\"\"
Piano Forum logo

Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza? (Read 7855 times)

Offline dnephi

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1859
Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
« on: September 06, 2008, 02:04:35 AM »
I have recently been assigned the Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto.  I'm ecstatic- this is some of the greatest music ever written.

1st: Any thoughts on the work as a whole?

2nd, and more importantly: Which cadenza would you play?

My teacher mentioned the Beethoven, but I've heard it called perfunctory.  I have seen the Liszt and wasn't too impressed.  I don't know the Brahms.  I would like to do the Alkan, but I am not sure if it would fit or if I could pull it off in the first place.

Please recommend further choices and comment on those already mentioned.

Thanks,

Daniel
For us musicians, the music of Beethoven is the pillar of fire and cloud of mist which guided the Israelites through the desert.  (Roughly quoted, Franz Liszt.)

piano sheet music of Piano Concerto 3


Offline faulty_damper

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3931
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #1 on: September 06, 2008, 05:38:22 AM »
And the necessary question is? ::)

Offline cmg

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1042
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #2 on: September 06, 2008, 05:46:17 AM »
I have recently been assigned the Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto.  I'm ecstatic- this is some of the greatest music ever written.

1st: Any thoughts on the work as a whole?

2nd, and more importantly: Which cadenza would you play?

My teacher mentioned the Beethoven, but I've heard it called perfunctory.  I have seen the Liszt and wasn't too impressed.  I don't know the Brahms.  I would like to do the Alkan, but I am not sure if it would fit or if I could pull it off in the first place.

Please recommend further choices and comment on those already mentioned.

Thanks,

Daniel

If the cadenzas of Beethoven, Liszt, Brahms and Alkan strike you as being not up to your standards, then why not improvise your own?  That's the point of the cadenza anyway, right?

By the way, this concerto is held in the highest regard by everyone.  Whoever said Beethoven's cadenza is "perfunctory" is a fool. 
Current repertoire:  "Come to Jesus" (in whole-notes)

Offline faulty_damper

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3931
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #3 on: September 06, 2008, 06:03:44 AM »
Cadenzas have a dual purpose in a concerto:

1. display of facility of the performer
2. enhancing musical material or increasing cohesion of previous and future material

If 1 is prioritized, music can suffer.  (Id est: Liszt.)
If 2 is emphasized and extended with new material, it trivializes the concerto and throws it out of balanced. (Id est: Alkan's.)  Cadenzas should be in proportion to the concerto - neither too short/long nor unbalancing the music with new material.

How many pianists train to improvise a cadenza with these two purposes? ::)

Offline thalbergmad

  • PS Gold Member
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16194
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #4 on: September 06, 2008, 09:27:48 AM »

By the way, this concerto is held in the highest regard by everyone. 

A bit of a gross generalisation.

I detest it on a cellular basis.

Thal
Curator/Director
Concerto Preservation Society

Offline cmg

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1042
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #5 on: September 06, 2008, 03:13:00 PM »
A bit of a gross generalisation.

I detest it on a cellular basis.

Thal

CORRECTION:  Not everyone admires this concerto.  Thal has spoken.
Current repertoire:  "Come to Jesus" (in whole-notes)

Offline kitty on the keys

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 391
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #6 on: September 06, 2008, 03:30:02 PM »
A GREAT concerto!!!!!  I like the Beethoven cadenza. It's worth all the hard work!

Kitty on the keys
Kitty on the Keys
James Lee

Offline mikey6

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1403
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #7 on: September 08, 2008, 03:12:48 PM »
Tis my least fav of the 5 too.
You've heard the cadenza?  Or you've heard it called perfunctory?  If you liek the Beethoven, play it! We can't decide for you.
Never look at the trombones. You'll only encourage them.
Richard Strauss

Offline franzliszt2

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1003
Re: Beethoven 3rd Piano Concerto: Cadenza?
«Reply #8 on: September 08, 2008, 03:56:37 PM »
This and the 4th are my 2 favourite Beethoven concerto's. I played the Beethoven cadenza. I think it is an amzing cadenza.