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VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4 (Read 7945 times)

Offline sarrasani

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VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
« on: August 05, 2008, 01:40:21 AM »


Not immaculate, but I hope decent and comunicative.
And don't tell me that it's silly to play pices like this with the score, I know it!
The score, the wall so near, my body language, the mistakes....many things can be irritating,  but be indulgent with a poor amateur!
All the best for you and thank you for attention,
Sandro

piano sheet music of Moment Musical


Offline deliaatje

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Re: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #1 on: August 05, 2008, 10:01:07 PM »
Thanks Sandro,
Nice.  But I think, since you started on body language and since it's a visual, that putting a little of the force and the energy from your belly, towards the regions of the head and above would definitely serve this music...
And playing 'with' the score, who cares ?
You really want indulgence ? Why ?
An amateur ? Well, what can one expect more ? Is the fact that we love music not the most important one ?
A "poor" amateur !? Alright, I'll be indulgent; you need money ?
Your playing is not irritating.  Maybe a little too much camerawork for the performance but what the heck...
You are perhaps a little too heavy, have probably so much flesh in your body center that your energy does not get very fluently, easily, quickly, vigourously too your fingertips.  That results in a playing (that is for instance also noticeable in the playing of Pamela Mangova) that is - in my view - not edgy enough, not enough articulate, nice in the center of the keyboard but not at it ends, and to blurry, just too much mistakes but not enough articulation.  That is just a matter of bodyshape; the music, in this case, looks like the musician; round, charming, defensive... 
Thank you too...
 

Offline sarrasani

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Re: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #2 on: August 06, 2008, 12:28:08 AM »
Thanks Sandro,
Nice.  But I think, since you started on body language and since it's a visual, that putting a little of the force and the energy from your belly, towards the regions of the head and above would definitely serve this music...
And playing 'with' the score, who cares ?
You really want indulgence ? Why ?
An amateur ? Well, what can one expect more ? Is the fact that we love music not the most important one ?
A "poor" amateur !? Alright, I'll be indulgent; you need money ?
Your playing is not irritating.  Maybe a little too much camerawork for the performance but what the heck...
You are perhaps a little too heavy, have probably so much flesh in your body center that your energy does not get very fluently, easily, quickly, vigourously too your fingertips.  That results in a playing (that is for instance also noticeable in the playing of Pamela Mangova) that is - in my view - not edgy enough, not enough articulate, nice in the center of the keyboard but not at it ends, and to blurry, just too much mistakes but not enough articulation.  That is just a matter of bodyshape; the music, in this case, looks like the musician; round, charming, defensive... 
Thank you too...
 


My tone was a little joking.....I receive many comments on my channel, but this is IMHO the more interesting and intelligent among all. I'll consider it very seriously. I agree at 95%, only I think the
"not-fluency" of energy is especially in neck and wrists 8carpal tunnel sympoms), my real weak points. I see also you believe in the importance of articulation, and criticize for not having enough.
And you are right, and not as other ones that tell me I over-articulate.....
Again thank you and congratulations for your so direct, precise and motivated words.
All the best,
Sandro

Offline pianistimo

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Re: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #3 on: August 08, 2008, 07:31:47 AM »
dear sarrassani,

despite the criticism - whether articulation or pedal ( i tend to think pedalling) - you are quite amazing. your hands are not huge - and yet you play rachmaninov pretty convincing.  i'd pay to hear this (i like the tonal and dynamic changes) if the pedalling were just slightly improved.  sarrassani - all you need is a few tweaks from a top-notch teacher's piano lessons.  being that i teach mostly beginners and intermediate so far - my advices are simply personal preferences - but (dreaming) if i were to suddenly pretend i knew more - i'd say that the left hand should not be so loud and the right hand more singing.

Offline sarrasani

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Re: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #4 on: August 09, 2008, 02:26:31 AM »
dear sarrassani,

despite the criticism - whether articulation or pedal ( i tend to think pedalling) - you are quite amazing. your hands are not huge - and yet you play rachmaninov pretty convincing.  i'd pay to hear this (i like the tonal and dynamic changes) if the pedalling were just slightly improved.  sarrassani - all you need is a few tweaks from a top-notch teacher's piano lessons.  being that i teach mostly beginners and intermediate so far - my advices are simply personal preferences - but (dreaming) if i were to suddenly pretend i knew more - i'd say that the left hand should not be so loud and the right hand more singing.

Also your comment is precious, thank you.
I agree 100% about "over-pedalling", but I think here can be ALSO a problem of too much reverberation I added  when editing audio (I can restore the original audio, but I prefer to make another recording in yne next months). The left hand too much F....good argument, and I know for example Pogorelich version that plays L.h. here often p.  I'm not the pianist that put the sign on the score at first place (And I like the most free and creative approach, as Pogorelich one) but there is a very clear FF at the beginning, where only L.H. plays....
All the best for you,
Sandro

P.S. You told kindly "not huge" hands.....I began to study this piece only as excercise for my small hands, then (after months) I thought that was possible to play it. Not easy (and not really well played), but I'm not completely negative about the actual level....

Offline broscoe

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Re: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #5 on: August 15, 2008, 12:48:20 AM »
Not bad, and if you are an amateur I tell "bravo" to you.
But, as you tell, it's not immaculate, and you first know that work is to complete.....
Good temperament and congratulations,
Benny

Offline sarrasani

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Re: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #6 on: August 15, 2008, 10:33:23 AM »
Not bad, and if you are an amateur I tell "bravo" to you.
But, as you tell, it's not immaculate, and you first know that work is to complete.....
Good temperament and congratulations,
Benny

Thank you. You caught  the reality: a work in progress at a decent quality level, not more.
All the best,
Sandro

Offline communist

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #7 on: October 05, 2008, 12:34:10 AM »
relax stop spasing out,

good playing tho  :D
"The stock markets go up and down, Bach only goes up"

-Vladimir Feltsman

Offline lostinidlewonder

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #8 on: October 06, 2008, 06:39:04 AM »
Nice. Try not to let the piece play you, make sure its always the other way around :) I can certainly see that you enjoy this piece very much. I can imagine a great improvement in your playing if you embed some small changes to your conservation of energy into your technique. Try to make your bit sounds come from the whole body not just the arm that way your forearms don't have to go mad. The energy flows through the body, not just through the hand. Tai Chi actually taught me a huge amount about energy transfer from the body :) Ground yourself at your feet and feel your energy flow from the earth, through your body and into your hands.
"The biggest risk in life is to take no risk at all."
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Offline instromp

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #9 on: October 10, 2008, 04:25:35 AM »
I love your energy with this piece.
the metranome is my enemy

Offline rv

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #10 on: October 14, 2008, 01:05:41 AM »
Thanks for introducing me to this piece, I just fell in love with it.
I listened to a bunch of professional and home recordings on youtube and you are definately among the better ones. Good job!
And indeed I don't understand why you have to look at the score :)

Offline sarrasani

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #11 on: November 02, 2008, 01:00:10 AM »
Thanks for introducing me to this piece, I just fell in love with it.
I listened to a bunch of professional and home recordings on youtube and you are definately among the better ones. Good job!
And indeed I don't understand why you have to look at the score :)

Too much kind, you and all the other ones. I'll try to make trasure both of congratulations and so motivated and intelligent criticism. Thank you much and all the best for you,
Sandro

Offline bjenkins24

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #12 on: November 02, 2008, 02:09:06 AM »
Good job.

There are a few things I think would make it sound even better though.

When the melody comes in, especially in the beginning, you play it pretty short.  After the first 16th note of the melody the next duration is a triple dotted half note.  You play it like a staccato 16th note, hold it out!

Later in the section with the descending thirds in the right hand you seem to play them somewhat detached also, it's the prettiest part of the piece, you don't get a whole lot of opportunity to play many lyrical sections in the piece so take advantage of it play it legato and bring it out, change the tone a bit.

The piece opens fortissimo, but you need to plan ahead.  When the descending thirds start it's marked mezzo forte, there needs to be a dynamic change between that section and the opening fortissimo and even more so when it goes to ppp during the second bit of descending thirds.  I would even recommend using the una corda there to make a bigger difference.

Overall the dynamic range of this piece is ppp-ffff so you have to try to figure out what Rachmaninoff was trying to say for writing such extreme dynamic levels.  You have to be able to play louder than the opening which is ff because it eventually gets up to ffff.  So don't play the opening fortissimo like you would in a different piece, save something for the end. 

Just my two cents!

Offline sarrasani

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #13 on: November 02, 2008, 04:00:51 PM »
Good job.


Good job all your so interesting and solid criticisms. Thank you much, I'm continuing to work on this piece, and your considerations (I agree at 95% with them, only the 1 corda with mf...., but I'll try also this and I suspect you are right also here) will be very useful.
All the best for you,
Sandro

Offline bjenkins24

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #14 on: November 02, 2008, 04:32:32 PM »
I actually meant use the una corda at the ppp not the mf, sorry if I was ambiguous.

Offline emill

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Re: VIDEO: Rachmaninov Moment Musical n.4
«Reply #15 on: November 15, 2008, 11:13:55 AM »
Hi Sandro ! :)

If you consider yourself a poor amateur of the piano
then what would that make of us lesser mortals ??   :o

Excellent recording and playing ... as usual.

Enzo (blueyoyi)
member on behalf of my son, Lorenzo