$1,000

[captainwafflos]

Hey guys!

I've been saving up money for a couple of months now and am planning on purchasing a digital piano in the near future. My budget is $1,000, but obviously the cheaper the better, as long as it isn't a significant compromise in the quality of the instrument.

What digital pianos in this price range have you guys have good experiences with? I've been looking at the Yamaha Arius YDP140 (https://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Yamaha-YDP140-Digital-Piano-?sku=703247), which is apparently the new version of the Yamaha YDP213. It looks really nice, but I can't find any reviews on the instrument.

Do you guys have any suggestions for this price range? Unfortunately, where I live there are no major music stores within 80 miles, so I don't have the luxury of going to test out various instruments, though if it comes to that I may just have to drive a really long way to do so

Thanks!

[allthumbs]

If I were you, I'd spend the money on a used piano.

[captainwafflos]

I live in an apartment, so I really don't have enough space for a piano, unfortunately.

Aren't modern digital pianos roughly the same quality as upright pianos in terms of freedom of expression?

[richard black]

Aren't modern digital pianos roughly the same quality as upright pianos in terms of freedom of expression?

Not even slightly, in my experience. They have no artistic possibility at all. Given the choice of a top-of-the-range synthesizer (I've played a very recent, very expensive, Yamaha at a singer friend's house quite a few times) or a modest, 30-50-year-old upright in basically OK condition, I know which I would choose, every time.

[allthumbs]

See, what did I tell you.

I agree with richard and besides, an upright piano doesn' take up any more space than your couch.

allthumbs

[ganymed]

In my opinion. You will never learn to control a real upright piano if you learn to play on a digital one. It is like learning to ride a bike if you actually want to learn how to fly a plain. It doesnt make sense.


I was of the same opinion with a small budget of 1000 euro wanting to buy a digital one. Then my teacher said he doesnt really want to teach me If I dont get a real piano."Everything I will be teaching you is pointless without real piano". Rougly Quoting, this is what he said.

[captainwafflos]

Hahah -- well, you guys have me a little scared now. I'm just going to wait until I can make it back to Atlanta at the end of September to check out some of their digital pianos. I hope I can find something within my budget that fits my needs -- I don't really have the space in my apartment for an upright either, unfortunately.

I gave a few Yamaha digital pianos a listen and their tone was a bit too bright and lively for my taste, though maybe it was just what was being played. I know the piano I linked has two different piano voices -- I'm not sure if one is noticeably brighter than the other.

I'm mostly interested in playing Scriabin, Ravel, and Debussy, so I'd prefer something with a little more depth and sustain response. We'll see ...

If you guys have anymore advice, it'd be much appreciated. Thanks!

[richard black]

I don't really have the space in my apartment for an upright either, unfortunately

Frankly, even there a keyboard doesn't have much to offer - my big Ibach upright has a footprint only about 4 inches deeper, and I suppose 4-6 inches wider, than a mid-range Clavinova, though of course it's taller and helluva heavier. If you have a stage-type keyboard on a folding stand then yes, you're saving a lot of space. Keyboards have their place (in former centuries people used silent keyboards) but I do really regard them as a desperation measure for those completely unable to house or use (for reasons of neighbours!) a real piano.

[Bob]

You might want to keep saving up.  I thought pro keyboard where two to three grand. 

But definitely actually play on one before you buy it.  Since they're mass produced and aren't wood, I would be ok with trying the same model and getting another unit shipped.  Wood pianos though are all different. 

[captainwafflos]

Unfortunately, spending more than $1,300 at the maximum isn't really an option -- after this I'll be saving up for moving into a new apartment next year. I'm a poor college student taking a semester off to save up for some necessities (laptop, piano). If the piano dimension of this isn't perfect, I'll just have to deal. I've been using a 61-key Yamaha keyboard for the past two years and, while the instrument sounds good to my ears (better, in fact, than some digital pianos I've played on, for whatever reason), the 61 key limit is constricting when attempting to play Romantic/20th century repertoire.

A digital piano is still probably my best option -- I intend to be living in an apartment for probably the next five years of my life, at least, and as such would like something fairly small and with adjustable volume. My school has a number of practice rooms I can use in the event that I absolutely require the expressive qualities of an acoustic instrument. The main concern is having an instrument that feels reasonably similar to a real piano (in terms of action and size, especially) and that has a rich sound and a fairly realistic sustain capacity.

[healdie]

i am going to contradict what people have been saying here
but i too don't have the money to invest in a real upright plus in my house no room downstairs, so i have a yamaha clavinova and yes i do relish every opotunity to play a real upright but unfortunatly i can't own one

but it has a full range of 88 wieghted keys so you should still have the full range and it hopefully won't comprimise your technique too much obviously it dosn't feel like a real piano but it is a good alternitive

i despise electric keyboards because of there light keys and the fact the are not touch sensitive but a good digital should make do i will consider getting a real upright when i am considerably better and have the money and space

so i would reccomend one again do try it before you buy to make sure it has features like weighted keys and so on (plus you can play with the volume down and us headphones for those sneaky 2:00 am practices without waking up the parents )

[lostinidlewonder]

I don't know if any of you have tried to get an upright acoustic piano up a flight of stairs in an apartment building. It is an incredibly annoying and expensive process. Also living in apartments you can't go playing an acoustic at any time you like, where with a digital you can easily plug in headphones and play any time you like. Also I have found that good headphones make digital pianos sound 100 times better, the speakers attached to the digitals are usually horrible in my opinion.

I always look at the instruments polyphony, this yamaha has only 64-note polyphony which is very low. This means it can only allow 64 notes to sound at the same time. This can have a damaging effect on pieces which cause long strings of notes to be sustained, you certainly will lose quality. However most people who play piano are not at an advanced enough level to have 64 note polyphony restriction to cause them any distress. Even if you are however, a digital piano can allow you still to intelligently practice your fingering and memorize your notes. Sure you will not learn the finer control of the piano, but it certainly is better than playing on an out of tune bad action acoustic piano.

[captainwafflos]

lostinidlewonder:

Forgive me for my ignorance -- maybe I'm not fully understanding the concept of polyphony -- but in what instance would I actually need more than 64-note polyphony? I can't imagine any piece that would require more than 64 notes to be sounding at the same time. Unless you're implying that the piano voice on these keyboard requires more than one "note" of polyphony -- I could certainly seeing a limitation of 16 or 32 being problematic. Even in playing an octatonic scale across the entire length of the piano, you would only be hitting 58 notes. Is my thinking flawed here?

I'm currently using a keyboard limited to only 32 note polyphony. I've only experienced occasional problems with this, though I admittedly plan on working on more difficult material on this new piano ...

There are some 80 and 128-note polyphony digital pianos available in my price range, so if it ends up being a make or break issue, I'll pick up one of those instead.

I'll be checking out everything Guitar Center has at the end of September -- I'll give you guys an update around that time.

[lostinidlewonder]

.... in what instance would I actually need more than 64-note polyphony? I can't imagine any piece that would require more than 64 notes to be sounding at the same time. Unless you're implying that the piano voice on these keyboard requires more than one "note" of polyphony

I find that as you have long sustained notes over a flourish of other notes, the long notes can deteriorate much faster because of polyphony restriction of the digital. You don't necessarily have to play 64 unique tones, but simply 64 notes after you have sustained, which isn't too difficult to come across in pieces.

If you play one note and hold it down, listen to how it decays. Now do the same thing but this time hold the sustain pedal and play a flourish of other notes, you will notice how the rate of decay of the one sustained note has increased. Sometimes it can be so abrupt that it cuts a note completely off after you have sustained too many notes.

Holding the pedal down for too long is a bad habit I have found many people who only play digital pianos have when they play acoustic. Often digital pianos will decay notes if you hold the sustain pedal too long, thus we can be lazy and hold the pedal down for too long and not learn the nuisances of pedal technique. I have found digital pianos with greater polyphony deal with sustained notes better.

[scottmcc]

If you're willing to increase your budget some, the Roland pianos are really fabulous in my opinion.  I tried a bunch of expensive uprights and grands out before I bought mine, and found that you can actually get a really good sound out of a new digital, comparable to that of a pretty expensive acoustic instrument (at least to my ear).  the other thing you should look at is the action of the piano--some of the newer instruments actually have weighted keys, instead of just springs, and so they feel very similar to a good acoustic, without needing to be tuned.

I think a lot of the argument about digital vs acoustic hinges on how good your ear is and what demands you're making of your instrument.  for me, my ear is relatively sensitive to wrong notes, especially out-of-tune notes, so I really didn't want something that would be out of tune.  and since I've no aspirations of playing music for money, a nice digital seemed to fit exactly.  would I like a really expensive grand someday?  yes, but to get one that is worth it, I could get a new car.

but don't trust me, I'm a base amateur at best.     have fun at guitar center, and go to a piano store as well where you can compare digital vs upright vs grand side by side.  see what you think.  it's your instrument after all.

[captainwafflos]

lostinidlewonder:

Thanks for the clarification -- I could see that being an issue.

scottmcc:

Any particular model you'd recommend? I might end up saving a bit more for a more expensive piano after all -- we'll see!

[scottmcc]

I think they changed all the model numbers after I bought mine, which is an RP101...but try out several Rolands.  the difference in features is relatively minor if you want the truth, at least for my purposes.  I had hoped to keep it under $1000, and ended up spending nearly twice that, but I'm very happy with my purchase.

[lhorwinkle]

I've been saving up money for a couple of months now and am planning on purchasing a digital piano in the near future. My budget is $1,000...

Save a little more.  At $1000, you don't get much in a DP.  At $1500, things start to get good. You mentioned the YDP140, which has the GHS keyboard. I didn't like it. The YDP160 has the GHE keyboard, which is much better.

Frankly, if possible, save up some more and get a Roland HP-203 for $2000, or a Yamaha CLP-340 for $2500. Both sound MUCH better then either YDP model, and the keyboards are MUCH better, too.

If those are out of reach for you, then fall back to the YDP160.

Others here have said that a decent upright would be better than a DP.  That's quite true.

But what kind of upright can you get for $1000 (or even $2000).  Where I live, you get junk, PURE JUNK.  YMMV.

[timothy42b]

But what kind of upright can you get for $1000 (or even $2000).  Where I live, you get junk, PURE JUNK.  YMMV.

That is true in my area as well.  Not only will you end up with junk, you will have a constant outlay of more money to have it tuned and regulated, and at that price range it may  not be completely tunable.  Plus you'll need to pay to have it moved up your stairs, I've done that job for friends too many times and I won't help anymore. 

I think that at the 1000 level and the 2000 level you get more quality out of a digital.  Up around 5000 I'd buy an acoustic for sure.  Though if I lived in an apartment I'd think twice even about that.  Maybe buy a 4000 acoustic and a 1000 digital, because you still have the neighbor problem, and no acoustic really solves that.

Sure, everybody will tell you about the incredible deals out there, 9 foot grand for $150 at an estate sale, etc., and they're even true.  Some people do win the lottery, also.  But most of the time you get what you pay for, and a $1000 acoustic usually isn't worth what a $1000 digital would be.   

[Petter]

As an option to buying a digital:
https://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Audiophile2496.html
130 $ for a soundcard to run Ivory without latency in real time.
https://www.ilio.com/synthogy/ivory/index.htm
400 $ (with ilock key) Ivory piano samples with standalone function.
https://www.kraftmusic.com/catalog/keyboards/weightedactionkeyboards/6130 Crappy keyboard but cheap and with weighted keys for 600 dollar.

You also need a decent computer to handle it with at least 2 gig ram. I don´t know about Macintosh but I think the Imac has a sound card and memory capacity to handle it.
You may end up at a little more then 1000 dollars but If you want a digital this is what I consider the best and and cheapest option, otherwise I agree with everyone else and buy an upright.

[quantum]

I'm mostly interested in playing Scriabin, Ravel, and Debussy, so I'd prefer something with a little more depth and sustain response. We'll see ...

You should definitely be thinking about polyphony if you want to play those composers.  There is a lot of pedaling in such music, and it all ads up in polyphony - remember notes held with pedal and not with fingers count too. 

You may also wish to look at models with fractional pedaling.  The lower end ones only have on/off for pedal.  On an accoustic pedal is much more than on/off - there is a huge world of sound between the two states.  Some higher end models incorporate this into their designs. 

[johnswanson]

I just went through all the posts and just thought.. if there is a answer for the question: what is the best under 1000 dollars digital piano? I would like to give Yamaha p140 a vote in terms of sound and touch.

captainwafflos, in your perticular case, I thought ydp140 could be too heave and p140 can be used as a portable keyboard in your school life.

For sound, the yamaha p140 has key-off samples that bypass ydp140 as well.

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