Playing a concerto?

[willcowskitz]

I was wondering if it takes some kind of a teacher to start practicing a hard piano concerto. I have some problems with the fingering and getting the hands to 'flow' on the keys. I read R. Henry's post about Rachmaninoff's third, how he learnt it in three months by practicing it super-slow, and felt a kind of a relief. Maybe it is possible after all, although "Rach's 3rd" is demanding, since I am greatly motivated. I've been practicing speed and agility with the flight of the bumblebee and a little bit of Prokofiev's toccata, but those back-and-forth jumps in this concerto are sooo difficult. Yeah I've been told I'd never make this and I'd never make that and its impossible but I know I can do it, if I get down to it and do it.


"The solution is always a built-in feature."

[robert_henry]

I want to wish you luck in working on this or any concerto.  I know the feeling when one wants to learn something no matter what the difficulty.

However, I must caution that the Prokofiev Toccata and the Flight are not in the same ballpark as the Rach 3, musically or technically.  Even if you can play all the notes of the third, nobody will want to hear it if you are struggling to make music out of it.  

You brought up my other post, but I should clarify: the notes were learned in the first month up to tempo, then the last two months were the super-slow period to, as I said in my other post, "let my brain catch up with my fingers."  That's usually the way I learn things.  But this worked for me because I know myself, and I knew that technique wouldn't be an issue.  If you doubt your hands, then I wouldn't learn it yet.  It is my opinion that if one can't master the technique of a piece within two to four weeks, then the piece is too hard for that person at that particular time.  If you learn it now, you risk making all kinds of bad habits and not enjoying the music.  

The RACH 3 is meant to be a kind of dessert for the pianist.  It is a gift from Rachmaninoff to the pianist who has spent a great deal of his or her life to achieve the musical, emotional, and technical intelligence required to play it.  Learning it too early is like opening your Christmas presents on November 25.

Robert Henry

[Diabolos]

Well, although this phrase is used quite often by me now - what else to say?

I don't know if one has to be able to play a piece in tempo after two to four weeks; it greatly depends on the piece's length, I suppose.

But, and that's the point: If you're technique is not good enough, and you know that - you shouldn't try playing any piece with this feeling; it just won't lead to success.
It's certainly true that one should climb up the ladder of difficulty, but to high steps are not good for anybody.

I made that mistake quite often, 2 -  my technique was completely undeveloped until a few years ago, thanks to lazyness and unappropriate teaching. I already played Beethoven and Chopin by that time, but with great uncertainty and the unability of fully expressing myself.

I also know how horrible it feels when wanting to play a piece so badly and not being able to make it. Now I normally get new pieces quickly, usually not needing more than 2 weeks for the technical part (if I got enough time for practise); but, as robert henry already said, it's the very-slow-pracitsing period that takes most of the time.

It's up to you if you wanna play that concerto right now - if you feel you can make it, then don't hesitate - but if there are problems and you don't want to give up on it, you might want to see a teacher.

[e60m5]

I will neglect to state whether or not you're ready to play that concerto... because in the end, the only judge is you yourself.

The concerto's technical difficulty has been way overblown by Shine. Don't get me wrong: it is one of the hardest pieces in the entire piano literature. In my humble opinion, however, the piece's difficulty lies not in its multitude of notes and gargantuan stretches and chordal passages; it is a very difficult piece to interpret well musically. And the trick with that concerto is to make it sound easy. As with any other piece.

If you feel up to it, go for it, and I wish you the best of luck.

But I'll state that there are very few pianists out there in the entire world who can really play that concerto like Rachmaninov would have liked it to be played. Far too many people play it just because it's Rach 3 and it's hard and I hope you're not one of them... I sincerely hope you're in it for the music. But yes, very very few pianists play it truly well.

Very few.