The Big Brother N-Bomb Debacle

[opus10no2]

The word 'n****r' was used in a CG context , just randomly, and that housemate was expelled.

Insane?

It's all about context and intent, and without meaning offense, I don't see how offense can be taken, from a word which has been used enough to have the meaning changed.

[thalbergmad]

If it had happened in any other Country apart from England, it probably would not have been a problem.

The politically correct morons who run this country, have made it almost an imprisonable offence to utter a word that might upset anyone from a minority, whilst the Union Jack can be burnt in broad daylight, and nothing is done. In the same vein, if a racist remark was made against a white person, it probably would have gone un-noticed.

My own opinion is that is was done with full knowledge of Channel 4 in order to keep the ratings up.

Thal

[opus10no2]

The counter argument would be that the word has a more long-standing history, and connotations connected with the slavery and harshness of the past, which is still a part of some extreme cultures today.

I'm all for freedom of speech, and I think a person should have the right to be offensive if that it their intent, I don't see how censoring and mystifying the word can do anything but strengthen it's impact, which many others , especially in black culture, have attempted to completely oppose and redefine.

That isn't the point of this though, it brings up the issue of context, intend, and more specifically - the difference between what we mean and what people think we mean.
It's all about culture, the word is thrown about as a cool slang for 'friend' in schools in my area.


Further reading -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/black person , https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/***

[thalbergmad]

It's all about culture, the word is thrown about as a cool slang for 'friend' in schools in my area.

Indeed, and perhaps the only person who knows exactly how it was intended was the person who spoke it.

I hope there are not too many people who would still relate it to the slave trade, which some of our imbecile politicians were apologising for only recently.

This is yet another example of political correctness gone mad, which in England we have a thousand examples of.

Again, if it was an anti white or anti christian word, i say nothing would have come of it.

Thal

[rach n bach]

Ditto to thal... 'cept in my case it is the US... political correctness is worth hundreds of millions in lawsuits each and every year... it's pathetic.

[ronde_des_sylphes]

I'm all for freedom of speech

Likewise.

However, it seems some people in this country are quite happy to "agree", but only if you say what is deemed "inoffensive", thereby rather misunderstanding the nature of free speech. Apparently it is a criminal offence to wear a teeshirt with the slogan "B*ll*cks to Blair" on it. I have no idea why.

[opus10no2]

Regarding my personal use of the word, I use it in a friendly context, as part of wigga culture, and as a symbolic word for brotherhood.

If I know a person is hurt by the word, I wont use it, and I wouldn't use it in an environment with many people - people who I don't know the dispositions of.

Saying the word on TV is an interesting area, because the word can be directed in any way, but if there are people who are hurt and offended by the word regardless of context, should it be censored?

The word wasn't censored from the show, but I personally think the banishment was ridiculous and harsh.

[thalbergmad]

Apparently it is a criminal offence to wear a teeshirt with the slogan "B*ll*cks to Blair" on it. I have no idea why.

But not an offence to walk around Central London with a large sign saying "death to all infidels".

Say anything against gays or Muslims and the police will be knocking at your door in minutes.

Welcome to England.

Thal

[thalbergmad]

Saying the word on TV is an interesting area, because the word can be directed in any way, but if there are people who are hurt and offended by the word regardless of context, should it be censored?

The word was also censored from the film "The Dam Busters" when it was shown on television.

One of the pilots dog was called n....r.

How absurd.

Thal

[ronde_des_sylphes]

But not an offence to walk around Central London with a large sign saying "death to all infidels".

Say anything against gays or Muslims and the police will be knocking at your door in minutes.

Welcome to England.

Thal

I'm glad to say that I don't think Scotland is as bad (yet). But, yes, I know what you mean, and the double standard appalls me. As for the editing of "Baa Baa Black Sheep" on the grounds of allegedly causing offence, words fail me.

[thalbergmad]

I'm glad to say that I don't think Scotland is as bad (yet).

And lets us hope it never is.

In England, a shop owner was arrested by the police for selling golliwogs.

Thal

[ronde_des_sylphes]

In England, a shop owner was arrested by the police for selling golliwogs.

Thal

I believe it. I expect shops and pubs to get prosecuted for selling faggots next.

For clarity, that's a foodstuff 

[thalbergmad]

This is another excellent thread by opus10no2.

The reasons behind what might appear to be a trivial event are extremely important.

Thal

[opus10no2]

haha I'm actually a fan of the show, and this controversy comes off the back of celebrity big brother 2007 where some remarks were made which caused offense.

The thing was, Jade was generally an ignorant and unintelligent person, and she used racial slurs as part of an argument. Thing is, it is blatantly evident she wasn't racist, just that she used certain words and phrases as ammunition.
This offended many people.

I do wonder why though, I was more concerned with the general isolation and abuse than with the words she chose to use.
The public latched onto the race aspect, and it became a HUGE issue.

Anyway, it's evident channel 4 expelled her because they wanted to be strict and show that racism will not be tolerated.
I AGREE, but the phrase and context she used was in no way racist in intent.

So this is the grey area of perception and intent.

I'm equally upset about the loss of shots like this -

I'm sure you are too thal, quality telly.

[opus10no2]

The reasons behind what might appear to be a trivial event are extremely important.

The sad thing is that this one particular person will forever live in regret for saying this one word, the public associate her with using this one word, and that must be terrible for her.

This was an official statement -

"She understands why her involvement in Big Brother has had to come to an end and she very much regrets what she said.

"The word black person is clearly racially offensive and there was no justification for its use.

"We have removed Emily from the house to once again make it clear to all housemates and the viewers at home that such behaviour won't be tolerated."

In a statement, the Commission for Racial Equality said: "We're relieved that Channel 4 has acted quickly.

"This incident will show everyone that racism must never be tolerated in any way, shape or form."

----

A couple problems I have with this -

Racial equality would imply that use of the word 'cracker' 'whitey' or 'honkey' etc. would have resulted in the same action - which I doubt.

Another is that this remark, in context, wasn't racist.

I think there is REAL reason and cause for racism in this world.

I DON'T think punishing racism makes any difference other than to confuse and to teach people something is wrong because 'people say so, it just is'.

It shouldn't be hidden away, it should be confronted - especially if founded on ignorance.


Speaking for myself, as a person who has been said to have caused offense a few times on this forum, I am very interested in the idea of unintended offense.

By definition, if I offend someone without intending to do so, I have violated their moral principles.
Now, this implies I have differing moral principles and would be offended by things which violate my moral principles.
Which I do...but I am offended by much less than others seem to be, so I have to live with the frustration of this, and with the consequence of being censored sometimes.

[thalbergmad]

Racial equality would imply that use of the word 'cracker' 'whitey' or 'honkey' etc. would have resulted in the same action - which I doubt.

It would not have even been noticed.

Racism against whites doesn't appear to be recognised in this Country. A few months back a National Newspaper published 2 accounts of racist attacks that resulted in death. One was a group of black people attacking a white person and the other a group of white people attacking a black person. Guess which one made the front page and which one got 11 lines on page 26.

So much for equality.

I am amazed President Bliar has not jumped on the bandwagon.

Thal