Taubman Method

[keyofc]

How many people have learned the Taubman method?
How long did it take for you to "get it"?

[pianowelsh]

Perhaps we could start by clarifying what actually IS the Taubman method...its main goals and some of its solutions???
here is a start:https://members.accessbee.com/ecwinkler/taubman.htm

[keyofc]

Piaowelsh,
Thanks for your reply - but I can't get the link to work for me.
Is any character missing perchance?

The Taubman method is something I know to an extent.    It is hard to define in a few words and since I haven't mastered it yet - probably harder for me.

I think my best definition would be that it's a method that has studied anthropolgy (how the body is made) what movements are healthy, which ones are not - and also which movements are the best for efficiency of movement and (movements that put the least amount of pressure on the arms, hands) and how they affect the sound.

It might sound complicated - it sort of is when you know the piano and you start learning it a new way. 

It has really helped me - but I wish I could get it all faster.

[thalberg]

I heard the Taubman method teaches total relaxation, even to the point of not being able to depress the key because you're so relaxed.  For this reason, I question its effectiveness.

[dinosaurtales]

Thalberg is definitely correct in his observations!  That's what I am noticing here at my school - those techniques are being taught at the EXPENSE of other technique.  There is a teacher here who is a Taubman teacher - it is more than relaxation - my understanding is its techniques are geared to retraining injured pianists, who probably won't be able to play certain techniques due to the way they are taught.  At least this is apparent here.  I was wondering, amongst Taubman folks, if there is a list of literature specifically designed to AVOID certain techniques (such as finger switching, walking octaves, and other finger-legato techniques), because I think that's what's being taught here even amongst MM students.  i simply don't see many of those techniques being applied, which is making me think the literature is being "strategically" chosen  to avoid those things.  Anybody know about this?

[keyofc]

It doesn't seem like Taubman literature exists - at least, that I know of!

Although this is a good technique for the injured pianist -it's also a good technique for the UNinjured pianist - so they don't end up in the former group.

If you just take a few Taubman lessons - I know it can seem like they want you to relax at the expense of everything else - but as you get into it - you will find that is not the case at all.
Relaxation is stressed a lot - and then the other techniques are used.

If you ever hear someone that has learned the" Taubman" way - and done it for years - you will notice an impressive difference in them and someone else who is very good.
The music is clearer - and really sparkles - I think it's amazing.

It takes time, - I know a lady who was a concert pianist before she knew the Taubman method.  She learned the Taubman method after that - and can now diagnose any person's problem in playing to help them improve.

I took it with someone for two years - and improved a lot - but still am not where I want to be with it.

[dinosaurtales]

Hm..Then by that logic there would be a whole host of famous concert piansts that learned via Taubman.  I would be surprise if a very large list existed.  From what I have been observng of the students here, the "relaxation" and vertical motions would actually prevent  a lot of tehcniques from even being possible, such as finger switching, walking octaves, fast leaps, etc.  There's just too much fluffy motion in betweenote ns to do things. 

[keyofc]

I don't get your point here.  By what logic are you referring to anyway?  I am telling you of one person and how they increased their performance by the Taubman method -and all you have to say is it's fluff.  I did not say that all concert pianists need to know the method.


What is wrong with this forum lately?  It seems impossible to have a conversation in here lately.
Posts: 1134


  Re: Taubman Method
« Reply #6 on: Today at 07:41:11 AM »   

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Hm..Then by that logic there would be a whole host of famous concert piansts that learned via Taubman.  I would be surprise if a very large list existed.  From what I have been observng of the students here, the "relaxation" and vertical motions would actually prevent  a lot of tehcniques from even being possible, such as finger switching, walking octaves, fast leaps, etc.  There's just too much fluffy motion in betweenote ns to do things.   
 

[dinosaurtales]

I apologize.  I apparently worded that badly.  All I was trying to say is that my understanding is that the tehcniques are designed to keep an already-injured player from getting worse, NOT to take an UNinjured pianist and make them better. 

The "ergo" of the above statement would be that you could never use the Taubman method to develop "pianists" - it looks like a different discipline to me.

I am just trying to get folks who know about Dorothy Taubman's philosophy to either confirm or correct my understanding.

That's all.

[keyofc]

thanks, dino - I think I understand what you mean.

[richy321]

I only started lessons in the Taubman method a few weeks ago, so I'm no expert, but I do want to correct a few erroneous ideas expressed above:

1.  In the Taubman tapes and lessons there is no stress on relaxation; in fact, the word is specifically avoided.  Instead, the concept used is "resting down", meaning a gentle, restful placement on the key surface or keybed.  What is stressed is the avoidance of antagonistic contractions, or tension, which is very different from relaxation.

2.  There is no attempt to avoid repertory which requires movements or techniques which are frowned on in the Taubman approach.  The most varied and difficult examples from the repertory are used in the tapes.  I see no sign of avoidance or selection to fit the method.  In fact, it is inconceivable that it would be necessary.

3.  The method does not appear to be designed especially for injured pianists, or to treat existing injuries.  It is a general methodology for the highest possible level of playing.

Well, I'm off for my lesson, but I wanted to clear up some obvious misinformation.

Rich Y

 

[iumonito]

On one side you have Ortmann.  In the other you have Breihaupt, Matthay, Taubman and Golandsky.

It is a myth that the focus is in relaxation to the point of missing notes or not being able to play.  The focus is on music making, ease of performance and simplification of movement, all for music sake.

The literature is extensive, but the right place where to begin is with a series of videos that exemplify all sorts of concepts.

https://www.taubman-institute.com/html/home.html
https://www.golandskyinstitute.org/
https://www.balancedpianist.com/bptaubman.htm

[keyofc]

iumonito,
Thanks so much for those links - I think that the Balanced Pianist.com website
is the best I've seen,  It makes Taubman approach a lot more user -friendly.
The other sites I've seen mainly present the videos, but give no additional info.
THanks again!

[thalberg]

I heard the Taubman method teaches total relaxation, even to the point of not being able to depress the key because you're so relaxed.  For this reason, I question its effectiveness.

Just to clarify--this was supposed to be funny.  Someone so relaxed they can't depress a key.  Eh, I don't think anyone shares my sense of humor.

[dnephi]

Just to clarify--this was supposed to be funny. Someone so relaxed they can't depress a key. Eh, I don't think anyone shares my sense of humor.

It was funny, but I had taken it as serious and therefore did not question your assessment.