Why I joined pianostreet in the first place!

[jpianoflorida]

You know I joined pianostreet hoping it would help me as a teacher from being isolated.   TOo much competition locally (teachers with attitudes) so I thought i would join and be able to share ideas.   It started out ok, but then I got caught up in all the debates, etc.  Then also, anytime you bring up a problem or concern about a student some posters would blast the way you teach.    Now we have someone REALLY blasting everything we do.   So I'm now questioning if it's even worth the effort to post on here.      Is it possible to get back to a helpful forum that would benefit everyone and not having many of us irritated at the responses we get from certain posters?    I really have enjoyed the insight i get from certain members(hope not to leave anyone out) such as amafang, hurst,bob, penguinlover,pianowolfi, key of c, and many others of course.    I wish all forumers would be as respectful as they are.    So now I must decide if I want to continue logging on or not.   

Happy New Year!
jay

[nilsjohan]

The first thing to do when comming accross posts that  is not as "respectful" as you would expect is to click the "report to moderator" link below the post.

[jpianoflorida]

thanks Nils! I think we are all tired of the poster that is promoting her product EVERYWHERE on your site!  It's gotten out of control!
 

[pianowolfi]

You know I joined pianostreet hoping it would help me as a teacher from being isolated.   TOo much competition locally (teachers with attitudes) so I thought i would join and be able to share ideas.   It started out ok, but then I got caught up in all the debates, etc.  Then also, anytime you bring up a problem or concern about a student some posters would blast the way you teach.    Now we have someone REALLY blasting everything we do.   So I'm now questioning if it's even worth the effort to post on here.      Is it possible to get back to a helpful forum that would benefit everyone and not having many of us irritated at the responses we get from certain posters?    I really have enjoyed the insight i get from certain members(hope not to leave anyone out) such as amafang, hurst,bob, penguinlover,key of c, and many others of course.    I wish all forumers would be as respectful as they are.    So now I must decide if I want to continue logging on or not.   

Happy New Year!
jay

Well jay, please stay. Not another sad story! Especially don't leave just because of one person.I t's not worth it. I also think I will later post again more about teaching. Just had to rest a bit about this subject. And I am currently more interested in posting recordings...

[jpianoflorida]

thanks pianowolfi!  you should have been on my "list'. i will correct that! lol

[pianistimo]

despite how things can get 'out of hand' - i think that there is much to learn from all the members.  i've learned that the youngest members (probably geniuses) can contribute so much.  for me, listening to younger people keeps 'up' on new ideas and techniques and thoughts.  and, what the students seem to want.

times do change.  i guess you have to gear lessons somewhat between 'old school ' (practice practice) - and 'new school'  (practice with much finer attention to 'fast track').  kids today simply don't have time to WASTE.  if a technique isn't getting a result (such as hanon over and over) then maybe it is time to say 'ok.  that was old school - we have lots of repertoire and newer exercises that are more to the point and faster results.

i am all for fast results.  i realized with my last teacher how much time i probably have wasted int he past from practice techniques and things that i worked.  now, it's about economizing.  and, having fun.  i'm to a point in my life that if i don't like a piece - i don't practice it.  used to be - when younger - i'd practice it anyway to give it the benefit of the doubt. 

this year i'd like to focus more on mental practice and 'conceptualizing.' 

[lenkaolenka]

You know I joined pianostreet hoping it would help me as a teacher from being isolated.   TOo much competition locally (teachers with attitudes) so I thought i would join and be able to share ideas.   It started out ok, but then I got caught up in all the debates, etc.  Then also, anytime you bring up a problem or concern about a student some posters would blast the way you teach.    Now we have someone REALLY blasting everything we do.   So I'm now questioning if it's even worth the effort to post on here.      Is it possible to get back to a helpful forum that would benefit everyone and not having many of us irritated at the responses we get from certain posters?    I really have enjoyed the insight i get from certain members(hope not to leave anyone out) such as amafang, hurst,bob, penguinlover,pianowolfi, key of c, and many others of course.    I wish all forumers would be as respectful as they are.    So now I must decide if I want to continue logging on or not.   

Happy New Year!
jay

Dear Jay,
I am very sorry to see how much upset are you!
You asked me to write about Soft Mozart. I did. You asked how much my training – I said 'it is free' . You asked me how much is it for teachers. I said IT IS FREE. You got upset again! Too expensive for you, I guess?
The bottom line here is: I made this program for you to bring you more students and more success. You are getting upset, because you think, it is threat to what you are currently doing.
When people created first tractors, farmers were so intimidated and threatened! They assumed, that bread, which is from wheat that was planted with help of machine, would smell gasoline. They were sabotaging tractors big time.
How silly it was, don't you think?
We created a 'tractor' for teaching music - that is all.
I try to be part of this group and participate in other topics, but I found the gap between planting seeds with tractor and without pretty huge.
To understand what I mean, we have to be at the same page. I was in your shoes and understand you, but you hadn't been in mine. This is where all the misunderstanding starts
Happy New Year!

[jpianoflorida]

anyone else want to respond to the "tractor" scenario before I give my opinion? anyone?

[lenkaolenka]

anyone else want to respond to the "tractor" scenario before I give my opinion? anyone?

Dear Jay,
How could you give ANY 'tractor' opinion if you
1. never learned about it
2. never teach with 'tractor' ?

I know, for example, Alfred and Teach Me Piano as well as Voetra as well as Suzuki, Yamaha, Bastien, Faber, Piano Wizard. I studdied them! And if I say: they are behind of Soft Mozart, I can explain exactly WHY.

You, on another hand, like a little baby, arguing without slightest idea, what are you talking about, eccusing me in many sins. If you are a good teacher, your job is to make lives of your students better and your work more effective and productive. Instead, you are wasting your time arguing about nothing.

[chocolatedog]

I bet there are a fair few people on here who are getting just that teensy bit tired of having Soft Mozart shoved down their throats at any given opportunity................

[counterpoint]

I bet too 

[jpianoflorida]

if I say anyting at all, she gets irrational and puts down everything I do, so I think I need to stop.  I don't need to waste my time defending anything at all!  She put me down when she first joined the site, I agreed to give her a second chance, and I tried to be civilized and listen to her "program", but now she's out of control again.     I'm done!  Now, if anyone else is getting tired of it, they should report it to the moderator. It's your decision!   

[debussy symbolism]

if I say anyting at all, she gets irrational and puts down everything I do, so I think I need to stop.  I don't need to waste my time defending anything at all!  She put me down when she first joined the site, I agreed to give her a second chance, and I tried to be civilized and listen to her "program", but now she's out of control again.     I'm done!  Now, if anyone else is getting tired of it, they should report it to the moderator. It's your decision!   

Greetings.

I find it surprising that anyone actually saves up the energy to actually get irritated on such a public forum. Take every insult and every put down with a grain of salt or just laugh with it. Try to join up two members that really seem to hate each other in life, and you will be pleased to know that there will probably be not a hint of insults and in fact, things will probably get better as you get to actually see the person that you were arguing with. Those that are the loudest on a forum are often the quietest in life.

[jpianoflorida]

Greetings.

I find it surprising that anyone actually saves up the energy to actually get irritated on such a public forum. Take every insult and every put down with a grain of salt or just laugh with it. Try to join up two members that really seem to hate each other in life, and you will be pleased to know that there will probably be not a hint of insults and in fact, things will probably get better as you get to actually see the person that you were arguing with. Those that are the loudest on a forum are often the quietest in life.

what you are missing debussy is that it's not a personality issue.  It's a "teacher" issue.  It's about business!   Since you aren't a teacher yet, you don't get where we are coming from(no offense).       Besides, I remember how upset you would get all the time about Nils.  remember?   
why did that bother you? why did you "save up the energy to actually get irritated on such a public forum"?

[debussy symbolism]

what you are missing debussy is that it's not a personality issue.  It's a "teacher" issue.  It's about business!   Since you aren't a teacher yet, you don't get where we are coming from(no offense).       Besides, I remember how upset you would get all the time about Nils.  remember?   
why did that bother you? why did you "save up the energy to actually get irritated on such a public forum"?

Well, you got me on the teacher part. Okay, I understand what you are talking about. Concerning me blaming Nils for the faults of PianoStreet, it was probably the most illogical and senseless thing I have done on any online place. Well, maybe not the most senseless, as I did endure a harsh banning from an online backgammon server for insulting others and claiming myself as "The undefeated and indestructable."

[brahms4me]

I think its safe to say that we all joined this forum to learn from each other and not to promote our own agenda.  I read many posts before I joined and then it was a long time before I began to post.  I knew that there was much knowledge in this forum and I was eager to begin a dialogue with all of you and maybe even offer some suggestions in other forums, as well. 

Disagreements are bound to happen and through a CIVIL discussion minds and attitudes may change - on both sides.  However, when someone comes into the forum with the purpose of constantly promoting a "new" way to look at things and then berates those of us who don't accept it, then it is no longer a civil discourse.  And to make matters worse, personal insults along with arrogance and condescension are hurled at the poster for daring to question or reject the ideas.  I personally find such posts distasteful, offensive and extremely rude.  And that is specifically what makes me angry:  the personal attacks.  The poster in question does not want to dialogue;  she is here to save us from ourselves.  She has called into question everything we've ever learned, how we've learned it and that we're continuing the cycle.  Besides insulting us she is insulting our own teachers and the methods they used to teach us.  In reading her bio I find she came from a musicially abusive childhood and now sees everything from that perspective.  She honestly believes we have suffered the same fate and are inflicting the same on our students.  One just has to read her countless articles to understand what I mean.  Well, I for one had a wonderful musical childhood and my teacher couldn't have been more patient and understanding.  I was encouraged by my parents to do the best I could and that my talent was from God - something to be cherished.  I never once felt the horrors that this poster encountered.  Granted, I didn't live under the Communist system where the word 'freedom' didn't exist and where I didn't have to constantly prove myself worthy.  I, and I'm sure many of you, came from wonderful and loving homes where unreachable expectations were never the guarantee of acceptance.

I have no intention of answering her inane questions or trying to figure out her irrational analogies for that would be a profound waste of time.  Its the same with piano or anything else in life:  when something just doesn't make sense and you've tried and tried to figure it out, its best to just let it go.  Trying to argue with someone like that will get me nowhere. 

I want to encourage all the piano teachers to keep doing the best for you and your students.  Only YOU know what your student needs and how to get them to respond.  We don't need gimmicks (stickers on the keyboard, expensive software, etc.) to give each young person the love and joy of music.  Your own love for music will be contagious and that young person will capture the vision.  Believe me, in 38 years of teaching I've seen it happen countless times!

[pianowolfi]

Great post Brahms!

[lenkaolenka]

I think its safe to say that we all joined this forum to learn from each other and not to promote our own agenda.  I read many posts before I joined and then it was a long time before I began to post.  I knew that there was much knowledge in this forum and I was eager to begin a dialogue with all of you and maybe even offer some suggestions in other forums, as well. 

Disagreements are bound to happen and through a CIVIL discussion minds and attitudes may change - on both sides.  However, when someone comes into the forum with the purpose of constantly promoting a "new" way to look at things and then berates those of us who don't accept it, then it is no longer a civil discourse.  And to make matters worse, personal insults along with arrogance and condescension are hurled at the poster for daring to question or reject the ideas.  I personally find such posts distasteful, offensive and extremely rude.  And that is specifically what makes me angry:  the personal attacks.  The poster in question does not want to dialogue;  she is here to save us from ourselves.  She has called into question everything we've ever learned, how we've learned it and that we're continuing the cycle.  Besides insulting us she is insulting our own teachers and the methods they used to teach us.  In reading her bio I find she came from a musicially abusive childhood and now sees everything from that perspective.  She honestly believes we have suffered the same fate and are inflicting the same on our students.  One just has to read her countless articles to understand what I mean.  Well, I for one had a wonderful musical childhood and my teacher couldn't have been more patient and understanding.  I was encouraged by my parents to do the best I could and that my talent was from God - something to be cherished.  I never once felt the horrors that this poster encountered.  Granted, I didn't live under the Communist system where the word 'freedom' didn't exist and where I didn't have to constantly prove myself worthy.  I, and I'm sure many of you, came from wonderful and loving homes where unreachable expectations were never the guarantee of acceptance.

I have no intention of answering her inane questions or trying to figure out her irrational analogies for that would be a profound waste of time.  Its the same with piano or anything else in life:  when something just doesn't make sense and you've tried and tried to figure it out, its best to just let it go.  Trying to argue with someone like that will get me nowhere. 

I want to encourage all the piano teachers to keep doing the best for you and your students.  Only YOU know what your student needs and how to get them to respond.  We don't need gimmicks (stickers on the keyboard, expensive software, etc.) to give each young person the love and joy of music.  Your own love for music will be contagious and that young person will capture the vision.  Believe me, in 38 years of teaching I've seen it happen countless times!

What you just wrote is extremely cruel, ugly,unhuman and extremely offensive.
You sould be ashamed of yourself. No excuse!

[debussy symbolism]

Greetings.

I am not in the possession of all the facts so please correct me if I am wrong. I agree with "brahms4me" on that raw love for music eminating from the teacher is far better than artificial commodities such as stickers and things like that to influence the student. This is just my opinion and I suppose that there are differences in teaching methods and different students react differently to different approaches, whether they are natural or artificial. I myself am much more inclined to feel the music and am much happier when I feel a certain way about a piece that my teacher feels. I hope this makes sense. In this case, I think it is wrong that teachers here should argue about methods.

[jpianoflorida]

Greetings.

I am not in the possession of all the facts so please correct me if I am wrong. I agree with "brahms4me" on that raw love for music eminating from the teacher is far better than artificial commodities such as stickers and things like that to influence the student. This is just my opinion and I suppose that there are differences in teaching methods and different students react differently to different approaches, whether they are natural or artificial. I myself am much more inclined to feel the music and am much happier when I feel a certain way about a piece that my teacher feels. I hope this makes sense. In this case, I think it is wrong that teachers here should argue about methods.

you are right debussy!  Teachers shouldn't argue about methods, they should SHARE ideas.   But we aren't arguing, we are having to defend because lenkaol continues to put every idea down except for her "soft mozart".      She is the GOD of piano apparantly, the way other teachers have been teaching forever is wrong.   I can't imagine how we learned to play the piano without her! can you?       bottom line, if she had come on here and SHARED and acted CONCERNED instead of being so ARROGANT, people may have listened.   Read her resposse to brahms, all about ARROGANCE.

[brahms4me]

hmmmmmmmm...... very interesting response Olenka . . . . .

[lenkaolenka]

you are right debussy!  Teachers shouldn't argue about methods, they should SHARE ideas. 

Exactly! What makes you think that your adapted ideas are better, then mine, which I developed after 17 years of the most strict music study and 30 years of research?

But we aren't arguing, we are having to defend because lenkaol continues to put every idea down except for her "soft mozart".   

Well, at least, I am arguing in a civil way. I say: 'it is not good, because' and explain, what's wrong. You are trying to get crowd on your side  and use abuse as main argument.

She is the GOD of piano apparantly, the way other teachers have been teaching forever is wrong. 

Let's put is this way: I am a musicologist, who developed outstanding system that have no analogy in the current educational practice today. And before you try and learn about this discovery, all your arguments are a waste of our time.

I can't imagine how we learned to play the piano without her! can you?

You don't even need to use your imagination – just look around. How many people around the glob actually use pianos?
     

bottom line, if she had come on here and SHARED and acted CONCERNED instead of being so ARROGANT, people may have listened.   Read her resposse to brahms, all about ARROGANCE

Shame on me! I should be beat with stones. Another good idea – witch hunting!

[lenkaolenka]

hmmmmmmmm...... very interesting response Olenka . . . . .

Dear brahms4me,
You have no idea, how similar your post to the traditional 'communist' approaches to deal with those who stick out! When I was teaching in music school in former Soviet Union, I got punished to be 'different' by our administration, who used exactly the same abuse as you just did!
No political system can make people independent – it is personal choice. Don't you see: I am more American then you are, because I don't need support of crowd to prove my point and I don't need to dig dirt on you to explain my ideas. And I am not afraid or intimidated by the fact, that there is 'community' of traditional teachers against me.  I am strong enough to stand for my ideas.
I learned a simple rule in life: I don't swim with a stream.  I don't swim against it. I swim, where I need to be.
 

[jpianoflorida]

you are irrational lenkaol.   there's not point discussing anything with you.

[lenkaolenka]

you are irrational lenkaol.   there's not point discussing anything with you.

Dear Jay,
As you already stated, we are here to SHARE our ideas and exchange some knowledge. But instead of doing that,  you have decided to SHARE your opinion about my humble and beautiful personality. I think, here is no point to argue, because I know myself better, then you do.
I would prefer to talk about Alfred method books and pianosuit.  Are you ready to discuss that or they are 'GODS' to you?

[jpianoflorida]

i'm not discussing anything else with you.    as many other posters will agree, it's pointless.

[lenkaolenka]

i'm not discussing anything else with you.    as many other posters will agree, it's pointless.

Oh, Jay... Can you speek for yourself without 'other posters' or you only feeling good when you are a part of something big?