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Topic: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak  (Read 2864 times)

Offline infectedmushroom

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My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
on: September 20, 2007, 05:30:28 PM
Like the topic title says.


These two fingers are really weak, unfortunately. I was wondering if there are some good practise methods to get them stronger? Are there any good recommendations for training them?

Thanks in advance!

Offline counterpoint

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #1 on: September 20, 2007, 06:27:14 PM
What piece do you want to play?
Everyone's 4th and 5th fingers are weak. That should not be a problem.
If it doesn't work - try something different!

Offline ilikepie

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #2 on: September 20, 2007, 06:34:13 PM
op10 no.2 randomly..
That's the price you pay for being moderate in everything.  See, if I were you, my name would be Ilovepie.  But that's just me.

Offline dnephi

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #3 on: September 20, 2007, 06:48:40 PM
FF, Op. 10 No.2, Rachmaninoff Prelude in e-flat minor, Etude Tableau Op. 39 No. 3, Mendelssohn-Rachmaninoff Scherzo from a Midsummer Night's Dream.

That should keep you occupied for a year.
For us musicians, the music of Beethoven is the pillar of fire and cloud of mist which guided the Israelites through the desert.  (Roughly quoted, Franz Liszt.)

Offline imbetter

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #4 on: September 20, 2007, 08:49:07 PM
FF, Op. 10 No.2, Rachmaninoff Prelude in e-flat minor, Etude Tableau Op. 39 No. 3, Mendelssohn-Rachmaninoff Scherzo from a Midsummer Night's Dream.

That should keep you occupied for a year.


lol
"My advice to young musicians: Quit music! There is no choice. It has to be a calling, and even if it is and you think there's a choice, there is no choice"-Vladimir Feltsman

Offline rc

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #5 on: September 22, 2007, 02:16:06 AM
What helped me was playing pieces with chords in the RH, where the melody is on the top (4th and 5th fingers) and you don't want it overpowered by the harmony (the strong fingers).

It feels like I'm shifting the balance in my hand towards the weaker fingers.  They get more force and can handle it just fine.

You could invent your own exercises playing chords emphasizing the outer fingers.

If speed an coordination is the issue, ornamentation in Bach could help.  Often a trill or mordent happens to be best reached with the weak fingers, which is good exercise.

Offline thalberg

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #6 on: September 22, 2007, 02:51:54 AM

Offline ilikepie

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #7 on: September 22, 2007, 04:42:39 AM
www.fingerweights.com

JUST KIDDING!
They seem interesting enough; you think they'd work?? hahahaha
That's the price you pay for being moderate in everything.  See, if I were you, my name would be Ilovepie.  But that's just me.

Offline jinfiesto

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #8 on: September 22, 2007, 05:24:27 AM
The Mendelssohn songs without words will fix your problem. Don't do the weights. That's how schumann busted his hand.

Offline m

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #9 on: September 22, 2007, 05:39:26 AM
FF, Op. 10 No.2, Rachmaninoff Prelude in e-flat minor, Etude Tableau Op. 39 No. 3, Mendelssohn-Rachmaninoff Scherzo from a Midsummer Night's Dream.

That should keep you occupied for a year.

 :)
Mendelssohn-Rachmaninov alone is a life time project. I believe it is a harder piece than either FF or Op.10/2. In any case, I have been working on all of those for about 20+ years and still did not dare to play in public... well maybe Scherzo this season... as an encore.

Offline dnephi

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #10 on: September 22, 2007, 12:37:23 PM
:)
Mendelssohn-Rachmaninov alone is a life time project. I believe it is a harder piece than either FF or Op.10/2. In any case, I have been working on all of those for about 20+ years and still did not dare to play in public... well maybe Scherzo this season... as an encore.

I'll trust you on that.  It's enormously difficult for an encore, though.
For us musicians, the music of Beethoven is the pillar of fire and cloud of mist which guided the Israelites through the desert.  (Roughly quoted, Franz Liszt.)

Offline cmg

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #11 on: September 22, 2007, 02:39:48 PM
What helped me was playing pieces with chords in the RH, where the melody is on the top (4th and 5th fingers) and you don't want it overpowered by the harmony (the strong fingers).

It feels like I'm shifting the balance in my hand towards the weaker fingers.  They get more force and can handle it just fine.

You could invent your own exercises playing chords emphasizing the outer fingers.

If speed an coordination is the issue, ornamentation in Bach could help.  Often a trill or mordent happens to be best reached with the weak fingers, which is good exercise.

Great advice.  Chordal work where you need to bring out soprano voice should do the trick.  Also, if you're up to it, Chopin Op. 25/12 and op. 10/1.  You want to strenghten the "arch" in your hand. 

Avoid, for now, the Mendelssohn-Rachmaninov.  That's Marik territory.  Big boy stuff.  ;D 
Current repertoire:  "Come to Jesus" (in whole-notes)

Offline ramseytheii

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #12 on: September 22, 2007, 04:05:23 PM
If thy ring finger and pinkie finger offend thee, cut them off.

Walter Ramsey


Offline cmg

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #13 on: September 22, 2007, 04:22:30 PM
If thy ring finger and pinkie finger offend thee, cut them off.

Walter Ramsey




A digit for a digit
Current repertoire:  "Come to Jesus" (in whole-notes)

Offline ramseytheii

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #14 on: September 22, 2007, 04:57:06 PM
A digit for a digit

Well, why not?  Tere's too many piano players in the world to begin with  :D

Walter Ramsey


Offline rc

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #15 on: September 23, 2007, 09:45:40 PM
NO! Then they might start singing!

Maybe an enforced piano-license?

"excuse me, that sounded horrible just now.  Let's see your license and registration"

Offline pianochick93

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #16 on: September 24, 2007, 09:13:29 AM
Ah, but then what would happen to young, beginning pianists who are just learning to play? They would be aksed for a liscence but they aren't good enough to get one!

Mind you, I think my younger sister should have a liscence, she is just learning to play, and she's horrible!

and I have to teach her how to play as well.
h lp! S m b dy  st l   ll th  v w ls  fr m  my  k y b  rd!

I am an imagine of your figmentation.

Offline nyonyo

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #17 on: September 24, 2007, 06:17:44 PM
op10 no.2 randomly..

I assume that the question must have come from a person who just learn how to play piano. Therefore, Hanon is a more appropriate suggestion. Op10#2 is a good one, but not for a beginner.

As you know, you can measure an area by using calculus but using a formula is more practical approach for those who just learn geometry.

RS

Offline ilikepie

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #18 on: September 24, 2007, 06:36:58 PM
I assume that the question must have come from a person who just learn how to play piano. Therefore, Hanon is a more appropriate suggestion. Op10#2 is a good one, but not for a beginner.

As you know, you can measure an area by using calculus but using a formula is more practical approach for those who just learn geometry.

RS
That's true I guess, but where in the post does the OP point out that he/she's just learning how to play? I didn't bother making any assumptions because I was probably half drunk at that time.
That's the price you pay for being moderate in everything.  See, if I were you, my name would be Ilovepie.  But that's just me.

Offline dnephi

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #19 on: September 24, 2007, 08:04:02 PM
Best way is to skip 1-variable calculus and do 3-d vector calculus to solve it.
For us musicians, the music of Beethoven is the pillar of fire and cloud of mist which guided the Israelites through the desert.  (Roughly quoted, Franz Liszt.)

Offline dnephi

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #20 on: September 25, 2007, 10:59:07 PM
How about the Schumann Toccata, Op. 7?
For us musicians, the music of Beethoven is the pillar of fire and cloud of mist which guided the Israelites through the desert.  (Roughly quoted, Franz Liszt.)

Offline iumonito

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #21 on: September 26, 2007, 10:05:42 PM
Wow, you got some mixed approaches here.

Here is my humble 2-cent concept: don't ask your fingers to do a job that your arm should be doing.  If you play with your 4th or 5th finger directly with the support of the arm behind them, of course they are not weak on the slightest.  All they have to do is be a conduit to the arm.  Either be a minimal fore-arm rotation or some other movement from the arm, the finger is doing minimal movement itself, and at that range of motion speed is the name of the game.  If you need power, it has to come with the arm.

Don't make the fingers equal, but do give them equal support.
Money does not make happiness, but it can buy you a piano.  :)

Offline ramseytheii

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #22 on: September 27, 2007, 01:25:14 AM
Wow, you got some mixed approaches here.

Here is my humble 2-cent concept: don't ask your fingers to do a job that your arm should be doing.  If you play with your 4th or 5th finger directly with the support of the arm behind them, of course they are not weak on the slightest.  All they have to do is be a conduit to the arm.  Either be a minimal fore-arm rotation or some other movement from the arm, the finger is doing minimal movement itself, and at that range of motion speed is the name of the game.  If you need power, it has to come with the arm.

Don't make the fingers equal, but do give them equal support.

Bravo!  Much better than my answer.

Walter Ramsey


Offline 981005

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #23 on: July 19, 2013, 01:12:23 PM
 ::)
Like the topic title says.


These two fingers are really weak, unfortunately. I was wondering if there are some good practise methods to get them stronger? Are there any good recommendations for training them?

Thanks in advance!

Offline patrickd

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #24 on: July 19, 2013, 03:35:18 PM
The first few technical exercises by Liszt.

Offline dima_76557

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #25 on: July 19, 2013, 06:44:46 PM
The first few technical exercises by Liszt.

That is: if you focus on nerve command over the fingers, not on muscle training. Generally, "weighing" the key (= feeling its resistance and gently pressing through it, diagonally forward) and thus producing a well-controlled pianissimo sound with the fingers will make them much "stronger" than striking the key hard with brute strength. :)
This should be done very, very slowly. It's very taxing for the nervous system by the way.
No amount of how-to information is going to work if you have the wrong mindset, the wrong guiding philosophies. Avoid losers like the plague, and gather with and learn from winners only.

Offline okanaganmusician

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Re: My ring finger and baby finger on the righthand are weak
Reply #26 on: August 01, 2013, 12:46:41 AM
Make sure not to use Robert Schumann's contraption!   ;)

Simple finger exercises can be quite effective.  Assume a normal piano position sitting at a table.  practicing lifting each finger up as high as possible without lifting up any others and tap them on the table a few times each.

While this doesn't immediately improve the strength of the fingers, it will improve the flexibility of them, especially the 3rd 4th and 5th fingers, within a few weeks.

Strength takes time to build up.  It's an interesting debate though - do you really NEED your fingers to be strong?  Chopin seemed to do ok!  If you're utilizing gravity and relaxing your fingers/wrists/arm you should find it easy to play loud - becuase you're working less hard and letting gravity do it's thing!

That said though, it will limit the kind of pieces that you can play - especially if it involves flexibility and dexterity as well as raw strength (ie Rachmaninov)
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