[orlandopiano]

Fantasy in f minor (contrary motion octave section)

I don't believe it is SO hard.

I hear more pianists butcher this one section than probably any other section of any other Chopin piece out there.

[elias89]

first Scherzo isn't that tricky as it sounds (in my opinion).


What about: Grande Polonaise Brillante??

[allthumbs]

You probably didn't get that invictious was being facetious. It's widely known that George Sand was a feminist, didn't like the unequal treatment accorded to women (hence her choosing the name George) and definitely wore the pants in that relationship (both figuratively and literally).

Ah, it was late and my facetious alert was not working!

[franzliszt2]

4th ballade is very hard musically, and technically tricky. I havn't done the B minor so I can;t say it is harder than the ballade until i learn it, but the score looks a bit nasty.

Etudes are difficult depemnding on who you are, and what your techniue is like. I had no trouble with op25/6, my thirds have always been nice. However, op10 no.1, is a major problem

[Pumkinhead]

I've had several people tell me that the Polonaise-Fantasie takes just as much musicality and technical equipment as the Fourth Ballade and the Third Sonata. And yes, they've played all three. 

[matt haley]

  how about chopins prelude op28 no 7.........

        it took my about 3years to really crack this beast!!!!!!





   haha

[soliloquy]

easy: Don Juan Variations


Of his more common stuff, and referring to single pieces so Opp. 10, 25 and 28 as wholes are out, I'd say the Concerto No. 1, Sonata No. 3, Ballade No. 4 and Scherzo No. 4 are the hardest.  Allegro de Concert Op. 46 is extremely tough also.

[Waldszenen]

Off the top of my head, the hardest Chopin pieces for me are the Ballade No. 4, Sonata No. 3, Grande Polonaise Brillante and the Concerto No. 1.

[franz_]

  how about chopins prelude op28 no 7.........

        it took my about 3years to really crack this beast!!!!!!





   haha

Musicaly, it is very difficult yes.

[rapmasterb]

Musicaly, it is very difficult yes.

Good point. It is widely regarded (and my own experience suggests this also) that this piece is tough musically. You'd want to be at the top of your game to give a good performance of it. Balancing the chords in particualr is tricky, IMO.

[exigence]

Agreed.

Agreed^2 - but otoh, I still can't play it well. Work in progress. :x

[pianowelsh]

? Ballade 4, Scherzo 4, Grand poloniase op22, 2nd and 3rd sonatas are all extremely tough for formance. As for which one is THE most difficult - I would depend very much on the player. Some may say the tarentella eg. The coda of Ballade 4 is very hard and I ve heard 'the best' play it badly. Scherzo 4 is under played because of its length and difficulty. Grand Pol dosent let up with arabesques and runs and is by no means easy! both the 2nd and 3rd sonatas have extreme challenges in dexterity control and stamina, the tarentella is nippy and difficult to catch. Id be happy if I could tease a satisfactory performance out of any of them as with exception of Ballade 4 the notes are taxing enough for me at the moment.  In fairness I havent devoted months and months to each but the odd hour here and there.

[tyler_johnson]

I'm going to have to agree with you and say that the 1st scherzo is the hardest chopin piece i've heard/seen.

[kriskicksass]

As for the 1st Scherzo, it's not the easiest Scherzo as so many people will say (I'd say it's the second hardest, after the 4th), but it's by no means the hardest major concert work of Chopin. Actually, the fact that I put it after the 4th Scherzo is basically my point, since the 4th Scherzo isn't his hardest work either, as difficult as it may be.

[faj]

Sonata 2/ 3, PC1/2 . But don't know which one is the MOST.

[steveie986]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polonaise-Fantaisie

The Polonaise-Fantaisie is a fascinating piece. It's one of the few Chopin pieces that I can listen to again and again without exhausting it.

[quantum]

Variations Op.2 on "La ci darem"

[walking_encyclopedia]

Any piece with 'Dedicated to George Sand0
because george sand was a man (hehehe) and chopin fell in love with 'him'

So ignoring the gayness in the pieces is the most difficult bit, when I close my eyes (i am synaesthetic) i see gayness! 

lol.. you're so immature invictious

[steveie986]

lol.. you're so immature invictious

And insensitive and homophobic. He needs to be smashed upside the head.

/Because violence makes people more tolerant.

[gyzzzmo]

I think 4th ballade and 'finale' from sonate op 58.

gyzzzmo

[pianowelsh]

mmm! Yes the polonaise fantasy is one of Chopin's most elusive works and is certainly not easy.  Im studying it now - I dont know why i didnt include it in my little list above. Again its got some real technical difficulties but the fact is the same as the ballade 4 the technical problems are integrated to the music - you simply can separate them and that makes these pieces very hard to get right. in a purely virtuosic sense some of his early early works are probably the most difficult as he was still in essence a 'salon' composer. the big structures ie sonatas are obviously difficult though and one hears many BAD performances of them becasue people underestimate how difficult these works are not to play but to bring off.