Vote for the next US President (citizens only)

[Bob]

US citizens only.  Sorry non-US people.     Go make your own poll if you want.

One vote per person of course.

Teens can vote.  Otherwise we won't have enough responses.

[cmg]

Write-in vote:  Bob (President).

[prometheus]

Our parliament 'voted'.

Of the 150 people, 63 voted Obama. The rest voted Clinton 38 or McCain 16 with 3 of them voting Huckabee and 1 Romney. Now, we have quite some right wing people in Parliament. Most of them voted Clinton or Obama.

The Christian extremists in our parliament commented by saying that there are no true Christian candidates since Huckabee is so extremely right wing. Not christian enough on non-ethical issues, according to them. And for the extreme right, they can't stand the christian issues.

Even a potential 'Dutch Thatcher' voted Clinton comfortably.

Everyone in Europe thinks this will be an extremely easy win for the democrats. They always think this. They are almost always wrong.

The American electorate is just extremely wacky.

[cmg]

Everyone in Europe thinks this will be an extremely easy win for the democrats. They always think this. They are almost always wrong.

The American electorate is just extremely wacky.

Amen, brother.  I hear the strangest things, like this from a registered Democrat, Afro-American, lesbian neurosurgeon who told me she's voting for McCain!  Why?  I asked.

"Hillary voted for the Iraqi War twice and she can't be trusted," she began.

But, what about Obama, I asked.

"I care for him too much," she said. "You just know some right-wing racist will kill him before he's inaugurated.  I don't want to see that happen."

[prometheus]

lol, really?

Anyway, Edwards was the only serious anti-war candidate in the race. Ok, Ron Paul is still left. But Clinton and Obama are both pro-war.

[wotgoplunk]

Kucinich was fairly anti-war.

I don't know where all the support for Obama is coming from. At the end of the day, he's got hardly any experience politically. He's relying on people voting for him for his personal attributes, not for his political leadership or experience.

He'll be essentially learning on the job.

And the presidency of the USA is not the best place to do so.

[prometheus]

He got less votes than Paul and on top of that is already out. He is no longer a candidate.

Anyway, the more experience, the worse the politician. It's not a good trait from the point of view of the voter. The better the politician, the worse he can screw over the voter.

We need naive politicians.

[wotgoplunk]

He got less votes than Paul and on top of that is already out. He is no longer a candidate.

Anyway, the more experience, the worse the politician. It's not a good trait from the point of view of the voter. The better the politician, the worse he can screw over the voter.

We need naive politicians.

Hence the "was".

If we had naive politicians, what would they do in a crisis? Why don't we just stick your average Joe into the presidential office? Because the country would fall into ruins.

[prometheus]

Anyway, that's the reason why I didn't mention them.


Do you really believe that? About the country falling in ruin? Especially in the case of the US?

Often, the national government and it's laws do more harm than good. And the bigger the country the worse. And the US has states. So I don't see the problem.

[mattgreenecomposer]

I voted today, I voted for Ron Paul.  Although I disagree with him on many issues, I feel like he is the less evil of the bunch.  I mean 0% income tax...I'm sold right there!  Who the heck doesn't want that?!!!! Oh yea, dead beats who don't work and want a hand out from the government.

[prometheus]

Rich people always get the most hand outs from the government. Not to mention corporations.

[arensky]

lol, really?

Anyway, Edwards was the only serious anti-war candidate in the race. Ok, Ron Paul is still left. But Clinton and Obama are both pro-war.

Edwards voted to authorize the Iraq War, as did Clinton. Obama was not in the Senate at that time, but he voiced his opposition to it loud and clear. He proposed a phased withdrawal from Iraq a year ago, which would have removed US troops by next month. This of course was shot down by the Republicans and many Democrats. I don't get your logic here...

[mattgreenecomposer]

Well Prometheus, Im assuming your not talking about taxes but other issues.  On other issues I somewhat agree with that statement you made but on taxes the rich get man handled.  The Top 5% of taxpayers pay 50% of all taxes!

Thats insane!  I dont make alot of money (I am a piano teacher) so am by know means rich but it ruins the incentive for me to make more money as I know the Gov. will take it.
My brother on the other hand is a lawyer, and actually paid more in taxes last year than I made the whole year teaching.  Something is seriously wrong with this country when you ruin the incentive for people to make more money for themselves.
If you dont believe me:
https://www.allegromedia.com/sugi/taxes/

[thalberg]

Huckabee seems to believe God wants him to be president.

[gyzzzmo]

Most (i say most, not all,) people hardly have a clue what theyre voting for anyway. The voting is mainly about who has the biggest smile and most cash to cover the campaign. The only candidate-promises people seem to remember, are lowerings of taxes.

I think there are 2 main problems about the american voting system. A: Candidates only say what the average (slightly dumb) citizen wants to hear, no matter if its bad for the country/world or not. This is also why any idiot can buy a gun in the states.
B: Since the campaigns cost so much, candidates get dependend on big donating companies. This way companies have influence on what type of president leads the country, and you never know what promises are made between potential presidents and companies.

gyzzzmo

[Bob]

It does seem like they're all a little out of touch.  As personal as a corporation is.

[pies]

Nader

[prometheus]

If 5% of the people own 95% of the money then if the extreme rich pay just as much tax as the poorest then they still pay 95% of the tax.


I don't know what you are talking about, but taxes in the US are quite low. Not far in the past they taxed 72% of your income over half a million dollar where I live. And some political parties want to put this back into place. Everyone pays at least 33% and if you make a lot of money you pay more than 50%

Where does the tax go? In the US most of it goes to bombs, airplanes, warships, and subsidy for large corporations. Maybe if you people weren't so warlike you wouldn't be complaining so much right now.

In Europe a lot goes to education and culture. If you have a long/expensive education t hen you probably become rich. So rich people receive more tax money. Rich people more often go to classical music concerts. Those are heavily subsidized. Also, house ownership is subsidized here. The bigger your mortgage  the more hand outs you get. Also a very large part goes to subsidizing agriculture. We overproduce to keep all farmers into business. And then we dump our products on the African market, ruining their economy.

The tax hand outs go to those with absolutely no income and those with a lot of money.

Where does your tax go to?

You have no incentive? Who cares? It's not like you are going to make a lot of money as a piano teacher anyway. If you want to make money, find another occupation. If there was such a strong incentive to go after money you wouldn't have been a piano teacher right now.



I agree Obama is appealing. But his charisma is so strong, it's scary. For that reason I would probably not dare to vote for him. Charismatic leaders are the worst, history learns.

[Essyne]

The Top 5% of taxpayers pay 50% of all taxes!

Something is seriously wrong with this country when you ruin the incentive for people to make more money for themselves.

AMEN! (Finally - SOMEONE who thinks logically!) It's funny how everybody is so "screw the rich, let's give their hard earned dollars and cents to the poor" until they actually begin to make money. Meritocracies work, my friend, and if ppl want money, they need to get off welfare and work for their own living.

[wotgoplunk]

AMEN! (Finally - SOMEONE who thinks logically!) It's funny how everybody is so "screw the rich, let's give their hard earned dollars and cents to the poor" until they actually begin to make money. Meritocracies work, my friend, and if ppl want money, they need to get off welfare and work for their own living.

See the thing is though, if you do that, you never allow the poor to get the chance at earning more. Most poor people come from poor families, who come from poor families, who come from poor families, etc.

So by having a meritocracy, everyone just remains where they are, or moves down. When you're poor it's hard to become rich. It's much easier by comparison to go from rich to poor. It all depends on whether you're willing to watch as someone poor never gets the chance to break the cycle.

Of course, all this talk of poor and rich is bound to get into some serious blanket statements.

[Essyne]

I agree Obama is appealing. But his charisma is so strong, it's scary. For that reason I would probably not dare to vote for him. Charismatic leaders are the worst, history learns.

His hypocracy is overwhelming - CASE IN POINT - Alice Palmer. Obama says he's all for "evening the playing field," yet to get his senatorial position in the 1st place he knocked each and every candidate off of the list so that he could run unopposed. He never should've been given his seat. I'm not saying that Obama is the only political snake in this running --- they all have their downfalls, but he is by far the worst. He is the media's "golden child" - the "black" "innocent" "grew up w/o a father" candidate. . . GET OVER IT! Obama's race has nothing to do w/ this, and plenty of ppl grow up w/o fathers. (by the way, call a spade a spade - the dude's mulatto

ON a sidenote: I actually had a debate w/ a kid the other day who said that slavery was still affecting us and that we NEEDED someone who wasn't a white male to be in the White House - - - - - - People think about slavery as if it's happening right now. Blacks have been voting for YEARS now; President Bush is not in the White House because he's WHITE, he's there because he took the initiative to get there. The race card is EVERYWHERE,  and it's NOT the whites throwing it around. Get over the past. Live in the future. I think it's wrong to endorse the thought that I owe someone something because of the color of their skin.
 
If you ask Americans why they are voting for Obama, they say that "he will bring change." If you ask them what policies that they are referring to, all you get are blank stares and "welllllllll...... he's just - - - different. . . . He'll stand up for African Americans." - - - the lack of actual THOUGHT is monumental.

There's my completely off-topic opinion. . .



I vote McCain.

[Essyne]

Of course, all this talk of poor and rich is bound to get into some serious blanket statements.

true

[mephisto]

Get over the past. Live in the future.

Not in the present?

[Essyne]

woah, sorry... got a little carried away there. meant the present....

[Bob]

Revised...


https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,29098.0.html