Books for Composers

[nucleartide]

I want to get into musical composition, but I have no idea where to start.  I understand basic music theory, and I've been playing the piano for 10 years or so.  Anyone have any book suggestions?

Thanks,
NT

[gerryjay]

dear nt:
get a teacher and be happy!
best!

[Etude]

In my experience, composition teachers don't teach you how to compose your music, just how to compose it "better".

...If even that.  The majority of the "lessons" (which were in groups of about 5) just turned into some kind of musical show-and-tell situation.

[nucleartide]

dear gerryjay:
no.

Completely agree with Etude; I have this preconception that composition should be more of a private activity.  Could anyone just lead me to some books?

[gerryjay]

In my experience, composition teachers don't teach you how to compose your music, just how to compose it "better".

the reason is simple: it's impossible to teach composition. in the other hand, composition is about technique and musicianship, and that's very unlikely to learn by your own.

...If even that. The majority of the "lessons" (which were in groups of about 5) just turned into some kind of musical show-and-tell situation.

well, excuse me but that was an odd experience: that's far from being a rule.

I have this preconception that composition should be more of a private activity.

i respect whatever you think, but you already said it all: it's only a preconception. there is a myth about the "lost of ingenuity and creativity" when you take regular lessons of something. this is sometimes associated heavily with composition classes, but it's not true. according to that kind of reasoning, after your 10 years of piano lessons you probably don't have nothing of your own in your piano playing. is that true? sure that it's not.

however, let me explain why i suggested a teacher: if you "have no idea where to start", there is no book that can help you. there are many books (from fux' gradus to cowell's new musical resources, from berlioz' treatise to griffiths' modern music and after), depending on what you are in. furthermore, the main approach to composition is through composed music itself, so reading and listening actual music is essential to that, and that's need as much guidance as an instrument class.

if, reading all that, your answer is still "no", something that won't do any harm: schoenberg's fundamentals in music composition.

best wishes!

[ramseytheii]

the reason is simple: it's impossible to teach composition. in the other hand, composition is about technique and musicianship, and that's very unlikely to learn by your own.
well, excuse me but that was an odd experience: that's far from being a rule.
i respect whatever you think, but you already said it all: it's only a preconception. there is a myth about the "lost of ingenuity and creativity" when you take regular lessons of something. this is sometimes associated heavily with composition classes, but it's not true. according to that kind of reasoning, after your 10 years of piano lessons you probably don't have nothing of your own in your piano playing. is that true? sure that it's not.

however, let me explain why i suggested a teacher: if you "have no idea where to start", there is no book that can help you. there are many books (from fux' gradus to cowell's new musical resources, from berlioz' treatise to griffiths' modern music and after), depending on what you are in. furthermore, the main approach to composition is through composed music itself, so reading and listening actual music is essential to that, and that's need as much guidance as an instrument class.

if, reading all that, your answer is still "no", something that won't do any harm: schoenberg's fundamentals in music composition.

best wishes!

Well put!  I also find Schoenberg's "Theory of Harmony," or in German, "Harmonielehre" to be very good at building groundwork for composition.

I like your point about people being afraid of losing creativity or ingenuity when applying formal studies.  Also one might say, people are afraid of losing their instinct.  in all cases, this has known to have happened, but I rather feel it is because the person didn't have a very strong instinct to begin with: they couldn't master the formal study and harness it to their ideas, because one outweighed another.  Let me be clear in saying, this isn't the fault of the study!

Walter Ramsey

[nucleartide]

i respect whatever you think, but you already said it all: it's only a preconception. there is a myth about the "lost of ingenuity and creativity" when you take regular lessons of something. this is sometimes associated heavily with composition classes, but it's not true. according to that kind of reasoning, after your 10 years of piano lessons you probably don't have nothing of your own in your piano playing. is that true? sure that it's not.

however, let me explain why i suggested a teacher: if you "have no idea where to start", there is no book that can help you. there are many books (from fux' gradus to cowell's new musical resources, from berlioz' treatise to griffiths' modern music and after), depending on what you are in. furthermore, the main approach to composition is through composed music itself, so reading and listening actual music is essential to that, and that's need as much guidance as an instrument class.

if, reading all that, your answer is still "no", something that won't do any harm: schoenberg's fundamentals in music composition.

best wishes!

Let me clear some things up:

I'm 15, I live in New York, and I've taken piano lessons since I was 5 (though I stopped about 2 years ago due to time limitations).  I do agree with you on the fact that formal studies are beneficial in learning something completely new, but I just don't have time for them.  Hopefully, I'll be able to receive formal studies in college, but until then, I want to study on my own.

I'm sorry for saying that I had no idea where to start; I've actually already taken the initiative.  I read a lot about interpretation/music theory at the library (and I've read Schoenberg's Fundamentals in Musical Composition), and I am familiar with many classical recordings/music history.  So to rephrase my request: could someone lead me in the right direction for someone in my situation?

And thanks for those books.

[db05]

I think it's more important to start composing. If you're interested in composition, don't wait until you've reached a certain grade or read a number of books until you write something. Write something everyday. You'll need to have pencils and music paper to jot down ideas. Finale or any score writing software is recommended.

Before I took this music course, all the theory I learned was from learning guitar from my teacher and guitar and music sites ( ultimate-guitar.com , tomhess.net , etc. - check out the articles on songwriting/ composition, there's some inspirational stuff too). There's a lot of information you can get online for free! This should be enough to get you started. Unless you want to compose for orchestra? But if some info about that is available online, I wouldn't be surprised.

I don't have your initiative, but I'll be required to compose for class, I think... Everyone's really excited about it, except me. So you may ignore this post if you want.

[nucleartide]

I've composed a few pieces using Schoenberg's twelve-tone method for music class before; the great thing about the method is that you don't necessarily need any musical knowledge to compose.

[pianochick93]

I do most of my composing by sitting down at the piano and just having a play around. I don't always decide on a key first, that often comes later, but sometimes I play a few triads, find one I really like the sound of and then try and build a melody around it.

I'm in no way an accomplished composer, I only have a total of 1 complete piece, 2 incomplete ones, and several possible melody ideas.

But I'd say just have a play around on your instrument, find something that sounds good, and then write it down. You've read all these books on composition, which is more than I've done, so you probably have a better idea than me than the things you cn do with the melody once you've found it.

Good Luck!

[db05]

I do most of my composing by sitting down at the piano and just having a play around. I don't always decide on a key first, that often comes later, but sometimes I play a few triads, find one I really like the sound of and then try and build a melody around it.

I'm in no way an accomplished composer, I only have a total of 1 complete piece, 2 incomplete ones, and several possible melody ideas.
Good Luck!

Kinda like what I've done.  Only, I'd use the guitar because it's more handy with chords. I've written 1 piece, 1 pop song, several themes/ possible lyrics.

I usually start with a theme because I have a whole bunch of them. Then find approrpiate chords, and from there, improvise a melody. There will be lots of possible melodies from one progression. But only a few will match the theme.

[rc]

I was remembering that Haydn spent a long time working to become a composer, and after some generous people had lent him some money, he got a cheap place to live and began working to fill in the gaps of his knowledge.  He picked up Fux's Gradus, Mattheson - Der Vollkommene Kapellmeister and Kellner - Unterricht im Generalbass.  Apparently his copies of these books are loaded with Haydn's comments in the margins, indicating that he read them very actively and thouroughly.

...From there he composed a lot, got a few jobs, and found other teachers where he could learn from.  One was a sour old italian who had Haydn doing menial tasks, but Haydn put up with it so long as he would correct his compositions.

[mattgreenecomposer]

I agree with etude up to a certain point.  My experience with composition lessons in college was not a good one.  It was a sort of show and tell, and the music that my teacher was interested in was not tonal/early 20th century at all and he had no clue how to play piano.  He was completely worthless for what I was trying to accomplish.  I told myself that I would never teach like that.

I try to give students exercises to get out of "holes" in their music.  (For example, have two sections that are not related and have them bridge "the gap" with 8 or 16 measures).   A very hands-on approach that everyone encounters when they write a piece of music.  Have them write small pieces like minuets to learn about form.  Give them certain chords they have to use or rhythms and see what they can do with it to make the music interesting.  Also notation issues are always a problem with new composers.   Learn the rules!
I like what Ramsey-thai said about Schoenberg's book.  I am not a Shoenberg music fan at all but he is an excellent theorist and author and the Harmony book is very informative.
Bottom line is to become good at something you have to do it often.  Composition is a sort of self taught skill by nature.

[healdie]

i am very interested in composition and jot down numerous ideas for pieces but the trouble i have is devloping those ideas into pieces i am having not as such composition lessons but theory and harmony because untill i get a much better grasp on these then i won't be able to compose anything good

so i would get a harmony book and take the theory grades although this alone won't make you a composer it will hopefully give you the tools necessary to become one

[etcetra]

I think it will help you to get more into theory.. I just dont understand why theory is not taught earlier.. i think its entirely possible to learn about counterpoint or Augmented 6th chords at a younger age.. i think learning these things will give you an idea as to how of piece of music work..and its just the beggining..

I don't think there is a right or wrong way of learning composition.. I think a lot of it works like reverse engineering.. by that i mean you find musical scores, analyze them and incorporate that into your composition style. I mean you can take like a score of Beethoven symphony for example and study its harmony, themes and all that.. but first you have to learn what to look for.  for me doing that is much more helpful than doing exercises.

I know i am quoting this everywhere.. but i figured its appropirate in this post.

"It is a mistake to think that the practice of my art has become easy to me. I assure you, dear friend, no one has given so much care to the study of composition as I. There is scarcely a famous master in music whose works I have not frequently and diligently studied."

Mozart

 

[Bob]

If you went to a conservatory maybe.

It seemed like the stuff I learned about theory in college was more like elementary math.  I could see it being done that like.  But who knows they want to devote themselves to music like that at that age?  Not to mention whatever other "critical" material it would bump out.  The people who were really confused didn't know their scales very well and didn't have a clue what the notes on a keyboard were.  They thought it was like Calculus.

[etcetra]

If you went to a conservatory maybe.

It seemed like the stuff I learned about theory in college was more like elementary math.  I could see it being done that like.  But who knows they want to devote themselves to music like that at that age?  Not to mention whatever other "critical" material it would bump out.  The people who were really confused didn't know their scales very well and didn't have a clue what the notes on a keyboard were.  They thought it was like Calculus.

I think a lot of it has to do with the way we are taught in schools.. a lot of countries requires that you know Calculus in high school but they do not require that you know music notation... music education is far behind other areas it seems. I am not saying that a highs school student should know their counterpoint.. but that it should be available for people who desires to learn them.. For me i was not exposed to those things until i was college, and i wish i knew earlier... because until then i was "stuck" knowing very limited theory to do music.   

I am sure Mozart studied scores of great composers at very young age (he probably transcribed some of the scores himself), so if someone has the same desire to do that my all means they should go for it.. i just wish those tools to do that were more available for them.

[eastman_grad]

I've composed a few pieces using Schoenberg's twelve-tone method for music class before; the great thing about the method is that you don't necessarily need any musical knowledge to compose.

Schoenberg would be very disappointed with this remark, and I assume he would also feel very misunderstood.

[Bob]

I think a lot of it has to do with the way we are taught in schools.. a lot of countries requires that you know Calculus in high school but they do not require that you know music notation... music education is far behind other areas it seems. I am not saying that a highs school student should know their counterpoint.. but that it should be available for people who desires to learn them.. For me i was not exposed to those things until i was college, and i wish i knew earlier... because until then i was "stuck" knowing very limited theory to do music.

I am sure Mozart studied scores of great composers at very young age (he probably transcribed some of the scores himself), so if someone has the same desire to do that my all means they should go for it.. i just wish those tools to do that were more available for them.

It's probably not practical.  They wouldn't get enough students unless it was required.  And there's the "music is fun" attitude too.

That leaves private theory/composition lessons which are an option.  But then you have to find a qualified person. 

[bernhard]

Here is the book:

William Russo – “Composing Music – a new approach” (University of Chicago Press).

This book is a carefully strutured book that starts by limiting severely what you can use. You see, the main reason people “do not know where to start” is usually becuase there are too many options. By imposing some limitations, the task quickly becomes more understandable (so, if you want to learn how to cook, limit the ingredients in the beginning, say, no animal products).

After a few exercises, however, the author steadily enlarges the rules so you are less and less limited.

Now, for other things you can do besides what you will find in this book.

i.   Imitate. This is what aspiring writers do. They try to imitate the style of famous writers (as an exercise, of course). So, if you have been playing the piano for ten years, you have a varied enough repertory to emulate. Start with pieces you like. Figure out how the composer did it. Schumann once said “composing is easy, all you have to do is invent a tune no one has invented before”, but I disagree. A lot of composition has more to do with “arrangement”, that is the treatment you give your tunes than the tunes themselves. So, pick up a piece like say, Mendelssohn´s Song without Words op. 19 no. 1. Compare it with Grieg´s “Arietta” and Schumann´s “Of foreign Lands and people”. The treatment is pretty much the same – the melodies, of course are different. Now try to imitate these pieces, that is try to write a tune with the same structure (three voices, melody on the soprano, counter melody on the bass, arpeggiated accompaniment on the middle voice). Or try to write a two-voice invention Bach style (they were originally intended as composition exercises). Before you can find your own voice and your own style, it is perfectly all right to steal from others (at least Stravinsky thought so).

ii.   Make your own arrangements of popular or folk tunes (happy birthday to you is very useful – you can play it at the next birthday party). Compare your arrangements with those of other people. If you don´t like yours, try to figure out what is it that someone else is doing that you like. Get solo piano music and arrange it for piano and violin/recorder/flute/cello/etc. Sometimes all you need to do is to separate the soprano voice for the solo instrument, and leave the rest for the piano. Sometimes this will not work too well and you will need to add stuff. However by doing it, you will learn in a very pragmatical way why the composer did what he did.

iii.   You may even do arrangements of scales by fiddling with the rhyhtm and adding a chord progression underneath. Here is an example:



iv.   Improvise. Improvisation is composing on the spot. Read Ted´s numerous posts on improvisation, to get the idea. Here are some:

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,5421.msg51828.html#msg51828
(Inner state for improvisation – how to do it like cziffra – excellent advice from Ted)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,3499.msg31548.html#msg31548
(using scales as the basis for free improvisation)

v.   Don´t just “play” your pieces. Analyse them, deconstruct them and then put them together again. This is particularly rewarding (you will learn a lot) when done with pieces like variations or new takes on old stuff (for instance Terence Greave´s “Bah Bah Blue Sheep Waltz”, where he uses exactly the same melodic line of Bah, Bah , Black Sheep, but with a jazz harmonic progression, that makes it all but impossible to recognise the original nursery rhyme).

vi.   Just compose! (as several people have suggested). To start with you will suck, but so what? Figure out why that is so, and learn from your mistakes.


Best wishes,
Bernhard

[eastman_grad]

Bernhard,

I like a lot of your suggestions. I would just add something to your harmonizing of scales example. One should try to vary to harmony rhythm according to the hierarchy of tension. So, for example, at the cadence, the dominant (with or without seventh) could be given more temporal emphasis. Another possibility is to increase the harmonic rhythm as one approaches a cadence. Without things like this, one is simply doing exercises in a void with no relevance to actual composing.

Best,
--EG