Talk to me about Joplin...

[steve jones]

... please! 

I want to do some of his rags, and while most of them sound quite managable, Im unsure what is 'standard practice' for this type of music. Pedalling, rubato, touch etc?

Listening to some recordings, it seems that the pedalling is almost zero, and the rubato is very modest.

But never the less, I am new to this music, so if anyone could offer up their experience then I would be MOST grateful to them.

Many thanks!

Steve Jones

[netzow]

In my modarate experience with Joplin Rags I have found as you have observed that pedaling is best kept to a minamum. I attempt to play with a fairly light touch. Not so light that it is stacatto but light. The Best 'Standard practice' for this sort of music in my experience is getting a good grip on the left hand. When this is acheaved you can "run the left hand on auto pilot" so to speak and focus on the right hand. A lot of the rags are simpler than they look if you simplify all of the octaves into one note instead of two. (That meaning it is only a single note not that you only play one note) I hope this is helpful.

[steve jones]

Very helpful, thank you.

One more question...

Do you play this music with rhythmic 'swing'?

Or do you playing straight as it is written. I think Iv heard it played with swing, and to be honest it sounds way better that way imo.

SJ

[aaron_ginn]

... please! 

I want to do some of his rags, and while most of them sound quite managable, Im unsure what is 'standard practice' for this type of music. Pedalling, rubato, touch etc?

Listening to some recordings, it seems that the pedalling is almost zero, and the rubato is very modest.

But never the less, I am new to this music, so if anyone could offer up their experience then I would be MOST grateful to them.

Many thanks!

Steve Jones

I worked on the Maple Leaf Rag for several months last year because it sounded like it would be fun to play.  I'm able to play about 80% of it (I got bored with it and never finished learning the last section).  I'm a total beginner, but my advice is to stay away from this piece until you've mastered some of the simpler rags.  The MLR requires a very athletic LH.  In the Trio section, the LH is jumping back and forth nearly halfway across the keyboard in a couple places.

I don't use any pedal.  The syncopated rhythms in several places are actually easier to play HT than HS, so if you're having trouble figuring something out in one hand, start putting the other hand together with it and things will become clearer.

This guy plays what I consider to be an almost perfect rendition of the MLR.  You should aspire to this:

[invictious]

I have played Maple Leaf Rag, The Entertainer and another piece which I forgot.

For the Maple Leaf Rag, it's almost like an etude, your LH working non stop. The key here is control (well duh :p). You will find yourself practicing left hand more than your right hand, and more often, you'd find yourself trying to put your LH and RH together. The trio section is rather impressive, with a scary modulation, and LH jumping across the keyboard. I slow down when I reach that part, to emphasize the forte, and also because I can't play that section fast enough with the rest of the piece.
Also a thing to note, the way that it's in Ab flat major, when you play the piece, particularly secion B, you will realize there will be black keys popping up in 'weird' or 'unnatural' places, so it may make it more difficult to practice, especially staccato.

The Entertainer is slightly easier the MLR IMGO. There are still LH jumps, but nowhere near as dramatic as MLR. The syncopated rhythm, however is more emphasized in this piece. Not to mention the 3 note-octaved large right hand jumps in several places. I don't have much to say about this piece, it's all rather straightforward.

Remember, high class rags shouldn't be played fast, but it should be played energetically. Remember, faster doesn't mean more energetic.

Oh yes, I have also written on my score 'why not improvise?'

and I do so everytime I play it, adding a few rolls, changing the octaves, maybe a little swing, and so on.

Do it, it's fun.

Oh yes, have fun learning it, it's a great piece to learn and play.

[stormx]

I have been playing for 2 years, and can currently tackle pieces whose grade are 4/5.

I like the Scott Joplin rags (i have a CD whith 19 of them).
I know that the most popular ones (like MLR or the Entertainer) are above my current level.

I wonder whether there is any of them in the 4/5 range that i can try.

I beleive that learning something outside classical (but good music !!) will be refershing for me.

 

[aaron_ginn]

I have been playing for 2 years, and can currently tackle pieces whose grade are 4/5.

I like the Scott Joplin rags (i have a CD whith 19 of them).
I know that the most popular ones (like MLR or the Entertainer) are above my current level.

I wonder whether there is any of them in the 4/5 range that i can try.

I beleive that learning something outside classical (but good music !!) will be refershing for me.
 

I don't think they're above your level.  I've heard the MLR rates a 5/6.  It will probably take you several months to be able to play it at speed, but I suspect it's doable for you.

Listen, I've only been playing piano since last June, and I learned to play about 80% of it in around four months.  If I can do it anyone can!  I don't play it perfectly and I haven't learned the ending, but I can play it well enough to bring smiles to the faces of people who hear it, and it's still fun to whip out on occasion as a flamboyant showpiece.

I recorded myself playing this in November.  I made a few mistakes, but keep in mind that eight months ago I couldn't play a lick of piano.  If I can do this, I'll bet you can play it too.

Good Luck!

[netzow]

Very helpful, thank you.

One more question...

Do you play this music with rhythmic 'swing'?

Or do you playing straight as it is written. I think Iv heard it played with swing, and to be honest it sounds way better that way imo.

SJ

I play it with the rhythmic swing. It does sound better that way this music to me is just the kind of music you can't play strait.

I have been playing for 2 years, and can currently tackle pieces whose grade are 4/5.

I like the Scott Joplin rags (i have a CD whith 19 of them).
I know that the most popular ones (like MLR or the Entertainer) are above my current level.

I wonder whether there is any of them in the 4/5 range that i can try.

I beleive that learning something outside classical (but good music !!) will be refershing for me.

 

The first one I played which is easier  than the MLR was Bethena. not quite as rag ey if you know what I mean but a good one to build up to some of the other ones. I went from that one to the MLR fairly quickly. Also I learned Bethena only three or four months after learning fur elise which is  grade 4/5. Bethena is slower than most of the other ones but it gets you into the style of the music and is a great intro piece to Joplin's music imo.  Also as you say very refreshing stuff to practice after practicing classical stuff. Come to think of it I think i'll start Elite Syncopations.

[brahms4me]

In reference to playing Joplin with a swing rhythm:  I think you should be true to what he's written.  I seriously doubt if he intended for the pianist to 'swing' the rhythms, although I could be mistaken.  I've never heard it done, but I may be wrong.  At least, I wouldn't do it.

[netzow]

In reference to playing Joplin with a swing rhythm:  I think you should be true to what he's written.  I seriously doubt if he intended for the pianist to 'swing' the rhythms, although I could be mistaken.  I've never heard it done, but I may be wrong.  At least, I wouldn't do it.

Perhaps you should be true to what it written. However I happen to like the 'swing rhythm' better. I think it is ok if you don't let it control the piece. In other words moderation is the key imo. The other thing that people do which is not written it play faster than it is written. A lot of people (I am guilty of it as well) fly through these pieces even when some of them specifically say "Not fast". I guess what I am trying to say I think that some times this sort of thing can be allowed in artistic freedom. I try to control the speed as I do think that something as specific as "Not fast" should not be ignored. The swing thing however I think can be allowed under the artistic freedom idea as a style of playing as long as  you don't let it run away with the piece and don't make it too swingey. Almost as something that the average person doesn't notice when they listen to the piece but is there.

[stormx]

what does it mean to swing a piece?   

I suppose it is related to make it sound like swing, but i am unfamiliar with this kind of style.

[pianoannie]

Joplin's rags should not be played with swing-style eighth notes.  Of course how you play them for your own pleasure is up to you, but I just wanted to point out that swing is not considered correct for his pieces.  Personally I think it would sound awful,  but that's probably because I've listened to and played Joplin's pieces with straight 8ths for 30+ years.
Have fun!
pianoannie

PS Are you familiar with Sugar Cane Rag?  It's not as well-known as several of his others, but it's terrific!!

[ada]

I would really like to learn his Mexican Serenade, but I can't get my hands on the sheet music.

[ted]

Well here's how I play a couple of his, although I'm not sure my way is exemplary. I play much of Joplin, most of Scott and play and write quite a lot of contemporary ragtime. It is an infatuation I have had since my teens.

https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,9554.0.html

[ada]

I would really like to learn his Mexican Serenade, but I can't get my hands on the sheet music.

Now that the wonderful Ted has provided me with a copy, does anyone have any tips on playing this?

[netzow]

I must be a little confused. I wasn't referring to swinging the eight notes  or anything of that sort. I was talking about the general swing of the piece. Sorry if I mislead everyone.

P.S I want to learn The Mexican Serenade to, I love how it sounds, to me  it sounds almost like Chopin in parts.

[steve jones]

Hey, have you ever seen a Joplin rag and a Chopin Waltz in the same room together?

Lol, me neither!

Listen to Chopin Op34 No1, Op25 No9... Joplin must have used these types of pieces as the basis for his style.

SJ