Playing your octaves

[acha114]

I know different people have preferences on how they play octaves, e.g. 1-5 fingering only or a combination of 1-3, 1-4 and 1-5 fingering on certain keys. I would like to know how you play octaves and why you choose to play them that way. Are there any advantages or disadvantages to playing octaves with a chosen fingering?

For me, I always played my octaves with a 1-5 fingering, simply because it's what I've been taught and brought up with. Only recently when looking at scores and reading past discussion on the topic have I discovered using other fingering. I'm thinking of changing the way I play octaves, but only if it brings benefits. I can't imagine playing octaves with 1-3 fingering though.

Thoughts?

[desordre]

 Dear Acha:
 I think that octaves (or any parallel interval) are more about wrist than fingering. Anyway, I have big hands and feel confortable to play octaves with 1-3, 1-4 or 1-5. It's useless, but I can play with 1-2... 
 The question to myself is always what you have to do in the piece. So, the very most of the situations I manage with 1-5 to whites and 1-4 to blacks. Of course, there are points where another fingerings must be used, but I use very few 1-3 octaves.
 That's about me. In general, I think that the octaves are up to your hand: nothing is worst than stiffness. I don't see (or listen, for that matter) any problem with all 1-5 octaves when the articulation is clear, and the flow of the line is perfect. As far as I know, Chopin had small hands (probably one-octave span), and his music have lots of octaves, and he was know as a very very ...any multiplier you want... good pianist. So... 
 Best!

[desordre]

 PS: your thread made me think about fingering in general, and the fact that the piano allows someone to do whatever s/he wants to, if the musical result is good. In other instruments, you have lots of restrictions. For instance, the guitar (that I know a little better) have some problems with the sonority of each position (over the scale), of the right hand fingers (each one has a particular color), of the open strings. In the piano, there's nothing like this.
 When I was a begginer, I was taught that you should never use the thumbs on the black keys, that you should never "pass over", that you should never play two different keys with the same finger, etc. Someday I realized that all these was absolute non-sense, and - in my most humble opinion - now there are only two rules:
 1) whatever you want to do, it must sound the way you want (there's a joke, I can't remember details, of a well known pianist and/or composer that argued about how to play a given note he said: "with the nose". That's the idea.);
 2) there are some ways that are easier and/or "economical", and one must use them as far as possible. An example to me are the octaves: why playing with 1-3 (that in a long run cause me a bit of stiff) when the same result is obtained with 1-4/1-5, with no harm?

 Just some thoughts.

[johnc27]

I learned to play octaves with 1-5 fingering, but recently I've started to alternate with 1-4 (1-5 on white keys, 1-4 on black keys.) I've found this much more efficient than using 1-5 all of the time, especially in rapid chromatic scales (plus, it looks cooler  .)

[danny elfboy]

Many people who play octaves with 1-4 are able to do this only by deviating the ulna, that's it the thumb is parallel to the key while the pinky should be parallel instead

The pinky is the finger who is parallel to the radio hence the natural position playing is with the pinky parallel to the white key and the thunb NON-PARALLEL to the key playing hence on just the tip near the finger and not on the side

Ulnar deviation is a very uneffective way to play as it is totally unnatural to our anatomy since the weight bearing and trasmitting bone in the arm is the radio not the ulna
Only people who can easily reach a 11th can use 1-4 with octaves without deviating the ulna all the other others by playing octaves with 1-4 are injuring their tendons and muscles and not producing a vibrant sound

[molto-marcato]

One important thing has been neglected so far. Just with 1-5 you cannot do finger-legato, which is very important at some points. With a good use of 1-4, 1-5 and if possible 1-3 fingering you are able to play even fast octave runs legato.

[ramseytheii]

One important thing has been neglected so far. Just with 1-5 you cannot do finger-legato, which is very important at some points. With a good use of 1-4, 1-5 and if possible 1-3 fingering you are able to play even fast octave runs legato.

That's right, and in the Busoni Bach transcriptions, he often has "veloce" octave scales marked with very specific fingering.  For instance two or three passages in the D major Prelude & Fugue.  In this way, you don't feel like you are hammering away at 8 octaves in a row, and you create a different kind of effect then the Lisztian martellato octaves.

Walter Ramsey

[steve jones]

Unless otherwise stated, I usually go for the old 1-5 / 1-4 fingering. I know that the 1-3 is useful for legato octaves, but beings as my legato octaves suck ultimately, I tend to just use the fingers provided in those situations!

Imo, more important than the fingering is the hand position. Some people play octaves with their fingers on the the edges of the keys. While this can be more comfortable, I find it makes both legato and speed playing vastly more difficult, due to the greater distance between black and white keys.

This is the main reason I prefer to play octaves right up by the black keys. It is more of a stetch for the hand, but you do totally get used to it. I cant imagine trying to play octaves another other way now.

SJ