Is it worth practicing on an uneven piano?

[kard]

Hi, I got my first piano around August last year after much pleading. It has an annoying sound and notes get stuck every now and then, but the issue right now is that  the resistance in the keys is uneven! Ex. I'll be playing an upward D scale from the middle and it will sound fine, but if I try it one octave higher, the E and F# wails out really FF like, and then the G right after is so stiff you have to readjust...

All over the piano there are certain notes that require completely different touches from the notes surrounding them. It is really throwing me off.

I have been trying to just live with it but is it reasonable to assume that the average piano, even if it is in bad shape, maintains reasonable eveness throughout the whole machine? So, apart from memorization of new pieces, should I continue working with this piano? (I'm going off to college in August. Practice pianos are available)

[shortyshort]

I'm going off to college in August. Practice pianos are available

I would just wait. 

[ramseytheii]

If you can master that piano, you can master any piano!

Walter Ramsey

[faulty_damper]

If you can master that piano, you can master any piano!

Do you have any proof that playing on a bad piano makes you a better pianist on any piano?  A lot of pianists make this claim but what evidence is it based upon?  Is it purely intellectual reasoning or because it works?  If it works, then I should call up the tech and have him de-regulate my piano!  In fact, if it works, piano technicians jobs would be to de-regulate pianos.

[rc]

Phew... what you described would be frustrating to work with!  That sounds like a pretty damaged instrument to me.

Well you work with what you've got, but I think those problems would be quite an obstacle to any music making.

They say it's a poor carpenter who blames his tools...

But they also say you need the right tool for the job.  At work, when my tools wear out, if I can't fix them, it's time to replace them.  A busted tool makes life unnecessarily difficult.

Maybe at some point in the future you could see if your piano is worth fixing?

[ramseytheii]

Do you have any proof that playing on a bad piano makes you a better pianist on any piano?  A lot of pianists make this claim but what evidence is it based upon?  Is it purely intellectual reasoning or because it works?  If it works, then I should call up the tech and have him de-regulate my piano!  In fact, if it works, piano technicians jobs would be to de-regulate pianos.

Chopin said that you should practice on a good piano.  Since that's not always available, we should find a strong purpose to keep our inspiration on a bad piano. 

The original poster obviously thought it would be better to not practice at all, then to practice on a bad piano.  Anytime you have to practice on a bad instrument, you have to use your ingenuity and your control to the maximum effect, and of course it gives improvement.  When you have to be able to control especially specific notes, so they can be useful in creating musical phrases, that is obviously a skill that is necessary for a pianist.

Calling your technician to deregulate your piano would be an interesting experiment.  Let us know how it works out!

Walter Ramsey

[kard]

Chopin said that you should practice on a good piano.  Since that's not always available, we should find a strong purpose to keep our inspiration on a bad piano. 

The original poster obviously thought it would be better to not practice at all, then to practice on a bad piano.  Anytime you have to practice on a bad instrument, you have to use your ingenuity and your control to the maximum effect, and of course it gives improvement.  When you have to be able to control especially specific notes, so they can be useful in creating musical phrases, that is obviously a skill that is necessary for a pianist.

Calling your technician to deregulate your piano would be an interesting experiment.  Let us know how it works out!

Walter Ramsey

I understand what you're getting at, but it just got a bit too frustrating for a moment there. I DID try and stay away, but i ended up back with it around 2 days later lol.

They say it's a poor carpenter who blames his tools...

But they also say you need the right tool for the job.  At work, when my tools wear out, if I can't fix them, it's time to replace them.  A busted tool makes life unnecessarily difficult.

Maybe at some point in the future you could see if your piano is worth fixing?

As a 17 yr. old, I have no money haha. None to call my own.

The thing that I am truly worried about though, is that it will mess up my ability to transfer to other pianos. Things like trills, turns and even legato feel way different on my piano than on a decent one and when I have to perform a regular piano, I need like a mini practice session. But I almost never get such a thing.
But it's not too much of a headache now. Like I said, I'll have better instruments available soon

[eyeballnick]

Practice is practice, try not to perfect pieces or anythin, but fingering, scales, Exercises (hanon, Czerny) could work on it. OR wait till you go to college and just work on theory!!

Nick

[eyeballnick]

Practice is practice, try not to perfect pieces or anythin, but fingering, scales, Exercises (hanon, Czerny) could work on it. OR wait till you go to college and just work on theory!!

Nick

Basically any practice is going to make you improve. The once a new piano is avaliable then you can just learn what your brain has been taught "scales" for example on another piano. It will also Improve your ability to play on different pianos. No 2 pianos are exactly the same, and you may find ur playing in a show and the stage piano they have is useless, then you can used your Skill learn for the bad piano

Good luck

Nic

[incognito]

I have no choice but to practice on a very old uneven,extremely heavy keyed piano and although i hate it,when i play on newer pianos the keys feel lighter and playing is alot easier and playing fast on them is easy.So i don't know if it happens to anyone else.Also on the piano i practice on when i pedal to hard or even a little the first C above middle C does not sound lol.

[kard]

surprised to see my thread still alive ^^
But yes, there was an important point made

If you can master that piano, you can master any piano!

Walter Ramsey

Practice is practice, try not to perfect pieces or anythin, but fingering, scales, Exercises (hanon, Czerny) could work on it. OR wait till you go to college and just work on theory!!

Nick

This week has been going pretty good. Every few weeks I end up rebuilding my whole playing process for one reason or another and it is true that I'm getting better at using the piano. I am noticing the necessity for a well supported keystroke for even the shortest note.
Would I be correct in assuming that the more you build your technique around your own body, rather than how the keys respond to your touch, the better you are at using different pianos?

[db05]

I don't know why this hasn't been suggested, or if it's advisable... Why not practice on an air piano (ie. practice on a table, your lap or something)?

I have the choice of two terrible pianos at home. One has good pitch, but terrible weight and some keys get stuck. The other has nice action, but is a whole tone low. I've tried alternating pianos recently, and when I'm on the heavy one, I alternate between the real piano and air piano to avoid pain. I might not actually play, but I can practice fingering, some coordination and mental play on an air piano.

I have to focus on coordination, because most all of the pianos I encounter are terrible, even in school. They're loud, and it seems impossible to get a good p. Sometimes it's not the pianos themselves, but the benches. They're too high. Then I go to a badly tuned piano (not necessarily the one at home), I get distracted because sometimes I've memorized the pitches and the "wrong" notes distract me. So I give up on finding good pianos all the time, must develop coordination and mental play instead.

This is just a recent experiment, and I will comment on my progress later. At least for now, I avoid some pain and frustration.

On a side note, isn't it interesting that guitarists can switch from classical, steel string acoustics, electric guitars and basses?  Plus some bassists can play double bass and electric bass w/ and w/o frets. My old guitar teacher plays fingerstyle, electric guitar, and electric bass. He's good at all of those. No kidding.

All guitars are different from each other, more so than pianos. Plus switching from acoustic to electric, fingerstyle to picking to strumming, etc. How do they do that?? 

[gerryjay]

question: is it worth practicing on an uneven piano?
my humble answer: yes.

to anyone who have played a great piano in a great hall, any other situation is uneven, and bad by definition. even if you have a steinway in your home, it's very unlikely that you have also a room with proper acoustics to it sounds at its most. so, to me, i always did practiced in poor instruments: my old upright, my digital, the school's upright, several grands...

i challenge anyone here: are your piano perfectly tuned and absolutely even? i mean, without any minor flaw. to me, specially the question of tuning is a disgrace: it's rather impossible to play in a mistuned instrument, even if it's just a very little bit.

taken that for granted, i think it's better to play. enjoy your piano and look forward for any improvement you can!

best wishes, and best luck!

[gerryjay]

All guitars are different from each other, more so than pianos. Plus switching from acoustic to electric, fingerstyle to picking to strumming, etc. How do they do that?? 

my clark kent side was a guitarist. i must tell you that is not that complex, given you practice the different styles. of course, sometimes there are different technical approaches, but then you just have to solve them.
btw, it's the same thing about being a pianist and playing electronic keyboard, midi controllers, and a harpsichord.
what really amazes me is how a pianist can play an accordion...
best!

[db05]

my clark kent side was a guitarist. i must tell you that is not that complex, given you practice the different styles. of course, sometimes there are different technical approaches, but then you just have to solve them.
btw, it's the same thing about being a pianist and playing electronic keyboard, midi controllers, and a harpsichord.
what really amazes me is how a pianist can play an accordion...
best!

So true, that. But I remember some guitars at school to be so much worse than the bad pianos. The one and only bass guitar, especially. The best players can adjust and play decent music with them. The rest of us can only blame the instrument.

PS.
Anyone here that play accordion, electone, and keytar? 

[m]

I posted this message in another topic, but think it is appropriate here, so since I don't need to ask myself permission about copyrights  , I just copy and paste it here:

I have one of those rebranded Chinese junkie baby grands. It is terribly out of tune to the point it is hard to recognize what note you play. Most of the top register strings are broken (at least twelve or so), the mechanics are terribly unregualted and very much uneven. The left pedal way overlaps the strings to the point some notes don't pla at all. The whole pedal system is crooked and out of any regulation, whatsoever. The tone is quite unpleasant and for the space is little too much, having that harsh timbre, associated with cheap Chinese pianos. Preparing for the next tour I am hesitant to do anything with it... in any case, after pounding 8-12 hours a day this poor creature will be in the same condition in a matter of a few days after the most careful tuning and regulation. Considering what kind of complete pain in the @$$ I am, as far as those things go, why would I care?
All I can tell, I am quite happy--at least I have a piano with some intact keys...
 
Best, M

[kard]

I don't know why this hasn't been suggested, or if it's advisable... Why not practice on an air piano (ie. practice on a table, your lap or something)?

That's an interesting idea but the first thing that pops into my mind is seat height and table height. I dont have anything comparable to the piano dimensions. The problem isn't really just to get practice in, it is that I need to become more comfortable at pianos in general. Except for the last year and a half, all my experience has been with digital.

question: is it worth practicing on an uneven piano?
my humble answer: yes.

to anyone who have played a great piano in a great hall, any other situation is uneven, and bad by definition. even if you have a steinway in your home, it's very unlikely that you have also a room with proper acoustics to it sounds at its most. so, to me, i always did practiced in poor instruments: my old upright, my digital, the school's upright, several grands...

i challenge anyone here: are your piano perfectly tuned and absolutely even? i mean, without any minor flaw. to me, specially the question of tuning is a disgrace: it's rather impossible to play in a mistuned instrument, even if it's just a very little bit.

taken that for granted, i think it's better to play. enjoy your piano and look forward for any improvement you can!

best wishes, and best luck!

I never even thought of it like that. Really puts it into perspective.

I posted this message in another topic, but think it is appropriate here, so since I don't need to ask myself permission about copyrights  , I just copy and paste it here:

I have one of those rebranded Chinese junkie baby grands. It is terribly out of tune to the point it is hard to recognize what note you play. Most of the top register strings are broken (at least twelve or so), the mechanics are terribly unregualted and very much uneven. The left pedal way overlaps the strings to the point some notes don't pla at all. The whole pedal system is crooked and out of any regulation, whatsoever. The tone is quite unpleasant and for the space is little too much, having that harsh timbre, associated with cheap Chinese pianos. Preparing for the next tour I am hesitant to do anything with it... in any case, after pounding 8-12 hours a day this poor creature will be in the same condition in a matter of a few days after the most careful tuning and regulation. Considering what kind of complete pain in the @$$ I am, as far as those things go, why would I care?
All I can tell, I am quite happy--at least I have a piano with some intact keys...
 
Best, M

  That sounds like the piano you'd wish for your nemesis to be stuck with...on a deserted island with an extinct songbird population. Its funny how we can think we have it so bad but never even consider that maybe someone else has it even worse.

Is that the piano you grew up with? or where you got the majority of your training?
 

[m]

Is that the piano you grew up with? or where you got the majority of your training?
 

No, that happened such a long time ago and was so far away....

I got it new 5 years ago.
My tuner actually came today and put new strings, so at least now I can somewhat recognize pitches.

Best, M

[lostinidlewonder]

Playing on bad pianos does help you develop your already developed technique and musical ear. To acquire technique and a musical ear from a bad quality piano is crazy. Everyone should play on the highest quality piano possible to know what it is like to play on an instrument which doesn't waste one bit of physical energy you put into it. Then when you are faced with something that drains your energy (or a digital piano which amplifies it) you know what it is being effected and how you act against it. I taught a student on a digital piano which had about 10 super loud notes. Even the softest touch produced fff. Its extremely annoying and no technique will reduce its effect... not unless you play everything fff lol. It was very damaging to the lesson however.