12-tone fugue?

[minor9th]

Has anyone composed a 12-tone fugue--not one that simply uses 12 pitches, but a rigorously serial fugue?

[counterpoint]

The last movement of Henze's Sonata per Pianoforte is a 12-tone fugue as far as I remember.

[minor9th]

I read that it's atonal but not a strict serial fugue. Thanks, though!

[jabbz]

Fugues require a tonal system generally, as the contrast is provided, generally by introducing a new key centre (e.g. the second voice entering in the dominant).

[minor9th]

I suppose the tone row could be transposed to the dominant. Overall, though, I imagine creating a fully serial fugue would be quite daunting--not to mention trying to play it!

[jabbz]

I agree, extremely daunting. But, to pick up on your comment, does the idea of transposing a serial subject to the domination, or any other tonal interval not undermine the entire concept of serialism?

[minor9th]

It would be "conceptually" the dominant just by shifting the row.  Perhaps there's a better word for it. I suppose a serial fugue would not have to follow the classic structure. Oooh...what if each voice entered serially--then we'd have a 12-voice fugue! We've now exceeded Sorabji! Or, perhaps the notion of a serial fugue in inherently contradictory!

[counterpoint]

Matching to the general sound of 12 tone music, the second entry should be on the tritone imho 

[mcgillcomposer]

Matching to the general sound of 12 tone music, the second entry should be on the tritone imho 

Isn't this like saying that the second entry of a tonal fugue should always enter in the dominant? I think there are lots of factors at play - the character of the subject, for example.

[counterpoint]

Isn't this like saying that the second entry of a tonal fugue should always enter in the dominant?

Yes, exactly 

[mcgillcomposer]

Yes, exactly 

Haha - OK

[polar_pawz]

There is a 12 tone "fugue" (fugetto? small fugue) in the Variations pour piano by Jacques Hétu (French Canadian Composer) Variation 3 I believe is the fugue...

[retrouvailles]

There is a 12 tone "fugue" (fugetto? small fugue) in the Variations pour piano by Jacques Hétu (French Canadian Composer) Variation 3 I believe is the fugue...

I don't think that would qualify as 12 tone. The subject of that fugue is not a tone row. And it isn't strictly serial.