Who is the least musical concert pianist out there?

[leonidas]

Self-explanatory.

[mike_lang]

At the risk of ridicule, I have to say Pollini (with qualification).  Though he is a great musician and artist, I was a bit disappointed with his last performance at Symphony Center.  His tempi were hasty, his accuracy was compromised, he seemed to be mentally elsewhere, and he rather threw off the performance as though he were a "made man" and had to answer to know one for his artistic (or unartistic decisions).  I believe that he has some superlative recordings, but in this particular performance of his, I was a bit disenchanted.

Best,
ML

[thalberg]

At the risk of ridicule, I have to say Pollini (with qualification).  Though he is a great musician and artist, I was a bit disappointed with his last performance at Symphony Center.  His tempi were hasty, his accuracy was compromised, he seemed to be mentally elsewhere, and he rather threw off the performance as though he were a "made man" and had to answer to know one for his artistic (or unartistic decisions).  I believe that he has some superlative recordings, but in this particular performance of his, I was a bit disenchanted.

Best,
ML

His recording of the Berg Sonata was the worst I encountered.  (Peter Hill was the best.)

Pollini also gets 100,000 dollars per concert. 

My answer to this question would be Alfred Brendel.  I love some of his recordings--he is capable of musicality--but when I heard him perform live it was b o r i n g.

[mike_lang]

His recording of the Berg Sonata was the worst I encountered.  (Peter Hill was the best.)

I agree, Pollini's was a bit sloppy in the rendering of the score.  Tangentially, I've not heard Hill, but I am a fan of Uchida's take on the Berg.

Best,
ML

[amelialw]

yundi li

[wotgoplunk]

I would agree with Alfred Brendel.

His Fur Elise brings tears of pain.

[lazlo]

At first I didn't like Brendel, but he has some of the most thoughtful recordings I've ever heard. What I love most about him, is even when I strongly disagree with his musical ideas, I can tell that he's thought about every single phrase and note in a piece. And he without doubt has some of the most original recordings... I love his mozart fantasia k396. Among many other things... And Pollini I really like his chopin and his recordings of beethovens earlier sonatas. I don't tend to remember artists that I didn't enjoy listening to!

I guess, Tamara Winterstein and John O' Conor I don't care too much for...

[counterpoint]

Is this a serious thread?

Alfred Brendel the least musical pianist out there? 

Today is not April 1st, am I right?

[thalberg]

Is this a serious thread?

Alfred Brendel the least musical pianist out there? 

Today is not April 1st, am I right?

Well, as I said, I love some of his recordings.  They are extremely musical.  But I did hear him live in a solo recital, and it was very, very flat. 

[mike_lang]

Well, as I said, I love some of his recordings.  They are extremely musical.  But I did hear him live in a solo recital, and it was very, very flat. 

I think that the only way this thread can be justified is by an emphasis on "concert."  Many of the concert artists that we hear have a great deal of musical sense, and at some point have done a series of fine recitals or made a good recording, but I think we speak about the ones in whom we have been disappointed in performance (though most often it is the case that they have simply been negligent and/or arrogant and are capable of much more.)


On the other hand, I am surprised to not yet have witnessed a mob of Lang Lang protesters...

Best,
ML

[counterpoint]

Well, as I said, I love some of his recordings.  They are extremely musical.  But I did hear him live in a solo recital, and it was very, very flat. 

Okay, every pianist has his strong and his weak moments. 

[counterpoint]

I think we speak about the ones in whom we have been disappointed in performance

I think, we are talking about musicality 

What is musicality? Is it to impress the audience with virtuosic effects or is it to make music sound natural, clear and understandable?

Supervirtuosic pianists are never boring, because their artistics impress the average audience much more than the music itself. So we have the paradox, that the most impressive pianists are sometimes the least musical at the same time. 

[leonidas]

Musicality can be summed up in both objective and subjective ways, and it's interesting that people tend to go for the subjective.

The objective musicality of a pianist is defined by their cognitive musical capacity.
In it's rawest form - the brain's ability to deal with relations in pitch and rhythm.
In performance, this can be extended to the sensetivity of tone and dynamic.

The subjective musicality of a pianist is obviously much more consequential to our enjoyment of the performance, and it's perfectly possible that many of the most popular pianists don't, objectively, have the greatest mental musical capacity, but they have an appealing and creative individual musical personality.

I'm not an expert on the science of the brain, but it seems.. to be a succesful musician, it requires a well developed musical and creative brain, and I think they may actually be seperate, the greatest ones are those which have great raw cognitive relation ability and great creative instinct.

The thing is, the creative element will only please the audience who subjectively has empathy and agreement in musical sensibility with the artist.
The raw objective element, along with technical ability, can be enjoyed, admired, and appreciated, but cannot ignite musical empathetic sensibility by itself.

This topic could easily become a flaming war, and while that is still welcome for a laugh, I'd prefer to come to an understanding of what musicality is, and why we enjoy certain musicalities.

[theodore]

During a recent full recital, Pollini played a Mozart Sonata followed by some shorter Chopin pieces. The applause after the first half  was lukewarm and he stopped short of coming out onstage when the clapping suddenly stopped.

During the second half he played Rachmaninoff and Scriabin, but the spirit and accuracy of his playing suddenly returned and they were were truly extraordinary. Pollini must have gotten the hint of the scarcity of applause from the audience following the first half of his recital.

Audiences really do know if they are getting their monies worth and so do concert pianists and other concert artists.

[counterpoint]

Audiences really do know if they are getting their monies worth and so do concert pianists and other concert artists.

Mozart and small Chopin pieces are not the money worth? 

Of course people want to hear extreme difficult, fast and loud pieces 

People don't go to a concert to hear Mozart Sonatas and Chopin Nocturnes.

[soliloquy]

Richard Kastle


Seriously though, Lang Lang, Leslie Howard and Alfred Brendel.

[thalbergmad]

Leslie Howard

That would be my vote.

His Liszt was 97 or so CD's of midi's.

Thal

[mephisto]

During the second half he played Rachmaninoff and Scriabin, but the spirit and accuracy of his playing suddenly returned and they were were truly extraordinary. Pollini must have gotten the hint of the scarcity of applause from the audience following the first half of his recital.

I had no idea that Pollini played either Rachmaninov or Scriabin. Do you remember wich pieces he played?

[leonidas]

Richard Kastle


Seriously though, Lang Lang, Leslie Howard and Alfred Brendel.

Leslie Howard has one of the greatest musical brains out there, in terms of pure note/tone processing power, he is just not particularly creative.

However, I'd say Lang Lang is both creative and a musical mind of great power.

[ronde_des_sylphes]

Lang Lang, Leslie Howard and Alfred Brendel.

Be fair.. Lang Lang occasionally plays musically.

[ramseytheii]

"'Musical' is derived from music, like 'poetical' from poetry, or 'physical' from physics.  When I say, 'Schubert was one of the most musical among men,' it is the same as if I should say, 'Helmholtz was one of the most physical among men.'  That is musical, which sounds in rhythms and intervals.  A cupboard can be 'musical,' if 'music-works' be enclosed in it.... a musical person is one who manifests an inclination for music by a nice discrimination and sensitiveness with regard to the technical aspects of the art.  By 'technics' I mean rhythm, harmony, intonation, part-leading, and the treatment of themes...

In view of the great importance attached to these elements of the art, this 'musical' temperament has naturally become of the highest consequence.   And so an artist who plays with perfect technical finish should be deemed the most musical player."

=======

Who can guess who wrote it ?



Walter Ramsey

[counterpoint]

Who can guess who wrote it ?

I don't know - Neuhaus? Michelangeli?

I don't agree with the definition, because more "perfection" - whatever this could be - will chase away spontaneity, and spontaneity is the main power of music.

[benedict park]

Well, I didn't bother to read any of everyone elses post 
but I may be the least musical concert pianist out there! lol! I make too many mistakes

btw, I think Michelangelli wrote it!

[lostinidlewonder]

I hate these threads on Best and Worst, its so mindless. Damn why am i posting lol

[leonidas]

This topic, however, is a self-aware self-parody.

That makes it OK.