good book for "beginner"

[danny elfboy]

I know this piano student who has been really rushed to the 8th grade he's right now
In other words his teachers promised to bring him quickly to a good level without all the intermediares passages. So he indeed reached 8th grade in just two years but not because the "beginner foundations" have been condensed or explained quickly ... but because he has never been taught or explained them

In other words they took this boy that was at very beginner level (not even able to play the easiest pieces of Bach) and put in front of him a Scarlatti sonata
It worked good in that he panicked at the beginning, then started asking question about each bar and praticing very small section in a large amount of time
And it worked I'm not denying it he can really play 8th + grade pieces after just two years starting as less than a beginner. The problem is that he lacks foundations and I see this backfiring him very soon. He lacks foundation on speed, rhythm, dynamic ... in fact while he can play very advanced piece I'm pretty sure he would struggle with beginner stuff that focus on the mastery of a particular technique or principle

What books are there that he can quickly work on to regain all the piano foundations he has been negleted?
I thought of the Piano Handbook by Carl Humphries ... but not sure that's what he needs. He need something that explain, refer and train the basic foundations of playing that he lacks.

Any suggestion?

[elspeth]

What he needs isn't a book, it's a good teacher! I don't think 'negligent' would be too strong a word for the teachers' treatment of this student - no responsible teacher would ever put a student in that position.

[danny elfboy]

What he needs isn't a book, it's a good teacher! I don't think 'negligent' would be too strong a word for the teachers' treatment of this student - no responsible teacher would ever put a student in that position.

It's too late for that
He's expected to follow the course of the studies including exams and lessons
He can't afford another teacher teaching him the basis he's been missing and has no intention of abandoning the school
I have also not mentioned that he did this because he was already a bit old and was preparing to be accepted in a school were there's an age limit
He is in now thanks to this "fast paced approach"
If he leaves to go back to the basics he won't never be admitted again in the school

I think that at this point whith his level of technique he can quickly get the basics he's mussing from a book or video rather than a teacher.

[elspeth]

Good luck to you if this is really the approach you want to take. But a book is never, ever a replacement for a good, responsible teacher. If you're lacking this much background there is no one book out there that's going to teach it to you.

[danny elfboy]

Good luck to you if this is really the approach you want to take. But a book is never, ever a replacement for a good, responsible teacher. If you're lacking this much background there is no one book out there that's going to teach it to you.

Well, it's not my choice ... I'm not his teacher and I have the basis to teach him but don't have the time at the moment. I don't think a book is always a bad idea ... how do we explain the dozens of musician and composers of the past that were totally self-taught and never consulted a teacher in their life?

[elspeth]

Point about the majority of them is, they were self-taught and turned out just fine, but also spent a lifetime becoming so and didn't expect to be able to go study sucessfully at a good music school which has a young age limit without having the relevant training...

I apologise if I sound harsh, I've just realised how short my tone was above! But, coming from a family of academics, this touches a nerve about bad scholarship... this poor person's been badly taught and now is expecting to be able to go to (by the sound of it) a good music school and just get the guidance he should have had from his tutors from a book. It just doesn't work like that. Intermediate stages of learning are there for a reason - to build experience and knowledge at the same time as repertoire - and you skip that at your own peril. Unfortunately I agree with you above - unless he's a phenomenal talent, I think this is misguided and will backfire on him. I certainly understand about the economics of extra music teachers... but if that's the case, no matter how good the school he's going to is, I wonder if it's really a suitable choice for him - because he's not ready for it.

[danny elfboy]

Point about the majority of them is, they were self-taught and turned out just fine, but also spent a lifetime becoming so and didn't expect to be able to go study sucessfully at a good music school which has a young age limit without having the relevant training...

I apologise if I sound harsh, I've just realised how short my tone was above! But, coming from a family of academics, this touches a nerve about bad scholarship... this poor person's been badly taught and now is expecting to be able to go to (by the sound of it) a good music school and just get the guidance he should have had from his tutors from a book. It just doesn't work like that. Intermediate stages of learning are there for a reason - to build experience and knowledge at the same time as repertoire - and you skip that at your own peril. Unfortunately I agree with you above - unless he's a phenomenal talent, I think this is misguided and will backfire on him. I certainly understand about the economics of extra music teachers... but if that's the case, no matter how good the school he's going to is, I wonder if it's really a suitable choice for him - because he's not ready for it.

Thanks for your reply
I would normally agree with you ... but the point is that I've seen him playing and he has both talent and technique which means that he has been good enough to be majorly effected by the lack of basis. What I think the lack of basis is doing to him is making it harder and longer to master a piece, but one he masters them he does sound like someone that should be admitted to such a school (not to mention his devotion)

He needs to get back at the basics on how to analyze a piece in order to master it, how to grasp rhythm and tonality quickly. But the lack of basics is just influencing him in his practice not in his playing or musicality. That's why I think that given that he's a level at which basics are interiorized and absorble quickly (like a 6th degree students attempting to do the homeworks of a 1th degree students) maybe even an impersonal source as a book can provide him the information he needs
I'm not looking for the perfect solution just one good enough as I'm not going saying him a a friend and a conservatory student that he better give up

[Bob]

From reading the first post....

The student might go through an entire beginner book series.  Just buy them all and plow through that.

I ran across a set of theory books by ReSa -- that's the publisher.  It's theory geared toward the piano student, not just plain theory.

[danny elfboy]

From reading the first post....

The student might go through an entire beginner book series.  Just buy them all and plow through that.

I ran across a set of theory books by ReSa -- that's the publisher.  It's theory geared toward the piano student, not just plain theory.

Thanks
I can't find ReSa publisher on the web
Can you tell me where I can buy those books?

[Bob]

ReSa publications

I think it's a husband/wife team, Craig Rees and Vivian Sadler... Re Sa... ReSa.

Levels 1-6.   "Concepts of Piano Theory"

There's a teacher key and a level about modes too I think.


Pepper has it.  I searched for "ReSa" and found it.  They list 7 levels.  I bet level 7 is modes or the teacher key.

https://jwpepper.com/catalog/lsearch

Pepper gave me this title info from their site...
CONCEPTS OF PIANO THEORY
REES / SADLER
RESA PUB

Qty  Number  Description  Grade  Price 
   5232616  Level 1   
    $5.95 
   5232624  Level 2   
    $5.95 
   5232632  Level 3   
    $5.95 
   5232640  Level 4   
    $5.95 
   5232657  Level 5   
    $5.95 
   5232665  Level 6   
    $5.95 
   5232673  Level 7   
 A    $6.95 

[Bob]

Here's another link from the pepper site.

https://www.pattimusic.com/catalog/p44-48.pdf

That lists theory materials, including ReSa.